Coyotes and suburban horse farms

[DownYonder]

We are looking for suggestions on how to deal with coyotes that have taken up residence in the woods surrounding a farm in the middle of surburbia. The coyotes can be heard yodeling at night, and they have been spotted on numerous occasions during the day and evenings. Not only have they gotten into several tussles with the farm dogs, but they also charged a young teenager retrieving a horse from a pasture. Two of the dogs have been injured – one bitten, and another older one suffered an ACL injury during the scuffle. We are fearful the coyotes will take the smaller dogs, and are especially worried about an elderly JR, who is not only fairly deaf these days, but also doesn’t have good eyesight and who occasionally wanders away from the house and barn area in a sort of “senile dementia” daze.

The farm is good sized (over 60 acres) and although it is bordered on three sides by heavy woods and wetlands (streams, swamp, and small lake), there are multiple other homes and very high traffic roads close by in all directions. The farm owner is a fairly good shot and did kill one adult coyote a month or so back (one of a breeding pair that had a den in the surrounding woods), but there are apparently many more adults in the area than we first thought. Since there are very few “safe” directions to shoot in, the shooter has to get pretty darned close to his target, but it’s dicey, even with a scope, and not easy – the danged varmints just vanish the minute someone shows up with a gun.

We know all the usual suggestions - get donkeys, get Pyrenees or other LGDs, don’t let the farm dogs wander around (hello, they are farm dogs and this is THEIR home!), etc. None of those are viable ideas in this instance, so we are looking for other suggestions.

Someone has recommended stuffing pieces of meat with blood soaked sponges and scattering them near the section of woods where the coyotes are believed to be living, but that is such a horrible way to kill something, and no one wants to go there unless there is no other good alternative. Poison is also out of the question.

So – anyone have OTHER ideas? We are not adverse to killing them, but we want to do it as humanely as possible.

[beowulf]

Were the incidences with the coyotes seen by other people? Are you sure it wasn’t feral dogs?

I only ask because as I get older I realize a lot of people can’t tell a pariah dog from a coyote… and the dogs are much more dangerous to livestock.

We have coyotes and eastern coyotes AND coydogs here. I’ve seen them come in just about every shape and size. The only ones that ever showed aggression were the dogs. One of the coyote bands lives very close to our house, and I see them often when I’m out on the trail. They have never once threatened our horses and are usually very inquisitive – but they are not bold and will run away if you clap your hands. They have never threatened our dogs, though a few years in a row we did have a female in heat that tried to court one of our GSDs… the following spring she must have found a friend because she had 3 puppies and they would come out around dusk and play with our GSD until I intervened… cute as it was, don’t want rabies. :lol:

They have made off with a few of our chickens and we had to revamp our coop because of it. The coyotes have a healthy fear of the bigger ungulates and don’t bother the cows or llamas either, but the coydogs are very brave and will slaughter the lambs in the spring if our neighbors do not keep them locked up at night.

I know you don’t want to, but it does sound like keeping your JR under a sharp eye is best.

You said you don’t want to poison and I want to say I really appreciate that. We live between two very old farms (one dairy and the other sheep/produce). They regularly put out poison for the feral dogs and coyotes. It makes me sad, because it doesn’t just kill the dogs and coyotes. It also kills the animals that scavenge the poisoned animals; which includes birds of prey and carrion birds. Stoats, raccoons, possums are also affected. :no:

[BabyGoose]

Keep shooting them when possible. At least that will make them learn to be more wary of humans and maybe keep their distance a little from the farm. It is difficult to keep poison from harming and killing non-target animals. Same with traps and snares but you might try that depending on trapping laws where you live.

And coyotes will definitely take out a dog if given the opportunity. They usually steer clear of large prey, but it is not out the realm of possibility. They will take advantage of anything if given the opportunity. I live in the western US and ranchers here have them kill lambs and adult sheep. They will eat the calf out of a cow if they catch it down giving birth. I have also seen them take deer and fawns, antelope fawns… they eat what they can catch so don’t discount that they might attack larger animals.

[Scribbler]

We have coyotes all through our metropolitan area, and they yipyipyip at night right inside my townhouse complex (which backs on greenbelt), when fire trucks go by.

We have them around the barn, which is in a park.

They are known around the city for snatching cats and smaller dogs that are out being walked. I have not heard of them attacking or approaching humans or horses. I can see that if you have dogs on the property, the coyotes might be coming around to socialize, as well as stalk, them. I would say the JR needs some supervision; he won’t last long.

We also have a growing resident population of black bears, and these tend to worry people more than the coyotes. The bears have chased horses in turnout at our barn once or twice, and at my friend’s barn elsewhere, one of her horses turned up with big deep claw mark wounds to his flank that really looked like a bear swatted him.

