Cross Country Blips? Should remounting be allowed again?

[Weatherford]

In the old days, when a rider fell, they could get up, remount, and continue.

These days, we have gone 100% the other way, and I am not sure it’s right.

Some of the falls today were “blips” where the rider COULD have remounted and safely continued. And, frankly, I think that would have been better for the sport.

YES, if a rider hits their head, they should be stopped. However, sometimes, they land on their feet - WHY should they stop?

Australia’s Bill Roycroft remounted and finished with a concussion and a broken arm, AND left the hospital to showjump the following day - which gave the Aussies the 1960 Gold Medal. Was that safe? No. Was it a great thing to do for his team and his country? Yes! Did it ruin or shorten the rest of his life? Heck NO!! He was over 96 (!!!) when he died last year!!

So, there must be some kind of compromise! I think viewers would feel much better to see the riders remount and continue rather than walk home.

I think not letting riders who can, remount, reinforces the negative image this sport has in the public eye.

Opinions?

[riderboy]

Yes, I think so. I saw a Japanese rider pop off (same place Clayton Fredericks came off I think) and land on his feet. He could have easily re-mounted and continued. (Only spoiler here, not sure if the horse was 100%) All of that hard work, money, training and travel just went pfffftttt. I have always thought that such zero tolerance policies are generally exquisitely non-thinking. Probably most falls do involve a bang on the head, but certainly not all.

[klmck63]

I felt particularly bad for the girl who fell off in the water! That seemed like a total fluke, and she almost managed to climb back on, but her horse wasn’t impressed with her efforts.

I think the difficulty lies in deciding which falls constitute elimination and which don’t. It’s easy enough to say that you can get back on if you haven’t hit your head or been stepped on, but a lot harder to tell in person if someone hit their head or were clipped by a hoof on the way down (not to mention dealing with falls where the rider hits their hip, back, shoulders and then head lightly-- what would you do in that instance?).

[LookmaNohands]

And here starts the debate. Where do you draw the line?

I would draw it at landing on your feet or feet then knee or maybe even butt.

I am sure someone will come along and tell us how one can still end up on deaths door landing one one’s feet or thereabouts.

Or maybe the water. Course the water isn’t as deep as it used to be.

If they decide to make it landing on your feet you are going to start seeing riders taking gymnastics or vaulting lessons though.:lol:

[vineyridge]

Can you remount and continue safely after your air vest has popped?

[IFG]

I have been arguing here for years that the one fall rule is window dressing for safety, so I will agree with you and step back from the fray…

[yellowbritches]

Yes. I have hated the rule from day one. I remember watching Andrew Nicholson at Hong Kong, shortly after the stupid rule was put in place, popping off at a tough question, two fences from home. It was devastating knowing he had gotten THAT far, not to be able to finish.

I saw it several times today…and I think it is demoralizing, especially in this type of situation. :no:

I know it is tough to legislate when a rider can and can not get back on, but MOST of the time, riders are fine and they know it.

As for landing on your butt…well, I know a girl who “landed on her butt”, and 30 minutes later was puking her guts up. No one realized she’d wacked her head, until then. Pulled the cover off her helmet…it was cracked. :eek:

[BAC]

Actually in the old days you could fall twice and get back up and continue, as long as you fell at two different fences.

I have always disliked the new rule, they are all adults and it should be their decision whether or not to continue unless there is obvious injury. Certainly the majority of the ones that popped off today could have safely gotten back on and continued, what a shame that such a small blip prevented them from completing their Olympic cross country dream. Its a dangerous sport and always will be, no getting around that fact.

[whbar158]

I guess because I have done a ton of hunters I am use to you fall you are done (at least with that class). I don’t see how it is negative though to the public its a rule I think most people can understand that. I don’t have a problem with it and I think trying to police people who have landed on their head is hard, leaves too much gray area, so land on their head? Hit their head somewhere along the way? How do you decide? You don’t have a chance at anything after a fall, and many little blips horses took funny steps/jumps/slipped and may not be 100% either. People and horses having long term injuries leaves a much bigger black eye than the one fall rule.

[Weatherford]

Let the rider decide.

[WildWest]

As someone who has a friend with a brain injury from this. i say no. She was legged on after a fall on a 3 day. She careered into the next fence flipping and sustaining a debilitating head injury. It has totally destroyed her quality if life and she can no longer drive a car or ride a horse.
It was thought that although she felt fine when legged back on she was disorientated and had already sustained a concussion as a result of the seemingly light fall.

