[QUOTE=Kyzteke;5414838]
Totally this! I think the OP might be missing the Forest for the Trees…[/QUOTE]
This. Did you consider that this photo might also do you some good. I would walk a careful step here. You might be burning a bridge that will do you more harm than good.
Just saying…
Did you send along any photos to the SO of the filly with a “hey - look how she is maturing” email?
Because when someone sends me photos of offspring, I don’t ask to use them before I post them on the website unless I see it’s by a professional photographer, then I expect to pay for web use.
And I certainly don’t ask the owner if I’ve purchased the photo for web use directly from the photographer. I’ve done that on several occasions.
This must be a joke posting…
This filly is named using a registered trademark. The linked website doesn’t state that the trademark is used with permission in advertising.
Either a joke, or kind of ironic, in an ignorant, indignant drama-mongering kind of way…
I’d feel extremely honored if a stallion owner was show casing a foal I owned by their boy. Sure I’d feel better if they made an attempt to contact me and ask first. If it is just a photograph that I took at home then I could care less.
I posted a response to this on another BB, but will re-post it here because I do think it’s relevant. I will also add that if you can get the stallion owner to write the letter, even better 
Ugh…How unfortunate. I know I’ve got literally 100’s of photos in my files on offspring by our stallions. I TRY to keep track of who owns them and who took the photo, etc. But I know that occasionally I drop the ball.
Under the circumstances, I’d be a bit irritated, as well. BUT, you can still turn it into a positive situation. First, I “would” send a polite letter to the SO saying that you have no issue with photos being used of your horses, but that you would really appreciate credit for the photo and acknowledgment of you as the breeder of the foal and unfortunately that was not done so. Also say that obviously, you’re an advocate of the stallion as you bred your mare to him, so it would behoove said SO to include you in any stallion endorsements for obvious reasons. NOT including you leaves a bad taste and the potential of bad press for said SO.
Next, if you have a nice updated photo of the foal/horse in question, take that and send it to the publication, along with a letter to the editor saying something NICE, not snarky, such as "The ad in the stallion issue on page XX for “Casanova included a picture of our foal, Junior. Due to an unfortunate oversight, we did not receive the photo credit. We’d like to correct that and here is an updated photo of Junior”. LOVE your magazine, blah, blah, blah. You not only get people to go back to that ad and see the picture you are referencing, but you also get double duty by putting in a new photo of your kid Win/Win. Bad situation becomes good! Stallion owner receives a polite reminder to not tick off clients and/or potential clients. Puts them on notice. And if you can get the stallion owner to write the letter, even better! They probably “should” do it anyway as a matter of courtesy and a great way to apologize for the oversight!
Originally Posted by JBandRio View Post
Send a certified letter written by your lawyer that you will take legal actions if she doesn’t comply. That’s often enough to get action. But, be prepared to back up your threat if she still ignores you.
(this is a quote from the other BB and not from COTH)
Absolutely one of the worst things you can do. Truly. You become considered an unpleasant person to deal with and your reputation suffers for it. Think about it. Threatening legal action over a misappropriated photo? Not cool. I “would” make sure that I sent a polite letter as outlined above. But, I think most people are flattered if a photo is used of their foals. The big problem is not receiving credit for it. And I can certainly understand people being upset about that.
Heck, we have articles and information taken all the time off of our website. We will contact the “guilty” part and ask for appropriate credit and links be included. If at that point it’s not done, we will ratchet it up, but those articles and information are our professional reputation. And, part of the reason we request a link back is because things don’t remain static and it’s a way for readers to verify that the information is accurate and current. But photos are used regularly and we don’t get too uptight about that. …
I hope the above helps!
Funny, I was thinking the same thing…wonder if the OP got permission to use the name? I would be slightly perturbed about not getting credit for the picture, but I don’t see that it’s anything to get that upset about. IMO.
Caitlin
Wow, you guys need to get off your white, puffy clouds. It’s not “Just borrowing a photograph”, it blatantly violating the OPs copyright. Illegally downloaded songs are the same thing and people with your kumbaya mentality are currently jailed and fined $150K PER SONG. So, yeah…its serious. What makes it worse, is that in OPs case, it was violated for commercial use and the law tends to side with the photographer.
http://www.eaglestock.com/crights.htm
I’m wondering if this might have happened with that photo. As a Stallion Owner, we get foal photos all of the time from Mare Owners. The photos that I really like, I normally ask if I can post those photos on our website, but I’m sure one or two has fallen through the cracks over the years. As well, I’ve also gone directly to the professional photographers site and purchased foal photos and put them up on our website without contacting the Mare Owner.
