I’ve seen very old fences with concrete posts, which last forever, and never rot. Does anyone know a source for these? I want to use wood split rail fence with it.
These are the first three that came up on a Google search.
http://concretefence.com/superior-products/superior-rail/
Thanks, I’ve done the goggle search route. None of those are what I am looking for (they are all concrete fences). I’m hoping someone has experience with using these posts…
I do.
The issue with them is that they do break down, over time, and, if anything impacts them significantly, they crack, and you have rebar holding up rails- or not. A horse hitting the rails hard enough will fracture the posts. A horse hitting the concrete hard enough does very little for either the post, or the horse.
Installing them requires some logistics; you need a skid steer (minimum) to dig the post holes, and then, support them on a chain, and have a couple of people there to make sure that they get into the ground straight. They WILL crack, and they are not patchable- so, if you have one that is damaged, plan on bringing out the skid steer (again) to get them out of the ground.
The farms that I have known to use them make them, themselves. They have the molds, and they drop in the rebar, and fill with concrete. It makes a great winter project for farms who have a lot of help.
Locust posts are the way to go, IMHO, if you want post and rail. I would seriously consider post and slip boards, or post and oak boards, over the concrete, any day of the week.
Wow! ASB thank you so much! I’m concerned with rot because I’m building in a wet area, but it sounds like concrete is not the way to go for me…
the farm next to ours had concrete posts. Many ended up crooked–I’m guessing he didn’t go as deep as a standard post, so they got jacked around by the freeze/thaw cycles? Not sure, but it looked crappy. Quite a few cracked in our bitter cold winters, and it’s not as simple to replace them as a wood post is. The ones that did not crack sure lasted a long time, but in general the LO regretted them.
“Locust posts are the way to go, IMHO, if you want post and rail. I would seriously consider post and slip boards, or post and oak boards, over the concrete, any day of the week”
100% agree. I have pulled Locust post that were 30++ year old that had some rot below grade but were still plenty stout. We have both slip board on Locust and pressure treated pine post, nailed oak boards to pressure treated post and some very old split rail.
The pressure treated slip board pine post hold up well as far as rotting. But the slip-board posts have split in on some because of the holes drilled in it. Mostly where horses like to lean/scratch on them. Or the ones where we feed off the fence. Because the grain on Locust is tightly interwoven they rarely split.
I would suspect being able to find Locust post especially Slip board post maybe regional. Around here they cost $14±. Sourcing oak boards also. The spacing for slip-board is usually 9-10’.
What ever you use do not use Hemlock. Total crap for fence boards, at least the ones that are offered around here. They split easily, are like candy for horses, Just about anytime I jump the fence I get a splinter. I finished up one 300’ foot section in late season with slip board post. My supplier couldn’t get anymore 12’ oak boards so I had to go with Hemlock. HUGE expensive mistake.
A 2 horse paddock and just about all of the hemlock boards used in that section are trashed and needed to be replaced. The oak boards in the rest of the paddock that are 4 years older are fine and look great. I should have bought the standard 16’ oak for a few dollars more and cut them down.
This is a link to pictures of a slip-board section I put up a few years ago. There are also pictures of slip board on pressure treated and nailed oak board on pressure treated. Contrary to popular belief a well constructed wood fence made with proper fencing materials will last a long time, look good with minimal maintenance. I’ve never had any “safety” issues either.
I have acutally never heard of locust posts, not sure if you can even get those in Ontario, but I have seen this type of fencing in the States quite a bit. I had to google it since I’ve never heard of it! I do like the look and it sounds like it would be quite hardy.
I also agree with gumtree and highly, highly suggest not to use hemlock! It splinters, shatters when kicked, horses love to chew it and it lasts a year or two. Terrible stuff!
We use cedar posts (its all I’ve ever seen in our neck of the woods) and it holds up really well as cedar grows in swampy/wet areas. We’ve had fencing over 40 years old using the cedar and they are still just as good as they ever were (we use at least 5" posts, but try to use 6-8" for gate posts).
We then buy 16’ oak fencing for our rails and stagger them. It can warp a bit when it dries (we’ve had a few do this, but not too many), but its tough as nails, horses cant chew it, or pretty much even break it. Its very hardy, and looks great for many, many years.
We’ve had a few popped off over the years (but its our fault as we did not put electric on one side to keep them off the fence and we used a nail gun to put the boards on). Since then we’ve added a small electric strand in front of the fencing and pre drilled a hole in each board and put a screw to help hold the boards on. This has worked really well for us. But you must pre drill oak as its very hard, especially once its dried! We also waited for a year and then painted all of our fencing black.
Gumtree, Did you drive the locust posts or dig them?
Skip the cement posts. I worked at one farm with them and they were at the end of their lifespan. They were breaking and crumbling. They were a pain to replace and frankly dangerous depending on how they broke with that rebar.
Love the locust if you can find it.
[QUOTE=tobruk;8988300]
Gumtree, Did you drive the locust posts or dig them?[/QUOTE]
The posts in the picture is a short fence line that had old split rail. Split rail around here is set with 9’ spacing. So I just pulled the old posts set the new Locust in the same hole and pressed/pounded them in to the existing holes, but very tight holes with the bucket on my tractor. Works like charm posts are as tight as if they were pounded.
All posts, pressure treated pine or Locust on the other fencing, slip-board or nailed oak were pounded. By FAR the best way to set any posts. But it can be problematic where rocks are more of the norm than the exception.
The vast majority of posts in the Mid-Atlantic done by fencing contractors are pounded as a rule. I wouldn’t hire a fencing contractor that didn’t. I have built a fair amount of fencing over the years all drilled. TOTAL PITA and time consuming. Hard to get them real tight so they stay straight/plumb and line runs true when looking down it and stays that way for years.