Who would be the one to make a call? Even with a qualified Dr at every fence making a spur of the moment decision could be fraught with problems. Imagine if the all clear was given and a scenario as above happened. Lawsuit !!!

[voltaire51147]

[QUOTE=WildWest;6468230]

Who would be the one to make a call? Even with a qualified Dr at every fence making a spur of the moment decision could be fraught with problems. Imagine if the all clear was given and a scenario as above happened. Lawsuit !!![/QUOTE]

That’s what I thought when they halted dressage during the storm. We live in constant fear these days of the LAWSUIT, many of which are beyond frivolous. Lawyers get rich, courts become crowded and insurance rates go up. The costs are then passed along to the consumer.

It’s a sad commentary on our society but one we have to live with underthe present laws. I would like to see the rider make the decision on whether to re-mount if the horse was not affected (which could be difficult to ascertain always). As someone mentioned, these are adults but they also have families who have lawyers, etc. In retrospect, sadly,the rule will have to stand.

[kalidascope]

For those in the ‘Adults can make their own decision’ camp … adults with a head injury have impaired judgement. Head injuries are not always immediately obvious - to observer or rider. Making poor decisions on a cross country course is far more painful than being eliminated even when you’re ‘okay’.

[voltaire51147]

[QUOTE=kalidascope;6468248]
For those in the ‘Adults can make their own decision’ camp … adults with a head injury have impaired judgement. Head injuries are not always immediately obvious - to observer or rider. Making poor decisions on a cross country course is far more painful than being eliminated even when you’re ‘okay’.[/QUOTE]

Very true. There are countless stories of riders who have fallen, refused medical attention and died within hours. As I said, above, for different reasons, the rule won’t go away for many sound reasons.

[Anne_FS]

IIRC, the total elimination after a fall was instituted after a year of a number of grave (including fatal) injuries to horses and riders. If you remember, the concern about the harshness of xc to the horses got a lot of press, particularly in Europe, and there were calls to eliminate it entirely from the Olympics.

I think the rule began also, maybe even primarily if I remember the discussions in the press, to protect the horses. After a fall perhaps the horse is not quite right. Seems okay, but is not 100% and may have a more tragic fall further on the course, so the decision was made not to take any chances. At the time I remember reading dissenting views saying that this was done to appease ARs, as the rule truly was not needed, however, since the call to eliminate Eventing was increasing, something had to be done.

[kalidascope]

[QUOTE=Anne FS;6468463]
IIRC, the total elimination after a fall was instituted after a year of a number of grave (including fatal) injuries to horses and riders. If you remember, the concern about the harshness of xc to the horses got a lot of press, particularly in Europe, and there were calls to eliminate it entirely from the Olympics.[/QUOTE]
I am SO GLAD nothing especially bad happened this Olympics for this reason.

[mayhew]

[QUOTE=Weatherford;6468229]
Let the rider decide.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. It was their choice to compete, and should be their choice to continue or not after a fall. Are there any other sports in which a fall constitutes elimination? Certainly not gymnastics, and those are minors!

[Anne_FS]

But it’s not the horse’s choice.

No, you can’t let the rider decide. I believe 99% of the riders will make the correct decision, but for the horse’s sake that cannot be allowed.

That’s not my view, that’s the AR view. Because I think riders will make the correct decisions; however, it’s an AR world now. The big discussions a few years ago were about the horses.

Remember a few years ago a video came out with a rider flogging an obviously tired horse over the end of a course? I can’t remember where or when, but it was a female rider and the outcry, including here on COH, was tremendous. There were also incidents in previous Olympic competitions of horses crashing and burning - I remember specifically water jump videos of exhausted horses from (where? eastern Europe?) struggling mightily.

It’s because of these things the rules changed.

[Jazzy_Lady]

I don’t know… I have mixed feelings, because I have re-mounted with a pretty severe concussion before, because the adrenaline was running high. It was prelim too, and I had 5 more fences left and I finished. I missed the last fence, and went back and jumped it apparently, but I’ve been told that. I don’t remember jumping the remaining five fences. I could have had a serious accident.

My fall didn’t look too bad, (horse tried to bank a pheasant feeder and got his front hooves caught up on the back lip and pecked on landing) and I just shot off like a bullet, but I rolled. I was on my feet right away. The medics met me at the finish and wouldn’t let me walk.

I think for some people, it really sucks to fall off, but for others, it probably saves an accident waiting to happen, or an injury that the adrenaline didn’t let you know you have.

[ponysize]

This is a RIDING competition. If you come off, you should be done. Period. Why should you be allowed to continue? You came off the horse.