Perfect Pony…
I actually have a LOVELY yearling Irish Draught-Connemara cross that is for sale. 
He is by Its the Luck of the Irish (by Flagmount King) out of MF Wake Up Little Susie… “Pretzel” is an effortless mover, has fantastic conformation and a loving and friendly temperament. I haven’t actively marketed him lately as I think he is going ot mature phenomenally and I was thinking of keeping him to back and start showing before remarketing…
Yep, there are probably a dozen “perfect” horses out there for me that are all weanlings and yearlings, and here I am 15 minutes outside San Francisco with nothing but stall board available around me, averaging around $600-$800 a month. And nothing to ride.
When I win the lottery I’ll buy myself a nice horse property and half a dozen of various ages. My goal right now is something that at the very least I can be sitting on next summer.
It really is amazing how hard it is to find a nice 15hh-ish horse with decent gaits and a decent jump that is actually going. Obviously once they are under saddle no one is selling them! I never in a million years thought I would ever consider importing one, but it’s crossed my mind. My friend in Ireland right now told me the over-sized Connemaras and crosses in IRE are all over and practically free.
[QUOTE=Perfect Pony;6378014]
My friend in Ireland right now told me the over-sized Connemaras and crosses in IRE are all over and practically free.[/QUOTE]
That’s interesting as it has never been my experience that the overheights are less pricy. Even with the down market that is one segment that is continuing to sell fairly well - especially the overheight geldings. There is a steady demand for them if not the very least in England then in other European countries.
A well bred and well conformed and good moving overheight gelding at 14.3-15.1 still goes for very decent money whether broken to ride or not.
According to the most recent article posted on the CPBS page sales are improving–and as WI said the market appears to be for ridden ponies. For me its not the price of the ponies themselves but the cost to import them (5-6k-last I knew-I think its slightly more from the EU?) that has been the main deterrent (at least for me). I’ve also not seen that “imported” is necessarily of greater quality/ability than what is currently available right here in NA.
As a small breeder I can say that its tough to find buyers for ponies two and under–the market still appears to be for Ridden Horses/Ponies and Purebred fillies. Once those ponies are approaching riding age they DO tend to sell very quickly.
What I have seen over and over is buyers starting out looking for partbreds and over-heights, then switching gears and deciding only a purebred pony will do. They start out looking for a riding horse then decide maybe they might want to breed a foal one day. At each turn in the road the options narrow just a little bit more.
PP, I agree that for the most part the Connemaras I’ve owned/bred have been “thinkers” and sometimes quite reserved around strangers. I’ve had others though that were extremely outgoing with exceptional work ethics and ride-ability/train-ability.
goodpony you are right, the nice, adult-sized ponies sell very, very fast as soon as they are started. And nice, over sized one can sell very fast for quite a bit of money. I recently inquired about one priced at 25k and he was sold, and sold in a couple weeks. If they move nice enough to score well at the lower levels, and they are big enough for an average woman rider, they are gone in moments.
Maybe my contact is wrong, but she’s over there in IRE now and has an awful lot of experience with Connemaras. She says you can get nice, larger ponies and crosses for very cheap, still cheaper than here including the import costs.
As you know I am now considering 2 year olds as I simply cannot find what I want. I am also considering something I swore I would NEVER do, which is by a horse sight unseen.
I have a 3 year old getting backed who is for sale. Lovely dressage type mover but too small for what you are looking for as he is 14hh.
Will keep my eyes open for you though 
I wonder if its just where I am located but I have had only a few inquiries on the 2 ponies I had/have listed for sale. One was a 5 year old that was very rideable and going nicely- just sold her after having her listed for over a year and have only had one person inquire about my 2 year old. Both were oversized (or will be , the 2 year old is not finished growing and may be smaller than her siblings that are 14.3/15 hands) but I really thought more people would be interested in the larger type Connemaras. I do not have them overpriced either, in fact , they are probably very realistically priced.
I do think location and more likely economy has something to do with it. I have been around long enough to say that the ponies–both purebred and partbred are not selling like they once did. A lot of breeders (especially here on the west coast) have either stopped breeding, reduced the numbers of mares they do breed each year, or retired from breeding entirely. I cant remember the exact numbers now but I think last year there were only 100 foals born(might actually have been less)—in a breed that has only 5000 individuals to start with thats not enough foals to even maintain the current population. And now with the whole HWWS I’m sure at least some buyers/breeders are exercising caution until a test becomes available.
Well, that does make me feel better, though I find it depressing for the breed in general.
Goodpony, you mention that purebreds slow down in their growth after they reach 2 years of age…what about part bred? My friend has a Thurman Clearheart /TB cross that is about 14. hands as a yearling and we are always speculating about her final height but dont know much about growth patterns of the crosses or purebreds either, lol.
A 14HH partbred yearling is likely to finish a good size (without seeing my guess would be small horse size (15.2 and over)). You will have a much better idea of how they will finish at the end of their two year old year (long two year olds). Keep in mind different lines mature differently—some grow very uniformly while others you want to hide behind the barn till they are ready to start!:eek:
My two Moxley Duncan yearlings are maturing very evenly and balanced… My 3 year old by Willows Landsdown Harbour Boy is just starting to look “normal” again lol! Going to be curious to see their final heights. The colt will be oversize I think and the filly will be lucky to hit 14hh!
