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Buying a horse from CANTER - Planning, Logistics and Budget?

Off Course
#41

Hhhmm, I never said what my budget was or that I only had time/money for one horse. But maybe you’re just talking generally? I have three currently - well, two horses and a pony. You are right though - I am “older” and a re-rider, and that certainly plays into the equation. My age and certain physical limitations may prevent me from ever really getting the point where I can ride like I once did - who knows. But if I thought in those terms, I’d never get off the couch and try. And I’d obviously never buy a totally unsuitable horse for my actual riding ability - I’m simply not that delusional.

And speaking to the re-rider aspect, as I do think that is a valid point and presents some unique challenges for me specifically (like fitness). I feel there is a difference in say someone who took a few lessons as a child, then picked riding back up in their late thirties versus me, who has ridden for more than 35 years collectively and then picks it back up.

Only time will tell if I can get back to where I was at one time. If I can’t get to a point where I am a good, balanced, confident rider, there will be no purchase of additional riding horses (CANTER or otherwise), and then I’ve simply gained some information to add to my equine library in my head. I’ll probably just keep some horses that need a good forever home as pasture ornaments to love and dote on and find a way to accept that.

And at the risk of being supper annoying, I will point out, again, that I am not “shopping” for a CANTER horse or any other horse right now. I was simply trying to learn about the process, the ups and downs, the good, the bad and the things I hadn’t thought about. :slight_smile:

2 Likes
#42

It might be worth talking to jleegriffith (Benchmark Sporthorses: http://www.benchmarksporthorses.com/) about her process. She’s quite good at spotting athletic types with good potential as sporthorses. She tends to look more for eventing types but as far as someone who knows what she’s looking for at the track, she’s proven very good at it.

I highly recommend buying from someone who knows how to pick a horse and who has done the basic let down/restart work for you. I fostered for CANTER NE several times and always enjoyed it. In fact, I kept one of my fosters and he turned into a fabulous hunt horse.

However, it’s hard to know what you’re going to end up with. Not just from a soundness perspective, but also aptitude. I had a very fancy mare that I restarted who was hands down, the worst jumper I’ve ever sat on. Not a horse you want to be jumping over solid xc fences! And it took my current OTTB (who I have now owned for 14 years) a good two years to convince him that every ride in company wasn’t a race :).

If you have a particular discipline you want to pursue you are much better off looking at horses that you can actually ride and test to see if they will do what you want. They can still be green, but you’ll get a much better idea of whether they are suitable. The first OTTB I bought off a training farm in NJ. They let me “ride” him but that meant throwing a saddle on him and trotting him up and down the aisle! Much better to watch someone ride and then get the chance to test drive them yourself.

Good luck with your search! I’ve loved my OTTBs (but I have to admit, that my most recent horse is a draft x, bought specifically because I’m too old to be retraining those TBs myself anymore.)

1 Like
#43

Sorry your mare didn’t work out at XC. I agree it is a crap shoot - much more for someone like me who wants to jump. Now, it doesn’t have to win a Hunter over fences class, but have the mind for it and enjoy it. And you’re not going to know for a while, until flat work, balance, and temperament are all in hand.

My current horse in an American Warmblood (1/4 Clyde X 3/4 Thoroughbred). He has the thoroughbred mind (would do anything for me and really tries hard), the Clyde temperament (sssoooo laid back, goofy, like a 17.2 hand puppy) and a mix of the body traits. Love him to death and wish I could get another just like him, as in a sibling. But his sire Brendan is sadly deceased.

Thanks for the encouraging words. :slight_smile:

#44

You can stop getting so defensive.

we don’t know these things unless you tell us. You talk about replacing one 27 year old horse, talk about having MS and taking time off, having a family and kids, and somehow we are supposed to intuit that you are fully dedicated to riding and have been riding the whole time. Then you say you haven’t bought a horse since 1998 and are “getting back into riding.” If you can’t see why this picture is confusing, well…

a person who rode for 20 years and takes 10 years off isn’t much further ahead than someone who rode for 1 year and took 1 year off. Either way, you’re not riding fit and you haven’t been using those skills for some period of time.

my post was general (sorry, you’re not the only person here on this board) it sounds to me like you’re someone looking for a talented horse for a “deal” and I was commenting that they are not, generally, a good deal.

