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Cat people ... switching from dry to canned ... how much?

The Menagerie
#1

Disclaimer: DH and I are not really cat people, but we were adopted by a scruffy little tabby kitten about 2.5 years ago. She is now 3 and rules the roost. :winkgrin:

I’d like to switch her to canned; my understanding is that canned food is supposed to be better for them in terms of keeping them better hydrated, and the correlation between dry food and dental health is sketchy at best.

She’s currently on Natural Balance Salmon and Green Pea kibble, and she’s doing well on it. Weight is good (right about 9.5-10 lbs.), coat is lovely, soft and shiny. She gets fed free choice, which works for her right now, though I understand that may not always be the case, nor is it the case for all cats.

Concerns: She has a sensitive digestive system–we had an awful time with diarrhea when she first moved in, and we had her on a prescription diet for a few months before switching her to a limited-ingredient diet whose ingredients were similar to those of the prescription food. She has never been super excited about her kibble and has occasionally done the hunger strike thing, but she loves her dried salmon treats.

Does anyone have any suggestions for brands? I was planning to go with the canned formula of her current dry food, thinking that would be least disruptive to her digestive system. But if there are other (better) options out there, I’d love to know …

And how much should I expect to feed her every day? I’m reading 1 oz. per pound of body weight (Fromm site), which would put her at about 9.5 oz. of food a day, split into two feedings. But then the NB site has a slightly lower amount, 6 oz. per 8 lbs. body weight. I know it’ll take a bit of fiddling around, but it’d be nice to have a good idea of what she needs initially.

Thanks. :slight_smile:

#2

The key is to read ingredients.

For example, “turkey meal” and “turkey” are two VERY different things. It’s all about ingredient quality - “meat and bone meal” is basically ground up crap - anything from hooves to ear tags to styrofoam to roadkill. Lovely, right? Why would want your pet to be eating that?
When the ingredients say turkey, turkey broth, beef, etc, it means it’s actual, good quality MEAT that’s going into your pet’s food. Also, beware of unnecessary fillers like flax, wheat, corn, and fruits/veggies. The fruits and veggies aren’t terrible, but the point is what your cat needs is meat - and if there’s a ton of filler in the food then that means less actual meat/protein for your cat.

EVO, Before Grain, Wellness are good brands of cat food. :slight_smile:

#3

I love Wellness - grain free, and a huge variety, especially if you order online. But, you could very likely get a few different types locally and start adding it in while you reduce the kibble.

Generally speaking, you’re talking about 5.5oz a day for the average cat - the medium sized cans. Some feed 2 of the small cans a day for closer to 6oz. That’s at least a starting point and as you said, you wiggle up or down according to the individual’s response.

The big cans - 12-13-ish oz - are usually more economical. The difference is you’ll be feeding cold food for a few meals with just 1 cat. You can get around that by submerging it, in a baggie or something, in warm water for a few minutes. Resist the urge to nuke it :slight_smile: Mine don’t have any issue with cold food but some do.

#4

Particularly for male cats, canned cat food has an additional benefit: There’s a fair bit of consensus that (the vast majority) of dry cat food is too high-carb and it leads to diabetes. (Male cats seem more prone than female cats, but it still can be an issue.)

I can’t say for sure that the SOURCE of carbs is an issue – there are claims out there that wheat is particularly bad for cats’ digestive systems, but I haven’t seen what those claims are based on.

If you want to go the “off the shelf” route, Fancy Feast Classic is a way to go. For sensitive stomach, there may be a Purina or Science Diet brand that’s formulated for that.

It also may be that lamb/rice combos of one of the better brands may be worth a try – that’s generally what’s recommended for sensitive stomach dogs…

Sorry I can’t provide a definitive answer – just more food for thought. :wink:

#5

I like Before Grain canned, and so do my cats. As JB says, one 5.5 oz can per day is a good place to start for your average cat.

I’ve also confirmed with the Before Grain people that the large 13 oz cans labeled for dogs are nutritionally complete for cats. If you’re looking to warm up refrigerated food, you can also add hot water to it. I always add additional water to the food anyway.

#6

if she likes her salmon treats, find a food with salmon in it.

Maybe you can entice her to try the wet by taking up the kibble in the evening and put a bit of the canned food out in the morning.

Or mix the kibble in with it.

However, I have to tell you, with three cats of my own, every one of them has their own desires and preferences.

One will not touch canned food. She’s rather starve! She will readily accept her share of your chicken biscuit though, which translated to roughly a paddy of her own. Or the turkey lunch meat - no beef, just poultry!

While the big cans are more economical, I’d go with the small cans for now. Nothing economical about throwing spoiled pet food out.

#7

simple way to tell: look up how many kcal per unit are in the food you’re feeding now, and in the food you’re planning to feed, and calculate how much of the new food you need to feed.
Don’t go by the feeding directions on the container, they are usually extremely generous (aka fat kitty + buy more food).
Most foods nowadays will tell you how many kcal per kg and/or per cup of dry, and most canned foods will tell you how many kcal per kg and/or per can. If it’s not listed on the package, check the manufacturer’s website.

