converting race horse straight off the track to pleasure horse

[Acertainsmile]

[QUOTE=FineAlready;7004784]
Fair enough on the “claims” vs. “claiming” race thing. It’s a lazy shorthand I shouldn’t use.

And, honestly, I also provided kind and helpful advice at the beginning…but I am not going to sit by and smile when an owner like this sends a mare like this to a low end track and says she is then going to breed her.

By the way, if you don’t think you can tell a lot from the racing charts, you are wrong. There are also some videos of this mare from Arlington (one where she wins and one where she is third). In the one where she is third, she breaks from the starting gate and just basically runs sideways. It’s from three years ago, so probably not indicative of how she runs now, but her charts do contain a lot of comments about being erratic or green, even in later years. More of an observation than anything.[/QUOTE]

Believe me, I know what can show up in a chart (been a jock/trainer/owner/breeder for 30 yrs). However, it doesnt always show the clear picture. We own a TB that raced untill he was 11, ran 104 times and retired sound (he also made close to a million)…he ran where he could win when he got older, and yes, some of those were in claiming races. Some days he didn’t run good on paper, some days if the jock cracked him one to many times he ran eratic, but was he happy with what he was doing? Extremely!

My point is you can’t always tell that a horse is used up by a few races, or even by the comments. My horses first stake race and one of his early races, he tried to drop the rider behind the gate, wouldnt load and ran all over the track. He ended up beating Real Quiet that day.

[Pronzini]

[QUOTE=Acertainsmile;7005445]
Believe me, I know what can show up in a chart (been a jock/trainer/owner/breeder for 30 yrs). However, it doesnt always show the clear picture. We own a TB that raced untill he was 11, ran 104 times and retired sound (he also made close to a million)…he ran where he could win when he got older, and yes, some of those were in claiming races. Some days he didn’t run good on paper, some days if the jock cracked him one to many times he ran eratic, but was he happy with what he was doing? Extremely!

My point is you can’t always tell that a horse is used up by a few races, or even by the comments. My horses first stake race and one of his early races, he tried to drop the rider behind the gate, wouldnt load and ran all over the track. He ended up beating Real Quiet that day. :)[/QUOTE]

And non racetrackers should keep in mind what a chart is supposed to do. It’s a gambling tool particularly for trip handicappers. My only point in bringing up a chart before is that you can also determine DNFs - particularly catastrophic breakdowns- since the frequency vis a vis a certain venue is what a poster claimed didn’t exist. But it is imperfect: we had a horse in our barn years ago fall ass over tea kettles during a race. I watched on TV when it happened and I was convinced she broke her neck. She not only was fine but she ran 3 weeks later and won! She’s by Awesome Again and just had a Street Sense filly.

Some of the comments are really offputting. At the end of the day, we are talking about someone else’s horse. Anyone really think that calling someone stupid a few dozen times on the internet will make them say “You know you’re right - I am!”

[FineAlready]

Listen, what it comes down to is that I’m disappointed and sad that a horse that was sold out of a racing home by someone who clearly felt she was “finished” racing for whatever reason has now been tossed right back into racing, and at the lowest levels.

Her owner made one halfhearted attempt to start this horse over in a new career, and then jumped at the chance to try to make a quick buck or two off of her when her attempts to restart her as a pleasure horse didn’t immediately work out.

In my opinion, bottoming out at legitimate tracks and then going on to bottom out at the lower end/bush tracks before going on to pop out babies for someone who has no TB experience and doesn’t seem to like the mare very much is an example of being “used up” in the worst possible way. And this mare is only seven. Given a proper restart in a new job, she could have many, many, many productive years ahead of her in a job she would enjoy.

I guess what has rubbed me the wrong way is that this person posted on here asking for the most basic kind of help - essentially, she showed up with a clear lack of basic knowledge about TBs, particularly racing TBs - and people gave her good advice to help her restart this mare. Shortly thereafter, she reappeared to say “Pffft! That was too hard and someone showed up at my doorstep asking if they could race this mare at a Mother’s Day and Bucking Horse Sale Race, so I was like, ‘yeah, sure!’ and now maybe I’ll breed her too.”

