Can anyone analyze this Hannoverian pedigree for me, please?

[Tasker]

And I had a Wendekreis granddaughter who had wind issues and so did her daughter by Idocus. This is not a game of one upsmanship on who knows more about bloodlines/specific ancestors. The comment from Mr. Hector jumped out at me as I had a horse with that problem - so I was sensitized to it. Who knows if it is genetic? But I kept neither mare or daughter for other reasons.

FWIW Reggazoni is one of my all time favorites standing in this country and I have wanted to breed to him for eons…I certainly wouldn’t presume to say that HE has an issue! If it was of concern - I would speak to his owner, not nose about on the BB insinuating he had a problem!

HAF - no need to apologize. Really. We’re all trying to share knowledge and at the end of the day (or the beginning before my coffee kicks in), I should stay far away from the BB as I am very tired too. I’m sorry I snapped at you. I hope things improve for you and yours.

[vineyridge]

another bit of ancient history–Waidmannsdank is from the superlative mare family from Waldrun/Walburga. That mare family has produced more than a few German TB stallions used in sport horse breeding for generations of the mareline. It’s still active in racing.

[Lord_Helpus]

From the viewpoint of an amateur WB pedigree person, I think of the W line(s) as being dressage horses. Same with “R” line horses.

Obviously there are exceptions, but right now I am looking for a jumper stallion and, if I see a stallion with a “W” name, I tend to skip over that horse.

By the same token, the “C” line horses tend to be predominantly jumpers. As do the “A” line horses.

If people what to come up with horses who do not follow my general inclinations, I will certainly not disagree with them. These are just my observations, being a newbie to the topic.

[rodawn]

[QUOTE=Tasker;6181563]
And I had a Wendekreis granddaughter who had wind issues and so did her daughter by Idocus. This is not a game of one upsmanship on who knows more about bloodlines/specific ancestors. The comment from Mr. Hector jumped out at me as I had a horse with that problem - so I was sensitized to it. Who knows if it is genetic? But I kept neither mare or daughter for other reasons.

FWIW Reggazoni is one of my all time favorites standing in this country and I have wanted to breed to him for eons…I certainly wouldn’t presume to say that HE has an issue! If it was of concern - I would speak to his owner, not nose about on the BB insinuating he had a problem!

HAF - no need to apologize. Really. We’re all trying to share knowledge and at the end of the day (or the beginning before my coffee kicks in), I should stay far away from the BB as I am very tired too. I’m sorry I snapped at you. I hope things improve for you and yours.[/QUOTE]

Tasker - no-one is one-upping… or at least, I wasn’t. All I said was “look at the individual horse”. Some crossings weeded out the breathing difficulties. If someone wants to breed to a W, look at the individual horse and his foals and see if it’s there.

[not_again]

In genetics, you can suppress a trait, not not eliminate it. It can come back to express itself in future generations.
Certain tb lines are known to carry the tendency to have a retained testicle. That trait is not always expressed in every male in a generation, but it can reappear in future ones.
The only way to eliminate it is to not breed it.

[rodawn]

Question: Because of the process of meiosis, is it true that not every single sperm cell ( or egg cell ) would carry the gene? Therefore, it would be possible for certain of the lineage to just not carry the gene. Enquiring minds …

[rodawn]

Anne, doesn’t the process of meiosis allow for the presence of the gene that causes roaring to be nonexistent in some offspring, suppressed in others, or expressed in still others? Is it not true that the chromosomes in meiosis recombine which in effect shuffles the genes around so it produces a different genetic combination in each sperm cell (gamete) and thus meiosis creates 4 genetically unique haploid cells? Wendekreis had kids with roaring, but I am personally not sure if Werther carried the gene or not - maybe someone else can share their personal experience. What I know for sure is my gelding was sired by Widukind (by Werther) who did not have it, my gelding didn’t nor did his full brother or sister or any of his sister’s offspring.

The Making of the Modern Warmblood, book mentioned by Tasker is a wonderful book.

[Tasker]

rodawn - as I said in the first post - it might have been Werther. It could also have been Wendekreis or Watzmann or Wenzel…I’m digging through my copy to find the section w/ the comment. (should have stuck a post it on the page!!!) Dagnabit!

[Tasker]

AH-HA! Found it!!!

Page 445 (Wenzel)
"When I first took part in the Hanoverian Study Group in 1989, I had just come from Sweden, where stallions who bred horses with wind problems were banished to the riding school no matter how famous they were. I questioned the Hanoverian authorities as to why they were not excluding stallions who produced roarers, and was told that the condition was not hereditary. At this time, about half the horses in the Verden Elite Auction came with the note ‘has been hobdayed.’ "

It goes on to say that the problem was eradicated, etc.

Sorry for all the drama and not finding the reference before posting.

[vineyridge]

Roaring in TBs is definitely heritable. Hobday’s surgery does much the same as tieback surgery, in case anyone doesn’t know. I just looked it up.

Sir Frederick Hobday invented and described this procedure in the early part of the twentieth century. In it, the laryngeal ventricles and vocal cord are removed in order to allow the subsequent scarring to stabilise the area and prevent the vibrations from making the noise. It effectively reduces and even removes the noise, but does not always completely resolve exercise tolerance. For more severe cases, a laryngeal tie-back in combination with a Hobday’s procedure provides a more reliable means to restore full exercise tolerance.