#8

You know, if she’s currently doing well on the dry diet, I’d continue to offer it free-choice & simply add in 1/3 to 1/2 can of canned food from the same manufacturer once a day & see how that goes.

Not all cats are gluttons, & unless you see becoming obviously overweight, this combination may work very well for you. It does for my guys & always has.

#9

First, get rid of the all day feast. Start putting smaller portions of her dry down for 30 minutes at a time and then make any leftovers go bye bye until the next meal. If you can swing that 4 times a day for a while and then get down to 3 and then 2, it would be perfect.

Since she’s had food sensitivity, I would start with the canned version of what she’s already eating and either replace one of her other meals with it or soak the dry and mix them half and half.

I don’t feed much canned and zero kibble so I don’t know the calorie conversion but I really like BG and some flavors of Weruva because they are grain (and veggie) free and have limited ingredients. When you are ready to dry a different brand, I would suggest those.

Did you mean “by-products”? Meal is a concentrated version of protein that is not ideal to see on the label, but it’s worlds better than chicken/turkey/wombat, brown rice, white rice and a bunch of fruits and vegetables that override whatever the meat was supposed to contribute.

#10

meat meal = meat byproducts = bone meal = crap

Same same.

Read:
http://www.naturalnews.com/012647.html
http://www.rawfedcats.org/toxic.htm

The good brands will have turkey, chicken, chicken broth, etc., but no mention of “meal” or “byproducts”.

Case in point:
http://www.merrickpetcare.com/store/detail.php?c=114&s=20481

First 2 ingredients, beef and beef broth. No filler, no grain, no veggies or weird fruits (why does my cat need blueberries or green peas…?? wtf??), just good quality protein and vitamins/minerals.

My cats get a variety, and they love it. I am lucky - they’re not picky eaters, they’ll eat meat that’s still half frozen, cold wet food, canned mackerel (Evanger’s), anything. I feed EVO, Wellness, Before Grain and Tiki Cat. :yes:

#11

No. A named “meal” and by-products are not the same. Chicken meal is dehydrated chicken meat and by-products are whatever else they could legally throw into the mix and still call it chicken. Meal is simply chicken meat condensed to something like triple the protein. A little goes a long way so it’s not a bad thing to see on the label, if all else is good.

Three brands you named as being “good” on this thread (EVO, Wellness and Merrick), all use some amount of meal and get 5 stars for dog food. No one seems to give a crap about cats so there is no current, educated food analyzer. :lol: It’s basically the same, though.

http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/wet/5-star/

#12

Thanks, this is what I remembered from my college animal nutrition classes. I really like Fromm’s chicken/salmon formula, but it’s spendy. I think we will go with the salmon/green pea canned food, which is the kibble she’s eating now and doing fine on, and if that goes well we may try another brand.

She has had canned before (Wellness, turkey/salmon) and much prefers it to kibble, but she got a bit chubby with both, so I would definitely have to stop the free-choice kibble if I were to add in canned. I did add warm water to the canned as well to make a slurry; I started doing this after she got quite sick with what the vet thought was a virus. I kept it up for a while after she got well, but I stopped because it wasn’t as convenient as kibble for the pet sitter, and my cat really does not like strangers, so my goal was for the pet sitter to get in and out as quickly as possible so kitty wouldn’t get too stressed out. :stuck_out_tongue:

Thanks for the info everyone … I will pick up some 5.5-ounce cans of the NB tomorrow and see how that goes. :slight_smile:

#13

The rule of thumb is 20-30 calories a day per pound of cat. Most 5.5 oz cans are between 150-200 calories per can, so a 10-lb cat (a cat that SHOULD weigh 10 pounds) would need 1-1 1/2 cans a day depending on activity level.

While muscle meat should be a main ingredient, meat meal or meat by-products aren’t as bad as some would have you believe. There are no ear tags, styrofoam, or road kill in commercial cat food; it’s not legal. When a cat kills and eats prey, it doesn’t just eat the muscle meat. The muscle meat makes up a lot of what they eat, but cats also eat organs, fur, ears, butts, bones…what we call by-products because WE don’t eat them.

Natural Balance makes limited ingredient canned foods, which asre a good choice. Merrick’s, both Before Grain and their other kinds, are too. Wellness is excellent though things like sweet potato, peas, cranberries, etc. are completely uncessary as cats are obligate carnivores. The only grains/fruits/veggies they normally eat are what’s in the stomach of the mouse they just ate. They may chew grass, but do not need any for nutrition.

#14

Well, I wouldn’t feed anything with by-products but I would consider meal from a listed meat source.

Pet foods are supplemented based on the protein source. Chicken (i.e.) is supposed to only be the boneless portions and by-products could be anything from the head and feet to organs. Those are things I feed my pets now but it’s calculated to compliment the meat, not replace it. All those vitamins and minerals in a can of food were created to supplement the boneless meat. Adding in other things without considering the percentage throws off the nutrition.

