My 13 yo beagle has been diagnosed. Does ànyone have an experience with this disease in dogs? I have some decisions to make.
My beagle mix was diagnosed at 13 after she began drinking A TON of water and producing huge amounts of dilute urine. She was was worked up and found to be systemically healthy, so cushing’s disease testing was indicated, and she was diagnosed cushings via low-dose dex suppression test and ACTH stim test. We started her on Trilostane without any clinical improvement or ACTH stim test results. Doubled her dose with very minimal improvement on recheck test and still peeing everywhere, and I gave up at that point since I couldn’t really afford Trilostane at the starting dose and was really stretching it when her dose was doubled, so I knew there was no way I could afford it longterm on an even higher dose even if she did respond ever respond to it. Initial diagnostics and all the repeat stim testing, etc, was huge financial drain.
The other option was mitotane adrenal ablation, which uses this chemotherapy drug to kill the adrenal glands completely and then the dog can be maintained on prednisone longterm. Essentially, you are giving your dog Addison’s disease. The cost of mitotane for the 4 or 6 week (can’t remember exactly) protocol to kill the adrenals was $1600 or so retail, maybe a little cheaper from Canada, but still too much for me to consider at that point, especially since I was in the hole and very discouraged after the Trilostane failure, etc. My vet actually had some mitotane donated to her by a client who had some left over after her pet had died, which turned out to be about half of what I needed, and then she rather exhaustively researched dosing scenarios,etc, and found a compounding option that could supply the rest at a cost of like $300 for the rest of it. So I went for it and my dog tolerated the drug exceptionally well and felt great even during that month or so of treatment and we quickly found a pred dose that worked well for her, so no complications from the chemo or Addisonian crisis, etc.
But what my vet had not told me was that my dog would have to have a DOCP/Percorten injection every 20-something days or so to replace hormones that her body could no longer produce…at at cost of about $100 per dose for the rest of her life. Not optional, dog will die without it, no cheaper alternatives. This was a huge shock and huge financial burden to me that I could not afford, since I had been told she could be maintained cheaply on pred and this was never, ever mentioned.
But there was no going back at that point, so I made it happen for over a year. Her symptoms were improved, but she still drank a lot and peed a lot, and she never stopped peeing in my house. I’m not sure if she just couldn’t hold it due to volume, or old age, or just thought it was ok at that point since she had been doing it for so long. Anyway, it was at reduced enough so that I could mostly deal with lots of pee pads, etc, but it was a huge drag and I dreaded going home to clean them up, at best, or to find she had had a bad day and made a huge mess. She suffered from some cognitive dysfunction that made changes to her routine impossible, so I couldn’t suddenly start locking her basement or leaving her outside in my fenced yard all day for the first time in her life. She would completely freak out.
On the bright side, I did notice her get physically stronger and more active once her cushing’s was turned into well-managed addison’s disease. I had attributed her generalized weakness/frailness/arthritis to her very advanced age, especially since the onset had been gradual, etc. But she started jumping up on the bed again, playing with her toys a lot more, giving the other dog’s a hard time, etc. Obviously she had a lot of cushing’s symptoms like muscle loss, etc, that I hadn’t really appreciated at all. So it was very gratifying to see her feel better and enjoy a better quality of life for a lot of that year. Then she became subtly weaker/frail again and declined quite a bit over about a month, started having trouble with the few little stairs going in/out to the yard again, etc. She couldn’t deal with any changes at the point like going out the front door on a leash, being physically helped up/down the stairs, etc. She stumbled a few times on the stairs, even fell down several of them once, but one morning she fell completely down the stairs onto the concrete pad. She wasn’t hurt at all, that time, but it was only a matter of time before it ended very, very badly. I put her to sleep that afternoon.
Honestly, I’m not sure if her decline/symptoms were due to old age (14+ years) or possibly a sign that something was changing adrenally with her, since these glands can become active again even after mitotane ablation, so a cushing’s again, or maybe some other disease process. I choose not to find out and euthanized instead. It was the best choice for both of us at that point. In hindsight, I wish I had euthanized her when she didn’t respond to the initial cushing’s treatment and never put either of us through that final year.
Sorry to share such a depressing story, but it is an honest one, so I hope it helps in that way. Please know that lots of cushing’s dogs do great with treatment! Warm thoughts and best wishes to you and your pup….
