Child safe tick collar or repellent?

[Mozart]

My farm is under siege from ticks at the moment. I know this won’t last, it usually involves 2 or 3 weeks of tick hell in spring (late spring here) then things subside.

However, for the last few days I have been pulling upwards of 10 ticks a day off my dogs. Just found one on me.

In my pre-child days I had tick collars on my dogs, once we had kids I became too concerned about the chemicals as my children smother the dogs with hugs. And one of the dogs is frequently on son’s bed.

The sheer volume of ticks is now making me nervous about Lyme disease.

Is there any sort of tick deterrent that is human safe? Don’t want to have to choose between my kids and my dogs…

[comingback]

I don’t have any suggestions, but when I first read the title of the thread I though you were looking for a collar to put on your child.

Clearly I don’t have kids

[Mozart]

[QUOTE=comingback;7003608]
I don’t have any suggestions, but when I first read the title of the thread I though you were looking for a collar to put on your child.

Clearly I don’t have kids :D[/QUOTE]

Well, I have frequently considered a SHOCK COLLAR for one of them, but not a tick collar. However, if the ticks continue at this rate we may all be wearing tick collars soon!

[wendy]

don’t know about the collars, but we’ve had so many ticks I’m considering treating my dogs with antibiotics for two weeks just in case they picked up lyme- I really don’t see how they could have escaped it, with the onslaught we’ve had this year. I use k9 advantix that seems to kill the critters but not “repel” them.

[candysgirl]

I’d use Revolution on the dogs. It dries in a couple of hours. I have 3 poodles who are outside a lot in tick infested areas. None of them ever have ticks attached.

Revolution does fleas, ticks and heartworm prevention in one go. You do have to get it from your vet because of the HW prevention aspect, but it works very well.

Advantix is another one that can be effective, but some dogs are sensitive to it. You can get it OTC at PetSmart now.

I have not had success with Frontline recently. I’m a groomer and have seen a LOT of clients with fleas and ticks who have been using Frontline these past two years.

I wouldn’t consider these “kid safe” when wet, but they dry and absorb into the dogs’ skin in a couple of hours (so put it on the dogs before you go run errands with the kids) and lasts a month.

[java]

There are no non toxic tick repellants, advantix contains permethrin. I would not use permethrin on myself or expose my kids to this chemical I am not sure why anyone would want to put it on their dog. Revolution will not repel ticks but it will kill them eventually. I prefer to use revolution and just do a tick check and remove any ticks I see. I think the toxic chemicals are worse than the slight chance the dog may become sick from lyme disease as dogs are not nearly as likely to become ill from this infection as people are.

[chisamba]

Permethrin is used on humans to eradicate parasites such as head lice or mites responsible for scabies and as a pest-repellent clothing treatment. The common prescription is a 5% concentration of Permethrin for scabies and a 1% concentration for the over-the-counter (OTC) treatment for head lice or crabs. Pharmaceutical grade permethrin 99% is differentiated from pesticide grade 94% by a higher purity. it is relatively safe as it is ot easily absorbed by the skin, and easily and rapidly broken down. that said if you are constantly overexposed you can have side effects.

[Alagirl]

[QUOTE=chisamba;7009834]
Permethrin is used on humans to eradicate parasites such as head lice or mites responsible for scabies and as a pest-repellent clothing treatment. The common prescription is a 5% concentration of Permethrin for scabies and a 1% concentration for the over-the-counter (OTC) treatment for head lice or crabs. Pharmaceutical grade permethrin 99% is differentiated from pesticide grade 94% by a higher purity. it is relatively safe as it is ot easily absorbed by the skin, and easily and rapidly broken down. that said if you are constantly overexposed you can have side effects.[/QUOTE]

Toss up: Tick born diseases vs short term chemical exposure…

It’s cats who react violently to the compound…

[Hippolyta]

I have seen herbal collars at my food coop. They are minty smelling. Not sure if they are effective.

[DoubleClick]

I am not usually one to promote products, but I have used Bug-off garlic with much success the last three summers. In fact, we were out in the woods recently and found multiple ticks on multiple dogs. The only dog that seemed relatively tick free (found one climbing on the outside of her fur) was my dog, who is on Bug-off. She had no other flea/tick repellant on, while the other dogs were wearing Frontline. In the three years that I’ve used this product, I have found no ticks on my dogs, and we do working trials with them in Wisconsin, which can be tick heaven.

I don’t have any real scientific evidence about the efficacy of this product, only anecdotal, but it has worked on my dogs and others. You could use it in conjunction with a topical/collar since they take it orally.