A cat eating the “by-products” of their prey it not comparable to having it willy nilly in a can. Prey is generally 80% meat, 10% bone and 10% organs. Cats aren’t likely to eat 2 heads, 1 leg, 3 livers and no heart in one sitting, and they certainly wouldn’t do well on that mixed up diet long term.

#15

I was pointing out that some meat meal or by-products are not harmful by any means. And some people-like me-feed foods that contain them because they are less expensive. Not everyone can afford over a dollar a can per cat per day, and there are many less expensive brands that contain by-products or meal that provide a decent diet for the average cat owner to feed. Many cats most certainly do do well on less-expensive canned foods long-term.

The cheapest, crappiest grain-free canned food in the world is better than the most expensive, premium dry for 99% of cats. Obviously, we’d all like to feed the best we can afford, but lower-quality canned foods still have to meet certain nutritional standards in order to be labeled as a complete diet. Perfect, no, but certainly not harmful. Many cats-including many, many of the diabetics from the feline diabetes forum I frequent-are fed Fancy Feast or Friskies and those cats do very well…as do mine. It would be nice to have the budget to feed them all Before Grain every day, but to meet the caloric needs of my three cats, it would cost about $6 a day. Must be nice to have that kind of money, but the reality is, lots of people don’t, and a blanket statement that all by-products are bad could scare many people with a lower budget back to dry food which is cheaper and terrible for cats. The cheaper low-carb caned foods are a better option than dry.

The canned foods that people need to avoid are the ones with gravy or sauce as those are generally very high in carbohydrates.

#16

Man, where are you shopping?! I feed my four BG and it’s $1 per day per cat.

#17

I’m the first to say cats shouldn’t be eating kibble and agree there are some good, cheap canned alternatives but I’m not going to pretend by-products are a good thing. Better than corn, yes, but at least the amount of corn is listed on the label. One can containing by-products might be all heads with beaks and the next might be all liver. Or you could buy a case that was manufactured at the same time that contains nothing but feet in the by-product slot. Great for the joints but it doesn’t have much nutritional value. The most important part, though, is that the supplements are calculated for the the actual meat and not the by-products.

You mentioned the by-products of natural prey as if it has any correlation to what humans throw in the mix. Every mouse has roughly the same amount of meat, bones and organs. If there was an excess or missing piece of that puzzle for long, the nutrition would be way off.

[QUOTE=Simkie;6092093]
Man, where are you shopping?! I feed my four BG and it’s $1 per day per cat.[/QUOTE]

My cats are only getting the occasional snack of canned but I’m fostering a dog that eats exactly 2 oz of food (by weight) twice a day. I use BG, Weruva and occasionally ToTW. The BG and Weruva cost around $2.20 a can and I end up with 5 meals for her and a 1.5 +/- ounce snack for my dog. Based on 5 two ounce feedings, that’s 22 cents an ounce or $3.30 a day for 3 cats that eat 2.5 ounces each meal. Even with my loose and overestimated pricing, it’s $1.10 a day per cat. I’d be curious to see what Fancy Feast costs.

#18

Just looked on Amazon and here are two of the grain-free versions of Fancy Feast. I can’t guarantee Amazon listed the correct ingredients but they are different so, I’m assuming, not generic.

Tender Liver and Chicken Feast for 20 cents an ounce. Ingredient list:

Meat By-products, Animal Liver, Sufficient Water For Processing, Chicken, Poultry By-products, Guar Gum, Potassium Chloride, Tricalcium Phosphate, Salt, Taurine, Vitamin Supplements (E, A, D3, B12), Thiamin Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Natural Flavor, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement (Vitamin B2), Cobalt Carbonate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Source of Vitamin K Activity), Folic Acid, Potassium Iodide, Biotin.

Chopped Grill Feast, also for 20 cents per ounce. Ingredient list:

Meat By-products, Poultry, Poultry By-products, Natural and Artificial Flavors, Guar Gum, Sodium Tripolyphosphate, Potassium Chloride, Salt, Taurine, Iron Oxide, Vitamin Supplements (E, A, D3, B12), Sodium Nitrite (to Promote Color Retention), Thiamin Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement (Vitamin B2), Cobalt Carbonate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Source of Vitamin K Activity), Folic Acid, Potassium Iodide, Biotin.

What, exactly, is in those foods and is it worth the 10 cent savings per day?

#19

For inexpensive but good canned Chicken soup for the cat lovers soul is 79 cents for the 5.5 cans and Trader Joes sells a turkey canned food that is 59 cents a can. Both do have a bit of rice but it is down the ingredient line and neither has any by-products or meat meals.

#20

It’s a cat, keep it simple.

They do just fine on dry cat food. Get her a bag of Purina cat chow. If you’d like to give her a bit of wet cat food, fine, but it’s not necessary.

When was the last time you saw a cat skeleton in a house. If a cat is hungry, they’ll eat whatever cat food is in their bowl.

Lots of clean water, fresh food and attention…anything else is for your benefit, she doesn’t need it.

Don’t add water to dry cat or dog food. If she’s thirsty, she’ll drink.

Just keep it simple and don’t worry about spending a fortune on “All Natural, Organic etc.” crap being sold.

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