1 Like
#45

Soloudinhere you are consistent if nothing else.

4 Likes
#46

There is a web site that specifically listed faults/problems and how to spot them and I think it was centered on TBs.
It pointed out dropped hips, and viewing a horse from behind down the spine. Sorry I can’t remember it.

#47

Don’t know if this is it @Chall , but I found it very informative. And I’m thinking much of it is useful info, regardless of the horses’ previous job.

https://thehorsesback.com/ex-racehorse-problems/

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#48

I feel like she is telling you the things as they come up, and you are interpreting that as defensive.

5 Likes
#49

Maybe the OP wants to enjoy the process. I rode for 20 years and took 8 off. Still got an OTTB. Not everyone who rides wants to do the big shows and buying off the track doesn’t mean they can’t afford a more expensive horse. Some of us enjoy the process. And sorry, I definitely was not the equivalent to someone who rode a year and took a year off as I got back into riding shape. I was out of riding shape, not out of shape.

7 Likes
#50

Bingo, that’s it

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#51

And I wasn’t referring to you personally, either. “You’re not riding fit and haven’t been using those skills for some period of time.” To which you apparently disagree by stating “I was out of riding shape.”

There’s lots of people who want to “enjoy the process” but still post endless threads about how difficult their OTTB is to feed/shoe/ride/keep sound. I was speaking to that point. There’s lots of nice horses out there, for cheap, that don’t have issues inherent to their breeding and prior careers that make them expensive to own. I was commenting on that because “enjoying the process” has gone pretty badly for a lot of people for every one person you hear about who got a miracle horse for $1000.

#52

Good to know after over 15 years on these boards, I’ve made an impression.

Hope to see you around in 13 more years.

#53

I’m just curios (now that I have leaned that racehorses don’t get started by lunging), how are they they started? Are they simply ponied around an oval at first, then ponied with tack on, then with a rider up, then just graduate to being on their own? I’d assume since they aren’t lunged, it would make sense that they aren’t worked as babies in a round pen either. Is it the same for steeplechasers?

I boarded my pony at a local farm for a time that bred & raised thoroughbreds for the steeplechase. And come to think of it, there was no round pen or arena there. But there was this odd (to me) oval shaped pen, like maybe 100’ long with an oval inside railing as well - like a miniature race track. I often wondered what it was for, but never asked.

And speaking of steeplechasers, are there businesses (like CANTER) out there that find new jobs for them as well, or is it just not big enough of a sport in this country to warrant that? I was fortunate to have grown up in an area that had steeplechasing, as not all areas do. And although public horse race tracks are illegal here, steeplechasing is not - which I always thought was odd.

#54

My newest horse is 1/2 Clyde/1/2 TB. Her personality is amazing and she is a fun, smart ride. I never thought I’d want to move on from OTTBs, but she fell into my lap and is perfect. I stil love my 20 year old OTTB but at 58, no longer want to start them in the hunt field any more.

1 Like
#55

Depends on the farm and trainer and what facilities they have. I know of some race breeding farms that start their youngsters and have round pens, and it looks very standard/traditional. Some will get the babies walking/trotting, steering and stopping under saddle then kick them out for a few more months until they’re solidly two. Then they might get ponied at the track, then with the rider, then ridden independently in small groups. Some places us separate training tracks/facilities. People who work out of places like Fair Hill may hack them out to improve their balance and fitness. There was recently a thread on the racing forum about two year olds, where a couple people piped up about their standard approach to starting the babies.

2 Likes
#56

Out of the 3 Ottb mares I bought at the track, 2 already knew how to lunge and 1 was a total newbie to it but caught on quite rapidly. So I guess it depends on the farms / trainers.

One thing is for sure when you buy a horse off the track, you just don’t know if the horse will be what you want it to be. In my case, I was at the point in my riding “career” where I didn’t want/need to compete (I used to event) anymore, so I figured the horse and I would be doing whatever the horse enjoyed and was good at.