Anyways, just thought I’d throw it out there as a suggestion since I’ve had such success!

http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/bug-off-garlic-dogs/34

[vtdobes]

[QUOTE=wendy;7003640]
don’t know about the collars, but we’ve had so many ticks I’m considering treating my dogs with antibiotics for two weeks just in case they picked up lyme- [/QUOTE]

This would be absolutely pointless…a two week treatment will not do a thing. Eight weeks is a minimum effective treatment for Lyme.

[Mozart]

[QUOTE=DoubleClick;7012483]
I am not usually one to promote products, but I have used Bug-off garlic with much success the last three summers. In fact, we were out in the woods recently and found multiple ticks on multiple dogs. The only dog that seemed relatively tick free (found one climbing on the outside of her fur) was my dog, who is on Bug-off. She had no other flea/tick repellant on, while the other dogs were wearing Frontline. In the three years that I’ve used this product, I have found no ticks on my dogs, and we do working trials with them in Wisconsin, which can be tick heaven.

I don’t have any real scientific evidence about the efficacy of this product, only anecdotal, but it has worked on my dogs and others. You could use it in conjunction with a topical/collar since they take it orally.

Anyways, just thought I’d throw it out there as a suggestion since I’ve had such success!

http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/bug-off-garlic-dogs/34[/QUOTE]

Well now that is interesting. Where do you buy it? If it helps with mosquitoes as well that would be a big bonus. The tick population has gone down somewhat (for some reason we get a big wave of them for maybe 2 weeks, then they die down).

Will also talk to vet about Revolution. We are scheduled to get our heartworm meds soon anyway.

Thanks all, for you input.

[vtdobes]

[QUOTE=Mozart;7014025]
Well now that is interesting. Where do you buy it? If it helps with mosquitoes as well that would be a big bonus. The tick population has gone down somewhat (for some reason we get a big wave of them for maybe 2 weeks, then they die down).

Will also talk to vet about Revolution. We are scheduled to get our heartworm meds soon anyway.

Thanks all, for you input.[/QUOTE]

The other poster included a link to the company that sells the Bug Off Garlic (Springtime). I’ve been using it for several years. So far this year I found two ticks on one of my dogs.

[Mozart]

[QUOTE=vtdobes;7014043]
The other poster included a link to the company that sells the Bug Off Garlic (Springtime). I’ve been using it for several years. So far this year I found two ticks on one of my dogs.[/QUOTE]

I am in Canada and they do ship to Canada but it adds considerably to the cost and there is no guarantee it won’t be stopped at the border so gov’t can also charge tax and duty.

I am nearish to the US border and lots of people here have things shipped to a destination across the border then go drive and pick it up. I have never done that before but there are now US businesses that for a fee will accept mail order packages and hold them for Canadians to drive across the border to pick up. May actually start doing that.

[wendy]

garlic is toxic to dogs. You should never feed them garlic. Ever.
http://www.petpoisonhelpline.com/poison/garlic/

this is what the Preventic tick collar says about kids:

•If your dog loses the Collar at sometime, you need to find it and properly dispose of it to make sure it is not accidentally ingested.
•If your dog ingests part of it, consult your veterinarian.
•It is safe for your kids to be around your dog with this collar on. The only thing that you need to be careful of is that they aren’t having prolonged exposure to the collar like using the dogs neck as a pillow or holding onto the tick collar instead of the dogs regular collar. Should they inadvertently have prolonged exposure, they need to be sure to wash their hands thoroughly with soap and water.

I’m wary about using these collars because they are supposed to be very toxic if ingested, and I don’t know about your dogs, but my dogs play a lot by biting at each other’s necks. So there would be constant oral-collar contact. Plus the dog would have to wear a tight collar all of the time, which I suspect is uncomfortable.

[Canaqua]

I’ve been using Advantix II on my dogs, it seems to be the only thing that works on fleas and ticks here this year.

I keep the dogs away from kids until the spots where I put it are completely dry…I’ve found the easiest way to do this is treat the dogs right before I go to bed and then bring the dogs in to sleep with me. It is usually dry in the morning, before any kids are running around looking to pet dogs.