I think before everyone flies off the handle here, I’d like to hear from the OP and find out whether she had previously emailed the photo in question to the Stallion Owner at some point…or the Stallion Owner was able to purchase the photo somehow from a third party.
What an interesting post. Teaching me a lot about people who get upset just because they can. By the way, copyright law is not as simple as some of the ragers are insisting. There are implied license and fair use issues to consider, plus the fact that the OP has no actual damages.
I understand where the OP is coming from. It is simply a matter of principle and while it may seem minute to some, it still exists. I agree that the SO should have in fact contacted the OP to not only get permission for use of the photo, but perhaps the OP also had a different photo that she would have preferred, in addition to the potential legalities involved. I would consider it very poor business practice from the SO- even under the best light.
As a small breeder and freelance photographer (more as a hobby), I have taken photos for friends and strangers of their stallions, mares and foals as favors or just because - not necessarily looking for compensation, but more for the enjoyment of the outcome. I have offered persons copies and use of their respective photos and although I do not ask to be compensated, I do ask for one simple thing - credit for the photo.
I am amazed at how many times I find my photos across various websites of several breeders - that have been lifted from the persons whom I originally took the photo for. And while I am flattered at the use of my photo and want to be supportive of the stallions, mares and foals in the photos, it leaves a slightly bitter taste simply because those photos have been used not only without my permission, but without any credit given to me for the actual photo. An oversight? Perhaps. I think about sending a polite e-mail to the people that are using my photos without my permission or credit and so far have chosen to try to look beyond, because I realize that as a breeder things are tough enough already and if this is the worst thing in my life that I have to worry about then…
However, each photo that I see does not go unnoticed.
I agree with Kathy about steps to try to resolve the situation, however I would not be surprised if the OP does not find resolution…an unfortunate picture of the times we are in. I wish the OP the best of luck though.
[QUOTE=Langfuhr;5415151]
Wow, you guys need to get off your white, puffy clouds. It’s not “Just borrowing a photograph”, it blatantly violating the OPs copyright. Illegally downloaded songs are the same thing and people with your kumbaya mentality are currently jailed and fined $150K PER SONG. So, yeah…its serious. What makes it worse, is that in OPs case, it was violated for commercial use and the law tends to side with the photographer.
http://www.eaglestock.com/crights.htm[/QUOTE]
Mmm…and who do you think would come out ahead in following through with this tact? It’s NOT about group hugs and butterflies and unicorns. It “is” about how the public would perceive dragging someone’s a$$ into court and suing them for using a photo. It “can” be made right without threatening and using legal tactics. And, ultimately the only ones that really come out ahead in what you are suggesting are the attorneys.
Additionally, laws have changed considerably with regards to copyright infringement and how to make it a positive thing for everyone. For example, check out YouTube. Those in marketing recognize the benefit of hearing a particular song on a homemade video and the chance that someone watching that video may very well download it on an ipod. Again, making a positive situation out of one that had the potential of being very bad with LOTS of negative press.
We are WAY too inclined to seek legal remedies when a simple solution will more often than not suffice, especially as it will certainly have a more positive benefit for all parties concerned.
I think it is important to note that we’ve only heard one side of this story.
Copyright law in its simplest essence, and its most just sense, is quite simple – did the alleged infringing use deprive the creator of a sale? Come on folks use your common sense, did the stallion owner’s use of the photo deprive the OP of a sale of the photo?
This is how judges think, in terms of what is just and fair and makes the world go round the easiest. Maybe we need to think more like judges and less like lawyers.
To answer some questions, no I never sent the SO any photos or updates of the filly. I took the photo of the filly myself using my $$$ camera that I bought to be able to take such photos.
However, the SO did just call and was very apologetic for the oversight. She was very quick to respond to this post and has asked to post her response as well (I had suggested deleting the post). She has assured me that any future use of the photo will have the appropriate copyright, which is all I wanted. I live by the “Give credit where credit is due” rule, and the SO really handled my concerns quickly and efficiently, so thank you.