At the end of the day, no one has to agree with me, but I maintain that this is a shame and an unfortunate situation for this mare. Is it the worst thing that has ever happened to a horse? No, certainly not. But could the people involved with her have done better by her? Yes, I think so.

Why do I feel so strongly about this one mare? I’m not entirely sure. Part of it probably has to do with the fact that she last raced at the same track my horse last raced at…so perhaps it is a bit of a “there but for the grace of God” situation. His life could have ended up so different than it is now, if even one person had made a less responsible decision for him. I’m glad all of his connections looked out for him along the way, even if all he ever won was just over $6,000 on a third place finish.

[CVPeg]

Totally agree about the charts. Have heard reviews on this board in the past of horses who didn’t run for a long time, so something must be wrong with them. When a horse may be owned by someone who only races sparingly, or there’s an ownership issue that isn’t resolved, litigation, someone’s license isn’t up to snuff, a turf runner who can’t find an appropriate dry course - you name it, there are reasons not obvious to those with the fast and loose interpretations.

Or reading the charts myself, races are so often wrongly interpreted. Even the DNFs may be misleading. A horse is injured after a race, and it doesn’t show up until after they’re back in the barn.

Drives me crazy seeing huge reliance on the charts. And how it makes all those non-horsey people experts. :rolleyes:

You never know what side of the stall the horse woke up on that day! :lol:

[hundredacres]

[QUOTE=Pronzini;7005496]
Some of the comments are really offputting. At the end of the day, we are talking about someone else’s horse. Anyone really think that calling someone stupid a few dozen times on the internet will make them say “You know you’re right - I am!”[/QUOTE]

Had she gone to a racing forum, perhaps she would have had a different response? There is always a risk for anyone who opens up online, to have detractors. I’ve had my own…it’s just the nature of the beast.

[Pronzini]

[QUOTE=hundredacres;7005799]
Had she gone to a racing forum, perhaps she would have had a different response? There is always a risk for anyone who opens up online, to have detractors. I’ve had my own…it’s just the nature of the beast.[/QUOTE]

Isn’t this a racing forum?

[hundredacres]

[QUOTE=Pronzini;7005804]
Isn’t this a racing forum?[/QUOTE]

Well, how embarrassing, I thought it was off course. But still, it’s open to all…and we’re all passionate - some speak up louder than others. If I want people to patronize me, I don’t go to a BB, I ask my family ;). I just think it’s part of the territory. But I do feel like I’m beating a dead horse like someone so eloquently mentioned earlier ;)…so I’ll back out of the conversation now.

[harvestmoon]

[QUOTE=Acertainsmile;7005445]
Believe me, I know what can show up in a chart (been a jock/trainer/owner/breeder for 30 yrs). However, it doesnt always show the clear picture. We own a TB that raced untill he was 11, ran 104 times and retired sound (he also made close to a million)…he ran where he could win when he got older, and yes, some of those were in claiming races. Some days he didn’t run good on paper, some days if the jock cracked him one to many times he ran eratic, but was he happy with what he was doing? Extremely!

My point is you can’t always tell that a horse is used up by a few races, or even by the comments. My horses first stake race and one of his early races, he tried to drop the rider behind the gate, wouldnt load and ran all over the track. He ended up beating Real Quiet that day. :)[/QUOTE]

Is your horse Grady? If so, talk about a war horse! Earned $700,000+ the hard way, as they say.

[Acertainsmile]

Yes, . The fact is that we can’t save them all, only do what we can do as individuals and for the horses that we come across. Hopefully this mare will end up okay, sounds like her owner does care, and running a few more times even at a low end oval might not be the worst thing in the world for her. We can only hope, since it’s not in any of our hands.

Here is a semi recent pic of Grady.
[IMG]http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r237/missoceana22/Facebook/horses%20and%20more%20horses/308316_2250746867181_1215089459_n.jpg)

[IMG]http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r237/missoceana22/Facebook/horses%20and%20more%20horses/308316_2250746867181_1215089459_n.jpg)