[vtdobes]

[QUOTE=wendy;7016400]
garlic is toxic to dogs. You should never feed them garlic. Ever. [/QUOTE]

I would much rather feed my dog garlic from Springtime than poison them with topicals or collars!

http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/bug-off-garlic-chewables-dogs

Bug Off Garlic™ is Safe for Dogs
A Japanese study* proves that garlic toxicity is almost impossible to reach.

garlic clovesDose - 1/2 lb (equal to about 78 cloves) per 100 lbs body weight is the amount force-fed to study dogs each day for seven straight days. (3 1/2 lbs total equal to 546 raw cloves per 100 lbs bodyweight)

Result - Microscopic examination of subject dogs’ blood showed oxidative damage to a small percentage of red blood cells. No dog was anemic. No dog was reported to show sickness, weakness, or other negative signs. Researchers guessed that continued feeding would eventually cause anemia.

*Lee, K.W., Yamato, O., Tajima, M., Kuraoka, M., Omae, S., Meade,Y. "Hematologic changes associated with the appearance of eccentrocytes after intragastric administration of garlic extracts to dogs."American Journal of Veterinary Research. November 2000. Vol. 61, No. 11, 1446-1450.

• Springtime, Inc. is not affiliated in any way, shape, or form with the researchers or publishers of this study.

Dennis Hampt, Owner/President of Springtime since 1979Conclusion - In my opinion, it is extremely unlikely that any dog would ever voluntarily eat the amount of raw garlic necessary to reach the minimum toxic dose. Most natural veterinarians who recommend feeding raw garlic stay well under 10% of that amount.

Bug Off Garlic air-dried powder is virtually impossible to overfeed. Raw garlic contains about eight times the amount of allicin (oxidative compound)** found in air-dried garlic powder. Increasing the dose eight times means you’d have to feed more than 4 lbs of Bug Off Garlic per 100 lbs of body weight per day. Normal usage is less than 1% of that amount. Bug Off Garlic is absolutely safe for everyday, year round use.

Dennis Hampt, Owner/President of Springtime since 1979.

**Pearson, Wendy. “Garlic (Allium Sativum) for Horses: In Vitro Antibacterial Activity and In Vivo Toxicity.” Professor M.I. Lindinger. University of Guelph, 2003.
Toxicity is Dose Dependent

A central concept of toxicology is that effects are dose-dependent; even water can lead to water intoxication when taken in large enough doses, whereas for even a very toxic substance such as snake venom there is a dose below which there is no detectable toxic effect.

“Toxicity.” Wikipedia.1 December 2009 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxicity
Household Products That Can Be Toxic to Pets:
Household Products That Can Be Toxic to Pets
Garlic book
Garlic: The Science and Therapeutic Application of Allium sativum L. and Related Species Second Ed.

Edited By:

Heinrich P. Koch, Ph.D., M.Pharm.
Professor of Pharmaceutical Chemistry and Biopharmaceutics, University of Vienna, Vienna, Austria

Larry D. Lawson, Ph.D.
Research Scientist, Murdock Madaus Schwabe Group, Springvale, Utah

Published By:

Williams & Wilkens, Baltimore, Maryland, 1996.
garlic cloves
Garlic Studies
Insecticidal and Repellent Effects

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Bhuyan, M., Saxena, B.N., and Rao, K.M. (1974) Repellent properties of iol fraction of garlic. Allium sativum Linn. Indian J. Exp. Bio. 12:575-576.

Sakai, I. (1992b) Allicin-containing pesticide for golf course greens. Japan. Patent 92 05 211. Chem. Abst. 116 (1992) 168 344.

Weisler, R. (1989) Systemic insect repellent composition comprising vitamin B1 and allyl sulfide. U.S.A. Patent 4 876 090. Chem. Abst. 112

Population Studies - Low cancer rates associated with regular garlic consumption.

Dorant, E., van den Brandt. P.A., and Goldbohm, R.A. (1994b) A prospective cohort study on Allium vegetable consumption, garlic supplement use, and the risk of lung carcinoma in the Netherlands. Cancer Res. 54:6148-6153.

Yang, C.S., Wang, Z.Y., and Hong, J.Y., (1994b) Inhibition of tumorigenesis by chemicals from garlic and tea. In: Advances in experimental medicine and biology: diet and cancer: markers, prevention, and treatment. M.M. Jacobs, ed. Plenum, New York, pp. 113-122. Chem. Abst. 122 (1995) 22 889.

Caldwell, D.R. and Danzer, C.J. (1988) Effects of allyl sulfides on the growth of predominant gut anaerobes. Curr. Microbiol. 16:237-241. Chem. Abst. 108 (1988) 146 953.

Abdullah, T.H., Kandil, O., Elkadi, A., and Carter, J. (1988) Garlic revisited: therapeutic for the major diseases of our times? J. Nat. Med. Assoc. 80:439-445. Chem. Abst. 109 (1988) 21 973. Int. Pharm. Abst. 26 (1989) 2286.

