Crooked horse in left lead canter

Hunter rider seeking dressage help!

The title pretty much says it all… my horse is very crooked with his haunches to the left in the left lead canter. I do lots of lateral work at trot to bring his shoulders left and his haunches right, but I can’t get it to carry over in the canter. I can not get him to bring his shoulders left at the canter for some reason and if I try to push his haunches right, he swaps leads. How [exactly] should I ask for him to straighten his body (as in what does each hand and each leg do?)?

I posted this on the H/J forum but I thought it would be beneficial to post on here as well.

TIA for any suggestions!

common problem its you more than likely

theres tons of stuff on crooked horses ,stif horse, horses leaning, my horse is stiff on one side, my horse doesnt go forwards as hes stiff blah blah
do go to search box and put in croaked and other tittles above
like haunches in and out , etc look here
http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=169741

If it is me, what am I likely doing to cause this? And how can I correct myself? I’ve only started noticing how crooked he is within the past few weeks… he may have been crooked before and I never noticed, but I think that this is a relatively new development.

I have a problem similar to this. My left side is weaker than my right, so things tend to be harder on that lead (halfpass, leg yeild, etc, etc). Maybe this is the case for you too. Have someone watch you from behind (or video) and see if you are leaning to the right in the canter while on the left lead. You might not even realize your weight is on the right. Next time you ride, pay attention to which side you are putting your weight toward, and which stirrup you have the most weight in while in the left lead canter. If this is the case, try and keep your weight on the left, and step into the left stirrup.

To eyemadonkee

Nearly all relatively unschooled horses are hollow on the left and will travel crooked with their hind feet making tracks to the inside of those in the front i.e. at canter with the haunch swung to the inside.This isn’t your fault but correct schooling will address the problem and fix it.It’s a matter of straightness and can only be corrected by placing the shoulders in front of the haunches.That is but one of the beneficial effects of riding shoulder-in.It straightens the horse.You cannot straighten a horse by trying to line it’s quarters up with the front end because,in canter,as you’ve discovered,the horse will simply change it’s lead.Neither can you do it in walk or trot.
Obtaining a straight horse,on both reins,and in all three gaits is one of the main objectives of ‘dressage’ or academic riding.
Good luck.

before you doctor too much with exercises…get yourself a firstclass Chiro and then a firstclass bodyworker to see your horse.
Although I agree that many ‘smaller’ issues can be solved by solid riding and good exercises…there is usually a bigger issue behind this- which will be so much easier to address with all the good suggestions already given- once the skeletal issues and muscles issues have been properly addressed…you can fix this best by starting at the beginning- and the beginning is the physical situation of the horse and what needs to be adjusted prior to starting to ride and try to fix it through exercises…JMO!

"for some reason and if I try to push his haunches right, he swaps leads. "

Because this is the wrong thing to do. ’

A horse cannot be straightened by trying to move the haunches ‘back where they should be’. It does not work. It throws the horse off balance. That’s why he has to swap leads.

It’s also quite possible that he simply thinks you’re cueing him for a canter on the other lead! But that points out the main problem with trying to straighten by moving the haunches, which is, it just doesn’t work.

He must have read a dressage book at some time.

Put the shoulders in front of the haunches. Don’t ever try to straighten a horse by putthing the haunches ‘back where they should be’.

Why? As one trainer told me, ‘because then there’s nothing for them to be behind!’

Think about it. The haunches are the drivers and supply the power.

Say you had a giant pillar you wanted to balance. The top is not in line with the base. What do you do, you move the top of it so it is aligned with the base. You don’t try to move the base, or the whole thing is tipping all over the place off balance. Same with a car. You have to keep the front wheels aligned exactly in front of the back wheels, or you lose power. The steering of the car allows you to keep the front wheels in front of the back wheels.

When you skid on ice, you NEVER try to steer against the skid, you turn the front wheels with the skid, so that the front wheels get back to in front of the back wheels. Without that, you have no power and no traction - with a horse, no balance and no power.

In other words, when the haunches drift to the inside, do shoulder in or later, a shoulder in like feeling, where chiefly the inside leg and outside rein encourage the horse to, like he does during shoulder in, connect well with the outside rein, and have the position of his shoulder corrected by a shoulder in like position/feeling.

Of course you don’t drift in completely off the rail, because your inside aids are telling the horse to stay on the rail.

The outside aids mostly are the ones that position the shoulders and control where the shoulders are in relation to where the haunches are. The outside aids also need to ‘draw the circle line’ in turns, circles and other work.

Of course, the outside aids can’t do that without the inside aids. One can’t straighten a horse with only one leg or one rein - all the aids work together.

Why doesn’t your work at the trot help at the canter? Maybe because you did it at the trot and not the canter?

Or because when you did it, you didn’t really get the fundamental piece of it - that it teaches the rider that it is the outside aids that control and position the shoulders. The inside aids and outside aids make what amounts to a ‘channel’ that keeps the horse straight and balanced.