The world might be a nicer place if we all took a moment to give kudos to those deserving such credit.
This is the Stallion manager an co-owner and graphic design artist and I just got off the phone with the owner of the filly Zaia that is so beautiful who “made the cut” for our advertisements. We now know where the misunderstanding has come from and everything is great now.
This is what happend…
I invited our mare owners to send in their baby photos and and I told them I would send them $25 a photo for taking the time to actually send them if we used them for our advertisings. The photos that came over from professionals had copyrights to them and they were put in the graphic collage I did personally. The other photos we took were of our own foals with the exception of the Zaia. I collected high resolutions from emails directly sent to us and unfortunately someone thought they were being helpful and sent over information that wasn’t theirs to send.
The International Stallion Guide has nothing to do with this other than putting together an amazing publication once again. I also never even heard from them that their was an issue. (The ISG issue just got in my mailbox Monday) I got an email this morning that there was someone who had posted something about us and it was not positive so I was as shocked as much as obviously the mare owner was when she opened the Stallion Guide. WOW it is a lesson to all of us. I am so sorry and publicly apologize to whoever was offended and compliment the all the mare owners for their beautiful foals and their vision for choosing For Play as their sire. I need to go call all my other mare owners who contributed to our foal collage to make sure it was really them who sent it. I did have an email account that was being phased out with an auto reply on it about no longer being used. I checked that account and that is where I found the message from the mare owner when we had done business before that was the account I used and so naturally she replied to it. The email address int he International stallion Guide is a typo also. I am glad that we were able to talk on the phone and figure this one out. I hope everyone has a wonderful day and for anyone interested in owning a horse as nice as Zaia her owner welcomes the idea of the dam producing another one upon request. please visit http://www.superiorwarmblood.com/cirquedusoleil.html to see the beauty all the fuss was about. And our stallion For Play doesn’t mind taking any other mares that can produce this kind of quality.
Dacia
[QUOTE=Langfuhr;5415151]
Wow, you guys need to get off your white, puffy clouds. It’s not “Just borrowing a photograph”, it blatantly violating the OPs copyright. Illegally downloaded songs are the same thing and people with your kumbaya mentality are currently jailed and fined $150K PER SONG. So, yeah…its serious. What makes it worse, is that in OPs case, it was violated for commercial use and the law tends to side with the photographer.
http://www.eaglestock.com/crights.htm[/QUOTE]
Who do you think is going to win in this? I don’t think I am on a white puffy cloud, but going off the deep end here is not going to help the SO or this breeder. Mistakes are made and I would think there could and should be a resolution in this case without legal intervention. Lawsuits take lots of time and $$ and would obviously ruin a lot of business relationships. You know others are going to get involved and form opinions that right or wrong will effect your business. That doesn’t mean you should let people take advantage, just weigh your options. As a breeder, I think you have to consider all the possiblities before jumping to any conclusions.
[QUOTE=IneedanOTdayAlter;5414900]
I think you’ve taken a leap right off the deep end, here.
This didn’t harm you in any way. In fact, you may have benefited from it (prior to this posting, anyway).
Sure, the stallion owner SHOULD have asked you, but really, you’re making a mountain out of a molehill here and frankly, I don’t think it reflects well on you. For all you know, the stallion owner e-mailed you and it went into your spam folder.[/QUOTE]
I am going to agree with the OP. Just because the SO felt the foal represented the stallion well, does not mean the OP should be flattered. How is it any different than taking a picture of a pretty girl on a beach and using it in a calendar. Should the woman be flattered? No. Her likeness is being used for the profit of another. The SO is using someone else’s property to promote their business. They did it without permission. Doesn’t matter if the email landed in the spam folder. SO should have called if they really wanted to use the picture and got no response.
If the photo was taken by a professional, that takes it to another level.
Yes, it validates that they OP has a nice foal. Maybe the OP has a fabulous mare and this stallion didn’t do her justice in the OP’s opinion. Who knows. It is RUDE at the very least.
ETA: Just read the stallion owners response. Bravo to both parties for getting this straightened out.
Very gracious, Dacia. Best of luck with your stallion – you have made a “favorable” first impression on me…
Ditto. :yes:
Ditto, very gracious of you Dacia.
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