Thanks for your response. I am hesitant to start this whole process and your reply gave me more to consider . My dog has few symptoms now. I am boing to make a conference appt to have the vet go over all my questions . I don’t usually believe much in alterative med but did find some info from a respected vet recommending some lignant/melatonin supplement so will ask about that . I can’t believe I am considering no treatment but my research shows it is a financial drain and doesn’t extend life really. I may put her on the naturàl remedy and just keep her comfortable as long as I can,
[QUOTE=flea;7802854]
My 13 yo beagle has been diagnosed. Does ànyone have an experience with this disease in dogs? I have some decisions to make.[/QUOTE]
My brother’s dog (that used to be mine, and I still took care of to some degree) was diagnosed at 12. He was on a med that started with an “L” (lisodrone? Something like that…). It eliminated the symptoms, and he lived another 4 yrs and was finally put down at age 16 (was playing Frisbee 4 mo before his death), and was put down due to spinal arthritis, not Cushings.
The initial testing can be expensive, but once you get on the meds, it can be easily managed in many cases. One word of advice. If they start the dog on meds at the end of the week (like a FRi/Sat), see if your vet will give you some Prednisone to have onhand, in case the dose of Cushing meds is too high. The Pred can reverse it, so it won’t be fatal. It is important, if your vet is closed on weekends. I didn’t have to use my dose, but I felt better having it available if needed.
My border collie lab cross was diagnosed at 7 and I got another 3 years out of him by changing his diet. I went completely holistic and treated with Chinese herbs and electro-acupuncture. I could not afford the drugs and I was living 3 hours away from my trusted vet at the time. I called upon a friend to help me out. She is a DMV and a Ph.D. in Chinese Herbal Med and Holistic methods.
In the last few months it got really bad and in hindsight I let to go on for a bit too long. (I was selfish and did not want to lose him).
Cushing’s sucks. I would not wish it on anyone’s dog.
Here is my post from a few months ago.
I have been down that road with my Boxer. He lived with Cushings for nearly 18 months and I would do it all over again. We had ACTH stim tests done regularly to make certain the meds were controlling it. We chose to go with Lysodren which is powerful but worked for him. We always knew when he was getting ready for an ACTH stim and an increase in his dosage because his peeing and drinking would ramp up. We got to the point where we were sweet talking him when he would trickle-pee in the house - we didn’t want him to feel naughty about something that was clearly out of his control. Best thing we did was keep him as active as he would tolerate. Cushings can cause muscles in the back end to waste away so maintaining fitness is crucial - within reason of course. He got pretty creaky at the end and we even did acupunture and chiropractic work on him to keep him comfy. There is a lot I would give right now to be wiping up his pee from the kitchen floor one more time. I relish every day I have with my dogs because our time together is simply too short.
This is a link to a previous conversation here on Cushings.
http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?352884-Cush-pups&highlight=Cushings
I bolded what hit me so hard. Its so true. What I would not give to carry Kip up the stairs after he drank a whole bowl of water or to clean up after him one more time. Their lives are so short. …but that just means we get to love many.
I found the discussions from this summer on Cushings and have a consultation w vet next week. Although this info is online I like your personal accounts. Is the med injection or pill that you have. Does it have to be given at the same time every day on the dot?
My mother’s dog was diagnosed with Cushings. She’s a short-legged terrier/German Shepherd type, size of a Corgi, spayed. Diagnosed 5 or so years ago, and iirc she’s around 15 yo now. Tested every few months, on a pill a day, I think. She’s fine, and doing great, and probably wouldn’t be around without the pills and tests, so it’s very manageable, not disruptive, and not too expensive. Definitely worth it, I’d say, as she’s leading a great life!
[QUOTE=flea;7807524]
I found the discussions from this summer on Cushings and have a consultation w vet next week. Although this info is online I like your personal accounts. Is the med injection or pill that you have. Does it have to be given at the same time every day on the dot?[/QUOTE]
The med I gave was a pill (Lysodren). It was given daily at “roughly” the same time of day +/- a few hrs.
Good luck at your consultation appointment next week. When we were deciding about treatment the vet gave us an option between two meds: Lysodren - which is what we went with and Trilostane. The vet explained that Trilostane was very effective but every once in a while, unexpectedly, a dog would drop dead. Not a risk we were willing to take. Yes, a “side effect” of death may not have been due to the meds but we just weren’t going to chance it.