Maybe because there is more impulsion at the canter, more loss of balance at the canter, and in part because of the mechanics of the canter, horses always tend to put their haunches in a little bit, and have to be specifically trained during their entire career not to; they typically put their haunches in MORE in one direction than the other at the canter, but both directions they do, and need to be trained all along to be straight at the canter.

May not be the cause but I am well aware that H/J people give the canter cue via the outside leg. If your right leg is stronger than your left and this is entirely possible it could be too far back and is in effect pushing the hind quarters in.

The first thing I would do that would determine if it is you that is causing the problem, is to ask either with the inside leg only or if the outside leg aid is too fixed in your training then make every effort to use the right leg (being on the outside) as little as possible or with a little pressure as possible.

See what the results are from this, for you will never get the shoulders in front of the haunches until you are aware of how much leg pressure you are using (and its placing).

Horse does not want to bend and/or carry weight on the inside left hind. It shows up more in the canter because of the mechanics of that gait.

If this is due to some discomfort, such as an arthritic hock, for example, it will not get better unless the underlying veterinary problem is treated.

But since it is the left hind–this is not at all unusual because the left side is usually the weaker, less dominant side. If you are right handed, you may compound this problem.

The classic way to work on keeping the left hind under the body is to work on truly getting the horse to bend through the rib cage and not poke his right shoulder out (and left haunches in) to avoid the bend. That means shoulderfore or shoulder in, which you must be able to do at the walk and trot before you attempt it in the canter. If you do work on the shoulder fore left at those gaits, it will begin to strengthen the left hind with less stress. This is difficult to master without dressage instruction.

Two other things that you can try:

  1. When the horse throws his haunches in to the left, try leg yielding his whole body over to the left just for a stride or two, then go straight. Do it every time. You may have to practice your leg yield in the walk and trot so that he responds to your aids.

  2. Try using some counterflexion exercises. Just flex the horse’s neck to the right when tracking left. Do not counterbend him through the body. Do it in the trot first. It can be helpful to make a figure 8 (two connected circles, not diagonal lines.) Keep the same right flexion on both circles in the figure 8, so that you are counterflexed on one circle and true flexxed on the other. When you have mastered it at the walk and trot, try it in the canter. Keep your weight and leg aids bending the horse for the circle that you are on, but just counterflex him with your reins. Make sure to keep your inside leg on at the girth and not back.

The counterflexion will keep the right shoulder from poking out, and the haunches will not easily escape to the left. When you teach the horse this exercise, sometimes all you have to do is think counterflexion when tracking left, and that will straighten him.

This is a very common problem. Most new riders “new to dressage” have a horse that is crooked on one side and stiff on the other.
Your horse is jackknifing to the left, over bent and falling onto his right shoulder…His shoulders are going around the outer track, hauches are on an inner track…
To fix this, I would start at the walk, teach yourself and him exercises for straightness, then trot etc. It is about the relationship between the shoulders and the hips, control one, move the other, and visa versa.

Turn on forehand… Ride a rectangle and at each corner make the turn with a TOF. Pretend there is a “manhole cover” at each corner. Make sure the front legs stay on your "manhole cover’, no crossing of forelegs out on the turn. Learn with our outer leg and rein to control the forehand, move the hind legs a step at a time until you are pointed towards the next corner.

Shoulder in…go on a 20 M circle at B or E and when you reach the track, continue down the long side in a few steps of shoulder in. Move the shoulders onto the inner track, use your inner leg in a “pulsing” manner keep the horse connected into your outer rein.

Leg yielding, nose to the wall… This exercise might be temporarily counter productive as your horse already goes shoulders out, hips in, but it is one of the best exercises where the rider can learn straightness.
Start through the short end of the arena, cut your corner, end up at the wall with his nose facing it, do a few steps of leg yielding. Once you can do this down the long side, keep him moving off your inner leg (the one nearest the wall), keep him straight with your reins. The one sided driving aid will push the horse more onto the outer rein, you must then use it to keep him straight and not let him “pop” his shoulder out.

I had a horse that was new to dressage and she did the same thing. I positioned her shoulder-fore in the canter - don’t fix the hind, fix the shoulders. All the other exercises that have already been mentioned are great.

Things to check in your position:
• make sure that the outside leg isn’t too far back and actually pushing the hind off of the track
• make sure that your rein pressure is even - It’s very easy to take hold of the inside rein - especially when you’re trying to use inside leg to fix things. A momentary give on the inside works wonders when the horse is jack-knifing.
• also make sure that you are not counterbent - when the horse is crooked, it’s easy to let the seat bones mirror the horse and before you know it - your shoulders are facing the inside of a circle or track and the seatbones are actually facing the outside. Make sure your torso and hips are working as one solid column to help guide the horse.

Thanks for all the helpful advice, everyone!