Immune Stimulant Effects of Garlic: Animal and In Vitro Studies

Nakata, T. (1973) Effects of fresh garlic extract on tumor growth. Nippon Eiseigaku Zasshi (Jap. J. Hyg.) 27:538-543. Chem. Abst. 79 (1973) 111 680 (Japanese).

Nakata, T., and Fujiwara, M. (1975) Adjuvent action of garlic sugar solu-tion in animals immunized with Ehrlich ascites tumor cells attenuated with allicin. Gann 66:417-419.

Weisberger, A.S., and Pensky, J. (1957) Tumor-inhibiting effects derived from an active principle of garlic (Allium sativum). Science 126:1112-1114.

Effect of garlic on tumors in mice and rats

Kametani, T., Fukumoto, K., and Umezawa, O. (1959) Studies on anticancer agents. I. Synthesis of various alkyl thiosulfinates and tumor-inhibiting effect. Yakugaku Kenkyu (Jap. J. Pharm. Chem.) 31:60-74. Chem. Abst. 54 (1960) 11 018 (Japanese).

Hirsch, A.F., Piantadosi, C., and Irvin, J.L. (1965) Potential anticancer agents. II. The synthesis of some nitrogen mustard containing sulfones and thiosulfinates. J. Med. Chem. 8:10-14. Chem. Abst. 62 (1965) 5215.

Zhou, J., Qi, R., and Zhang, M. (1988) Growth suppression of human leukemic cells in vitro by garlicin (ethyl ethanethiosulfinate). Shandong Yike Daxue Xuebao 26:43-47. Chem. Abst. 110 (1989)

Cheng, H.H. and Tung, T.C. (1981) Effect of allithiamine on sarcoma-180 tumor growth in mice. Taiwan I Hsuch Hui Tsa Chih 80:385-393. Chem. Abst. 95 (1981) 197 366 (Chinese).

Di Paolo, J.A. and Carruthers, C. (1960) The effect of allicin from garlic on tumor growth. Cancer Res. 20:431-434. Chem. Abst. 55 (1961) 3844.

Kimura, Y. and Yamamoto, K. (1964) Cytological effect of chemicals on tumors: influence of crude extracts from garlic and some related species on MTK-sarcoma III. Gann 55:325-329. Chem. Abst. 63 (1965) 1089.

Fujiwara, M. and Natata, T. (1967) Induction of tumor immunity with tumor cells treated with extract of garlic (Allium sativum). Nature 216:83-84.

Aboul-Enein, A.M. (1986) Inhibition of tumor growth with possible immunity by Egyptian garlic extracts. Nahrung 30:161-169

Lau, B.H.S., Woolley, J.L., Marsh, C.L., Barker, G.R., Koobs, D.H., and Torrey, R.R. (1986a) Superiority of intralesional immunotherapy with Corynebacterium parvum and Allium sativum in control of murine transitional cell carcinoma. J. Urol. 136:701-705.

Antioxidant Effects

Jacob, R., Isensee, H., Rietz, B., Makdessi, S., and Sweiden, H. (1993a) Cardioprotection by dietary interventions in animal experiments: effect of garlic and various dietary oils under the conditions of experimental infarction. Pharm. Pharmacol. Lett. 3:124-127. Chem. Abst. 123. (1994) 162 425.

Torok, B., Belagyi, J., Rietz, B., and Jacob, R. (1994) Effectiveness of garlic on the radical activity in radical generating systems.

Antidote for Heavy Metal Poisoning and Other Toxins

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Cha, C.W. (1987) A study on the effect of garlic to the heavy metal poisoning of rats. J. Korean Med. Sci. 2:213-223. Chem. Abst. 109 (1988) 18 322.
garlic

*These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.
Garlic Chemistry Varies: Raw Garlic Cloves Vs. Air-Dried Garlic Granules
Many natural veterinarians choose Bug Off Garlic™ for absolute safety, healthy benefits, and greatest insect repellent properties.
Spot-On Flea & Tick Toxicity:
75,000 Adverse Reactions Reported (Millions Probably Unreported)
National Pet Poison Hotline Report Incidents at 800-858-7378

Are You Poisoning Your Pet? How to tell if your pet has been poisoned

Symptoms of poisoning by flea/tick treatments may
include salivating, dilated pupils, tremors, vomiting,
hiding, shivering, convulsions, and skin irritation.