Just chiming back in to say that I’m really enjoying reading all the posts, even as they wander from the original question. I’m beside-myself excited (while trying to keep in check in case things don’t work out) - there’s a good chance I’ll be able to get Silver Shadow semen imported, and possibly a straw or two from Westside Mirah II as well!!! EEEP! Fingers, toes and eyes are all very tightly crossed!
omg! please save me a straw of westside mirah for use on my wb mare!
we just dont have access to this kinds of lines here!
oh and congrats!!!
if folks want a decent estimate of final height - do a string test - measure from fetlock to point of elbow, then keeping your elbow place, bring the fetlock end straight up over the withers - that will tell you pretty closely what you will end up with.
also there have been studies that say all breeds mature at the same rate inside and that maturity doesn’t happen til 6 or 7 - no matter how mature they look outside.
sorry, eta: i think that part of the reason why some ponies may or may not sell is probably do to the type and kind of training on board - the price point and how athletic the pony is.
Unfortunately, Cons seem to be priced much higher than other breeds baring GRPs.
I am curious what prices our friend seeing in IRE and if she is considering FX rates and importation in the final price? a 2k pony will end up at 12k by the time you get it here - altho i will say that the choice is much better over there and i drool at many of the EU ponies and would LOVE to go on a shopping trip to Europe one day… i think the quality is in general better (ie they are bred for sport) and the quantity of course better … no offsense meant to any US breeder.
[QUOTE=Small Change;6380233]
Just chiming back in to say that I’m really enjoying reading all the posts, even as they wander from the original question. I’m beside-myself excited (while trying to keep in check in case things don’t work out) - there’s a good chance I’ll be able to get Silver Shadow semen imported, and possibly a straw or two from Westside Mirah II as well!!! EEEP! Fingers, toes and eyes are all very tightly crossed![/QUOTE]
You will have to let us know how that goes…fingers crossed for much success for you and your mare. What is her breeding?
[QUOTE=MuskokaLakesConnemaras;6380113]
My two Moxley Duncan yearlings are maturing very evenly and balanced… My 3 year old by Willows Landsdown Harbour Boy is just starting to look “normal” again lol! Going to be curious to see their final heights. The colt will be oversize I think and the filly will be lucky to hit 14hh![/QUOTE]
My Eclipse babies tend to mature very uniformly, even when bred to my Domo Cavallo Praize daughter (whose offspring are pretty notorious for not looking like much till they are 6-7).
I truthfully have not found the string test to be remotely accurate with the ponies-pony breds. But I also don’t think they reach their mature height at the same age or at the same speed as most warmbloods or tbs (face it folks–most ponies dont have the same wither definition/height that most WB or TBs have naturally). And then with continued ‘correct’ training/muscular development the wither does continue to come up as things shift around…which is not actually growth—but training. My seven year old has only just now begun to show a really well defined wither—and I will not be the least bit surprised if that definition/added height continues for a few more years.
When I bought my pony I looked at two barely 3 year old fillies, both by the same stallion, out of mares that were about the same size. The buckskin was smaller than the grey at that point, but I bought the buckskin. Now at 5 years old the buckskin that I bought is much taller and bigger bodied than the gray, who happens to now board at my barn. So size is a difficult thing to figure out.
I know my Hanoverian mare didn’t grow taller at all between 4 and 8 years old. I had a TB mare that was less than 16hh until she was 4 (when I sold her), I saw her at 6 at an event and she was huge, probably 16.2.
It seems to be regardless of breed, some shoot up at 3-4 years old, and some never do…
interesting re: string test - i have found it to be fairly accurate on every horse/pony i have ever tried it on. when i did it on Rebs it said he will be 15h - and he is getting close to that now…
Smallchange - i just got thru a 2 year search for a boy for my WB mare. i wanted at first to breed to a Con, but the ones I wanted to breed to were for one reason or other not a good fit for this year (frozen, etc)
I ended up going to a GRP and my mare was bred this week! Here is hoping you good luck in getting your girl in foal
I had my friend check the registration papers on his 2 horses that are full siblings to my 2 year old. ACPS records the 2 year old height and the height at transfer. Both of the siblings were 14.1 at 2 years of age, according to the paper work. Now the mare is 6 - and you can see that she is starting to mature and she is 15 hands and the gelding is 5 and 14.3 hands.I think this particular line is very slow to mature. I can see the wither development in the mare as she continues in her training.
My filly, on the other hand, is 13.2 hh at 2 years of age. Probably 13. 3 hh on the butt. Thats a big difference to me. She looks just like her sister did at 2- butt high, big head, no neck, etc, except she is shorter. For the record, I owned the sister when she was a 2 year old… so I am the one that measured her for her 2 year old height.
Anyway, just interesting how lines develop and the differences between individuals. I think I am going to do the string test tomorrow just to see where it falls, even though I have seen what Goodpony talks about in wither development.
Thanks Small Change, for letting the topic digress;)
rthonor - interesting about those ponies - what is the breeding on them? those results are what i would expect
re: string test - it is supposed to tell you the end height… and in general horses are proportionate when done growing using the measurement of a) ankle joint to point of elbow and that is generally the same as from b) point of elbow to wither (at mature height)
so when a horse is a youngster it will show you where they will end up - not where they are now.
in my experience it is fairly accurate… unless of course you have an animal that is either very long or short legged…
i do think that the Connemara rule of measuring at 2 for lifetime height is really really weird when everyone knows they keep growing for a few more years… it also tends to have breeders say that their stock will not mature above 14.2 when in fact it is pretty easy to tell that they will.
It would be interesting to know if the top height of 14.2 is from the FEI pony height requirements or some other criteria? and have Cons always tended to be bigger rather than smaller (ie the largest pony breed?)
it would be awesome if Cons did as Welsh do - have different books for differing heights and types.
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