Basically I don’t know what you do about wild animals in the suburbs. If you kill or relocate, another of the same will take it’s place soon. You have to figure out some way to co-habit. Around here, wildlife control will only come out for a sighting of a cougar or for a bear that has actually broken into a house or injured a person.

And as the cougar sightings have gotten more common, it seems that it’s now only cougars actually seen stalking children or in backyards after house pets. We have wolves within 20 miles of the metro area now; interesting to see if they decide to move in as well.

So I’m not sure getting rid of the coyotes is practical. More will just wander into the territory. Figuring out how to keep your animals and people safe, and co-habit, might be a more effective long-term solution.

[Foxtrot_s]

Might be coy-dogs -

We have coyotes in abundance and have not had troubles with them. They are smallish, timid and have not attacked anything of ours. Probably would take down a cat or small dog if they could. Saw one on our lawn last week.

There are also hybrid wolves, noticeable by their bushy tails. Our coyotes are rather scrawny little things.

I’d like to think we could find a way to let our wildlife co-exist, we are the ones pushing into their grounds.

[Pennywell_Bay]

My farm is surrounded by coyotes. I have not have any run-ins with them, though they seem to come eerily close and we see glimpses in the woods. We have 3 BADs (big a$$ dogs) and 2 little dogs. We closely monitor them when they are out, regardless of fencing. The coyotes have never been brazen on our property but my neighbors (who have sheep) have a coyote trapper come out (in the spring? check the ordinances) and traps a few.

[FitToBeTied]

We have coyotes all around here as well. All of our dogs are bigger than a single coyote. As predators go, coyotes are not the ones that concern me unless they pack up.

I suspect being in suburbia the coyotes have found the pickings easy and are now comfortable with having no competition.

[fordtraktor]

I have coyotes here, on my 20 acres next to a housing development.

I have had zero problems with them.

I had a deaf Jack Russell – one day he started barking loudly and I looked up – there was a coyote observing us 20 feet away. My JRT chased him away.

Now I have a little Chihuahua/mini-pin mix, and he doesn’t go off by himself at all so I don’t worry about him at all. His nickname is “fordtraktor’s shadow” so he’s cool.

The barn cat is very savvy but he’s been living out there for a few years without getting eaten. I tried him in the house but couldn’t litterbox train him, so he has to fend for himself. He was a dropoff and has liver damage and doesn’t like strangers, so he’s basically impossible to rehome.

I have put off getting chickens but more because I have a large fox population. Pretty sure my kids would learn a lot about the circle of life if I added chickens…but it wouldn’t be the coyotes doing the teaching. One fox used to sleep in my hay loft! :dead: They are much bolder. The coyotes, I hear them sing a lot at night but overall they are much more like ghosts, I see them here and there and they never cause any problems. I wouldn’t kill them. I am far more likely to kill the possums, which are cute but spread EPM.

[clanter]

We haven’t had a proble![]( with the invasion of wild life that has moved into the city. Coyotes and wild pigs are around but haven’t infiltrated the pastures.

However a jaguarondi which is considered extremely rare in Texas did lived for nearly two years in the back pasture, it is protected endangered species so we couldn’t even live trap it

photo of kitty
[IMG]http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b386/clanter/kitty2.jpg)

[ThreeHorseNight]

Have you talked to your county’s wildlife officers? If your farm is in suburbia the coyotes pose a threat to more than just the people and animals on your farm.

i live in a rural area and the coyotes are bold. They don’t seem to have any fear. One of the dogs who lives on my property tussled with a coyote a few years ago. Before that, a coyote got very close as my husband was walking our puppy on our property. Even in the suburbs near here the coyotes hang out and don’t seem to be afraid. My former neighbor, who was a cattle rancher, would shoot them. A coyote attacked one of his cows as it was calving and ate the half-born calf.

i believe that it is your responsibility to keep your animals safe from wildlife as much as possible. Especially when you’ve got a smallish, elderly, senile dog. No way would I be letting him wander. However, when the wildlife starts to threaten people, you’ve got a much bigger problem. Make sure to tell the wildlife authorities about that incident.

[DownYonder]

Thanks for the feedback. Coyotes have been an on-again/off-again problem at the farm for over 20 years. The area was pretty sub-rural for a while, and the varmints had a lot of places to live. At first, everyone was willing to co-exist with them, although over the course of a couple of years, they completely wiped out all of the BO’s chickens, ducks, and turkeys. They even tore down the side of a chicken coop to get at the flock, and the owner once had to beat a large coyote with a piece of firewood to get it to release his JR. I think he managed to shoot that one a week or so later, and also shot a few others over the years.

Things haven’t been too bad the last few years, but THIS year has seen a mini-explosion in coyote sightings throughout the whole area. There has been a lot of development going on the past few years, and the entire area is losing its rural characteristics - becoming true suburbia - so the coyotes are being pushed out of other areas and they are finding refuge in what woods and undeveloped areas are left - i.e., mostly farms with dense stands of woods. We have even had sightings in our subdivision a few miles north of the farm.