What to do if your pet has been poisoned

If you suspect your pet may have suffered negative
health effects as a result of a flea product,
consult with your veterinarian immediately.
Be sure to report all such incidents to the
EPA’s National Pesticide Telecommunications Network
at 800-858-7378.
“Spot-On” Flea & Tick Products Alleged to Cause Serious Harm to Dogs and Cats
– Pet Pharmaceutical Industry Under Fire
in Multiple New Jersey Class Action Lawsuits –

NEWARK, N.J., Dec. 8, 2011 /PRNewswire via COMTEX/ — There is a growing sense of moral outrage and alarming statistics from consumers and pet advocates alike after over 75,000 complaints about the products have been reported to the EPA and nothing has been done to change the advertising, marketing or labeling of the products to alert pet owners of the possible serious side-effects. What’s chilling is that those numbers only reflect what has been reported, the actual number of incidents may be much, much higher.

[wendy]

and yet you get reports of dogs suffering poisoning from garlic fairly often:

ate some dumplings-

J Am Anim Hosp Assoc. 2005 Jan-Feb;41(1):68-73.

Heinz body hemolytic anemia with eccentrocytosis from ingestion of Chinese chive (Allium tuberosum) and garlic (Allium sativum) in a dog.

Yamato O, Kasai E, Katsura T, Takahashi S, Shiota T, Tajima M, Yamasaki M, Maede Y.

Source

Laboratory of Internal Medicine, Department of Veterinary Clinical Sciences, Graduate School of Veterinary Medicine, Hokkaido University, Kita-ku, Sapporo, Japan.

Abstract

A 4-year-old, intact male miniature schnauzer was presented with anorexia. The dog had ingested some Chinese steamed dumplings 2 days before, which contained Chinese chive (Allium tuberosum) and garlic (Allium sativum). Hematological examinations revealed severe Heinz body hemolytic anemia with eccentrocytosis and an increased concentration of methemoglobin, which was thought to result from oxidative damage to erythrocytes by constituents in these Allium plants. In this case, eccentrocytosis was a hallmark finding and could be detected easily, suggesting that this hematological abnormality is useful in diagnosing Allium plant-induced hemolysis.

PMID: 15634869

ate some baked garlic-

J Vet Med Sci. 2010 Apr;72(4):515-8. Epub 2009 Dec 16.

Hypertension after ingestion of baked garlic (Allium sativum) in a dog.

Kang MH, Park HM.

Source

BK21 Basic & Diagnostic Veterinary Specialist Program for Animal Diseases and Department of Veterinary Internal Medicine, College of Veterinary Medicine, Konkuk University, South Korea.

Abstract

A 6-year-old, intact male Schnauzer was referred 2-days after accidental ingestion of baked garlic. Regenerative anemia (Hematocrit 22%) and the elevated methemoglobin (8.7%) concentration were detected upon hematological examination. Eccentrocytes, Heinz bodies and ruptured red blood cells were also noted on blood smear films, which were the results from the oxidative injury of the Allium species. The dog was hypertension (systolic mean 182 mmHg) concurrent with other clinical signs, such as vomiting and dark brown urination. Treatment with continuous oxygen, antioxidant drugs and antihypertensive therapy resulted in good progress. The dog was discharged 4 days after hospitalization. There were no remarkable findings in the follow up hematologic examination 24 days after discharge, but the dog still had a high blood pressure and continued on antihypertensive therapy. No recurrence was noted and the blood pressure returned to normal levels 4 months later.

PMID: 20009420 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

and it’s not just consumption of a large amount of garlic at once that is of concern- consuming small amounts over time, such as in a herbal preparation, can cause a build-up of damage to the point the dog becomes symptomatic.

Garlic in people is a different story- we can digest it. It’s not toxic to us. It may be beneficial in many ways for people. But not dogs.

[Canaqua]

I don’t feed garlic to dogs…the effect is cumulative. Dogs get into stuff and may accidentally get a bit of onion or garlic here or there, so I wouldn’t feed it to them purposefully and add to any potential accidental ingestion.

I don’t know, our healthy, 16 year old ACD mix has been treated with chemical/topical flea and tick stuff once a month for her entire life (we live in a semi-rural, heavily wooded area and deer ticks are EVERYWHERE). She has some arthritis, but that’s about it. I recently had bloodwork done to check her vital organ function, and it’s all normal. No cancer at this advanced age either, so I’m not losing any sleep over topical insecticides on dogs…seems lower risk to me than the rather extreme risk of Lyme disease in our area. People and dogs.