I’m not an expert in Ottbs, but I did go through CANTER for mine, so here’s my experience:

  • I looked at CANTER listings, picked out a few that I liked, called CANTER and made an appointment.
  • met the CANTER volunteer at the track and we went to see the horses I had noticed. While walking around, we met trainers and the volunteer would announce what I was looking for: a mare, around 16h or less, no injury, sound. And all of a sudden I had lots of horses to look at!
  • with one horse I was lucky enough to watch her being breezed.
  • another horse was trotted in hand in front of me so that I could see she was sound.
  • I asked the trainers some quick questions about the horse’s past history, possible injuries, quirks, etc. (Don’t bother to ask them if they think the horse can do X Y or Z. Be prepared to have some trainers try to push a horse on you “Look at this big mare! She can do anything you want her to!” - big mare in question had a knee that was double the size of the other… lol)
  • I didn’t do a PPE on any of my horses. In one case the mare was retired due to a knee chip, but was sound, and I asked for her X-rays to be forwarded to me after I bought her, which they were.

My current Ottb is 20, I bought her when she was 4. We’ve had our ups and downs but considering that 1) I didn’t have a PPE done on her 2) I don’t work consistently with a trainer and 3) I have become more of a “casual” rider, I think we are doing awesome! We enjoy lessons and clinics, hunter paces, trail riding, xc schools etc.

I didn’t spend much more on vet / shoeing / training etc. than I would have with any other horse. My current mare had a full set of xrays done of her lower legs at one time, when she was about 10 yo, and the vet thought she would not be sound for long…well, she is still sound at 20 yo. The only “special” thing we do with her is shoe her with full pads in front.

I also didn’t give my Ottbs “let down time” but put them to work right away. These horses LIKE to work and if they are managed correctly (a set routine, lots of turnout time etc) they aren’t any more problematic than any other horses. JME and I may have been lucky but I know a lot of other “lucky” owners of Ottbs :slight_smile:

It sounds like you are going into this eyes wide open, so good luck to you and I hope you find a horse to your liking!

1 Like
#57

Thanks @sophie - great info and story. I am also in the “casual” riding group and really like variety in my riding. I’v been most fortunate in selections over the years to have both a pony and two horses that were eager, willing and flexible as well to do pretty much whatever I wanted to try… fox hunting, show hunter, dressage, cross country, trail rides. And should there be another riding horse in my future, I hope he/she will be the same.

#58

I’ve bought quite a few OTTBs, a couple were listed on CANTER.

I think the buying at auction comparison someone made is apt. You don’t have as much time or information to make the decision. You see the horse walk and jog for a minute or two, you can ask questions but often the trainers won’t really know the history (they just claimed it last month or something). And the horse isn’t what it will be once let down, so it’s hard to get a sense of what their temperament or abilities will be.

It’s not impossible to get a true sport horse vetting but it’s hard–trainers want it done ASAP, and sport horse vets are often reluctant to come to the track. Most of the time I’ve ended up getting something very cursory with the track vet b/c the trainer didn’t want to wait 10 days for my vet of choice.

I’ve bought a couple really awesome ones, a couple that just didn’t want to play. One who was explosively dangerous and mean for about 5 years before coming around. Some in between.

I’d do it again, but I’ll admit I bought my latest 3 months off the track from a reseller. I got to watch riders of different levels on him, school him xc, have a normal sport horse vetting. I just wasn’t sure I had the energy to take that risk again right now.

2 Likes
#59

To anyone who is interested in looking at horses posted by CANTER (& I know the OP is just curious as to how it all works and isn’t buying anytime soon), I’d HIGHLY suggest going with a CANTER volunteer.

I covered the track for years and took more listings than I can remember so I’m very familiar with the backside. I got to know most of the trainers and had a great relationship with them - they respected me and what we were doing back there. Now if they saw a potential buyer show up on their own they just launched themselves on that person. Telling them they had the soundest horses at the track, blah blah blah. Well the second they saw me they were like oh hey hi. Basically they were like sharks going in for the kill. So just be careful and go with a volunteer - they can act as a buffer of sorts and explain everything going on back there.

I’d still be volunteering but unfortunately the track we covered closed - I do miss it down there though despite what goes on!

4 Likes
#60

Great advice. Especially for folks going to a track that’s not local. Makes a lot of sense.

1 Like

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