Before the pounding method became the norm everything was drilled. But we used tapered posts, thicker at the bottom tapering up to the normal thickness at the top. So when hand tamped they held fast with less effort.
Our farm had some paddocks with cement posts. We have been here 16 yrs and I think they were put in at least 10-15 yrs before that. So far, they are indestructible.
That being said, they would not be my first choice either. Most of our pastures are fenced with cedar posts (pounded in) and oak boards.
We have a rather heavy clay soil, and the cedar posts do rot eventually at the ground line.
[QUOTE=dressagegirl123;8987926]
Wow! ASB thank you so much! I’m concerned with rot because I’m building in a wet area, but it sounds like concrete is not the way to go for me…[/QUOTE]
A tip from the swamp…
Get dry pressure treated posts. Paint the portion that will be below ground with Herculiner (pick-up truck bed-liner paint).
It’s expensive but the posts last much longer.
The posts must be dry!!!
Our locust posts don’t last that long. We have had to replace many that are less than 10 years old. I’m not sure why they rot below ground, since we are on a hill so stay pretty dry. I like the idea of painting the part that goes below ground.
Gumtree, your fence is beautiful. I wish our place had slip-board instead of post and rail. P & R looks good, but I don’t think it is as safe or secure. And we have to replace the rails pretty often, be they hardwood (which bows) or pine.
[QUOTE=kcmel;8991289]
Our locust posts don’t last that long. We have had to replace many that are less than 10 years old. I’m not sure why they rot below ground, since we are on a hill so stay pretty dry. I like the idea of painting the part that goes below ground.
Gumtree, your fence is beautiful. I wish our place had slip-board instead of post and rail. P & R looks good, but I don’t think it is as safe or secure. And we have to replace the rails pretty often, be they hardwood (which bows) or pine.[/QUOTE]
Thanks. When we bought this farm all of the fencing was very old split rail. But it did have a hot wire on top. We planned on replacing all of it so I removed the hot wire on everything. Replaced about 80% of the existing fencing when the financial melt down hit. Got screwed out of a LOT of money by some clients. The remaining old split rail still hasn’t been replaced and the horses have figured it out before I replaced the hot wire. LOL. Lesson learned.
When I was tearing down the old split rail fencing and there was a lot of it. I found the posts and rails were made from various types of wood. Pine, poplar, oak, etc. Post were pine, poplar, and some were pressure treated. Some of the post were creosoted below grade. Which is mostly banded in the mid-Atlantic now.
Very surprised you had issues with Locust posts. All of the locust post I pulled were in amazing condition below grade. The “soft wood” posts were basically tooth picks.
As others said the ends of split rails in our area tend to rot out. The oak rails were good considering their age. All of the old fencing was re-purposed for fire wood. The locust post burnt slow and hot. The holes in them gave an very nice aesthetic quality to the fire when staring at it.
OP the links to the pictures given is not considered, at least not in my neck of the woods “slit rail” nor slip board. In both types the ends to not “butt” inside the post “hole”. They overlap. Split rail ends are tapered and extend out on either side of the post. Slip board ends over lap at least 6 inches more is better.
Horses can do “play” with them and can slip them out. I am not sure how the ones pictured are kept in place. Especially if being used for butt rubbing.
The beautiy of slip board besides the look is the fact they “slip” have give if a horse uses for a butt scratched. They don’t pop nails. If a horse runs into it, leans on it they flex. No nail popping or breaking by and large. No mater what a wood post is made of and horse should run in to it it will break. The majority of the time with no harm to the horse.
I’m not so sure the same could be said with a cement post.
A quality wood fence will easily last 20+ years. Will a little bit of maintenance. If one is in the business of horses the cost of fencing can be depreciated over 7 years. All farms require maintenance. “Turn key” is a myth.
Synthetic fencing has its place. Especially in areas where oak is not easily had. Nor where horse farm fencing contractors are not the norm. Synthetic fending that has a tree fall on it does not spring back to its original look. Total PITA to fix. Verses just quickly replacing a couple of inexpensive boards.
Synthetic fencing is much more labor intensive and not an easy DIY for the average hobby farm owner.
Too each their own on this. IMO well made wood fencing has an aesthetic quality unmatched. It ages with “grace and style”. I don’t paint it. Paint it once and it will be an expensive maintenance hassle there after.
Be VERY cautious about using plastic posts. I have some that were put in about 15 years ago and they are fabulous so when I put in some interior fencing I decided to use them. The manufacturer had gone out of business so my fencing guy got me some from another manufacturer at a HUGE mark-up.
These things break off at ground level when the wind blows. Already had 5 bad posts at less than a year. Now I have 8 broken posts. I E-mailed fence guy and he said his did the same thing. I thought he would try to make it right since HE bought the posts. His solution was to ignore me. Would not even tell me where he bought them so I could contact the maker. He probably didn’t want me to know how much he had marked them up.
Anyway - do not spend a bunch of $$ on plastic posts without hitting them with a hammer to see if the crack and break. The first ones I bought are still going strong.
Be VERY cautious about using plastic posts. I have some that were put in about 15 years ago and they are fabulous so when I put in some interior fencing I decided to use them. The manufacturer had gone out of business so my fencing guy got me some from another manufacturer at a HUGE mark-up.
These things break off at ground level when the wind blows. Already had 5 bad posts at less than a year. Now I have 8 broken posts. I E-mailed fence guy and he said his did the same thing. I thought he would try to make it right since HE bought the posts. His solution was to ignore me. Would not even tell me where he bought them so I could contact the maker. He probably didn’t want me to know how much he had marked them up.
Anyway - do not spend a bunch of $$ on plastic posts without hitting them with a hammer to see if the crack and break. The first ones I bought are still going strong.