Everyone is trying to keep an eye on the JRs - esp the elderly one, but she will be sleeping peacefully in the tack room one minute, and then gone the next minute, only to be found somewhere else by herself.

As for county wildlife officers - hah. The ones for this county aren’t at all interested in, or experienced in coyote removal.

I suspect this bunch of coyotes is going to have to be picked off, one by one, with rifles, although as I said earlier - there are only a few safe directions to shoot in. I think the BO has met with local LE a few times to discuss the issue, and there has been a bit of talk about an organized hunt - basically a group of (armed) people tramping through the woods until the den is found. What a dilemma.

[clanter]

Everyone is trying to keep an eye on the JRs

be watchful od eagles and hawks also… we have them here and they like catching small animals

[Cat_Tap]

I don’t have any useful answers. I have had coyotes around my place for years. Have even had one follow my dogs and I within a 50 foot distance on several occasions. Now suddenly they are gone. No yipping at night and no sightings. My neighbor, a farmer, also noticed their absence. We have no idea why they are gone, unless they moved into town where the pickings are easier.

[Scribbler]

[QUOTE=clanter;8699133]
We haven’t had a proble![]( with the invasion of wild life that has moved into the city. Coyotes and wild pigs are around but haven’t infiltrated the pastures.

However a jaguarondi which is considered extremely rare in Texas did lived for nearly two years in the back pasture, it is protected endangered species so we couldn’t even live trap it

photo of kitty
[IMG]http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b386/clanter/kitty2.jpg)[/QUOTE]

Wow! Looks like a mini cougar!

My rarest sighting at the barn was a bobcat. Right up near the stables stalking squirrels.

[Larbear]

At the barn where I keep my horse there used to be a lot more coyotes, now, not so much. I think the neighbours shot quite a few of them. I used to ride out and see them and they didn’t bother me and the horses didn’t seem to be bothered by them. Since the reduction in the coyotes where I keep my horse I’ve noticed more groundhogs around now

[Foxtrot_s]

I suspect the neighbours behind us, separated by a creek, are putting out poison.
For a while there were fewer coyotes, but now they seem to be back a bit.
It also depends on the amount of food around - we have lots of rabbits right
now, so the coyotes are feeding well; when there are not so many the litters are smaller.

[clanter]

when we had a farm on the Ohio River in Kentucky they way we were able to remove the wild dogs/coyotes was to use a fence charger.

Took a metal stake, drove it into the ground wrapped a big hunk of roast overt he top of the post then wrapped the meet in place with electric fence wire… hooked the wire to the charger, hook charge ground to the metal post

later that night returned, after biting down on the meet the yelps were to be here for a few miles and after that they never returned

[snowrider]

Clanter, that photo is very cool!

The thing with coyotes is that there is only one breeding pair in a territory, the others are older pups that hang around for a few years. The breeding pair keep all the other coyotes away and the pups don’t become sexually mature usually very fast, sometimes at all. Not all coyotes breed if there are enough alpha pairs to hold all territories. If you shoot the breeding pair or the female then the other local coyotes will come into season/ breed/ hold smaller territories and you will end up with MORE COYOTES! The limiting factors on coyote populations naturally are a) wolves and b) other coyotes. So if you want neither it’s a bit of a dilemma.

The way people in CA handle it is pretty much always to have one or two BADs and or donkeys as described above who will take on the coyotes and keep the core area of the farm coyote-free. We used to have a big pit/ lab cross (mostly pit) who killed all comers. Then small dogs or cats need to stay in the Green Zone. Donkeys and llamas will stomp the crap out of coyotes in pastures, especially with no climb fencing as they can’t escape. Coyotes are smart and stay away from killer domestic animals. If something takes on one of them it ain’t a coyote.

You can’t eliminate them long term, you can manage them. Imho, it’s better to have a long term pair who hold a large territory and know the rules and raise their kids to know the rules than to keep getting new coyotes every year.

[clanter]

[QUOTE=snowrider;8700364]
Clanter, that photo is very cool!

.[/QUOTE]

and I am in the middle of several million people… wild life people said Hum, it is not supposed to be there… yeah tell me something I don’t know :lol:

it never ever bothered the horses, they actually paid no attention to it as we all sorts of animals living here

we did put a special watering station in for it as it was using the horse waterers as if they were a natural water source leaving parts of birds and other small wildlife in the waterers … when we put in the hydrants we ran a line to back of the property so there was a hydrant in an out of the way place that became the kitty’s watering hole

[keysfins]

Clanter, I am so glad you posted about the “Big Kitty” again. I remember when you posted on the Udub about it, and how cool it was that you had such a rare animal in your area.