Lysodren was given once or twice a day, within two hours or so of the assigned time. It is an extremely powerful drug so you want to handle it with care including using rubber gloves and not allowing it by other pets or children. They may recommend an induction phase of intensive meds and then a maintenance phase that is ongoing. Every time we did an induction phase - heavy doses of the meds - we watched our guy like a hawk for side effects. We would also keep prednisone on hand, just in case the Lysodren dose was too high. The maintenance phase was one or two doses per week. You MUST keep accurate records as an accidental double dose would be serious. This is essentially a chemotherapy drug that destroys a layer of the adrenal gland. It is not something that you should be touching with your bare hands.
I can’t say enough I would do it all over again. Yes, it was expensive and stressful and required a lot of monitoring - but this was for my beloved Boxer who was the light of my life.
Listen to your vet. Consult with your family to determine a course of action that is feasible monetarily, emotionally and appropriate for your level of commitment. While I mentioned that we had two options for meds I would be remiss not to tell you that the third option was “no treatment.” For us, that was not the right option to take but the internist did present it for consideration.
My 12 year old dog was diagnosed with this last year. She was really agitated drinking a lot of water and needing to pee often. A dog who had never had accidents in the house was having them but turned out it was because of the volume of water she was drinking, not a kidney problem. It took a while to get her diagnosed because some things did not point to cushings but so glad I did the investigations because now she is doing reasonably well on Vetrolyn pills (trilostane) which she gets once a day. I take her in every three months or so to have her levels checked but her water drinking is normal,peeing is normal and she has not had any accidents in the house since she went on the medication.
Trilostane was recommended by my vet over the medication starting with L-mentioned above.
It is worth it to have my girl feeling better. When it gets to the point she is not comfortable, I will make that decision . I know that our time is limited but so long as she is feeling well and happy, then we will continue on happily with the meds.
Good luck with your dog- just wanted to give you my positive story.
I’m wondering how all of your dogs are doing on the Cushings meds now and if you’re still happy you went with that decision. I have a 14 year old Jack Russell cross that they want to do all sorts of testing on (x-ray/ultrasound/Cushings dex test, etc) and I’m wondering if it’s worth putting him through all that (he would have to be heavily sedated for the x-rays because they lie them on their back) and if the meds are worth it. ???
I would do the dex suppression test, and meds if he is diagosed. Not sure about the xray.
We have had dogs with it do well and I see dogs do well at work everyday. Once you do the Dexter suppress, you need to get an abdominal ultrasound to rule out adrenal vs. pituitary based cushings as they are treated differently. It it is adrenal, you do surgery to remove the adrenal tumor. If there is no adrenal tumor, it is presumed to be pituitary based. Then you use meds.
We used lysodren on my parents old girl and she did great for around 2 years. She was over 15 when she passed and had terrible arthritis. Would blame it on the cushings. Her symptoms pretty much went away during that time.
Trilostane is more expensive. Ask your vet to go over each med with you so you can pick the best one for your situation.
I dont have time to type it all out now but just wanted to say that my older dog did amazingly well on the meds. Cushings was well controlled- no issues at all- definitely worth it to have my girl back to her old self . In the end - over a year later- she developed unrelated cancer and I made the tough decision- but she did well on the cushings meds - vetoryl. There are 2 types of cushings but on vets advice we did not go down the road of determining which type and tried the vetoryl. worked wonders for her.
'm wondering how all of your dogs are doing on the Cushings meds now and if you’re still happy you went with that decision. I have a 14 year old Jack Russell cross that they want to do all sorts of testing on (x-ray/ultrasound/Cushings dex test, etc) and I’m wondering if it’s worth putting him through all that (he would have to be heavily sedated for the x-rays because they lie them on their back) and if the meds are worth it. ???
I just realized this was an old thread and that I had already replied last year. I was happy with the decision- my girl did extremely well on the meds for over a year- unfortunately she developed unrelated cancer of a type without good prognosis for surgery - so the hard decision was made. No regrets treating Cushings though. I have no doubt she would still be here if not for the cancer. I guess it depends on the overall health of the dog going into it.
we didnt do the xrays to determine which type- we did the dex suppression tests and treated with vetrolyn, based on the advice of the vet. we knew we would not be doing the surgery anyway if abdominal( based on advice from vet) so took this approach which fortunately worked
[QUOTE=jetsmom;8453923]
I would do the dex suppression test, and meds if he is diagosed. Not sure about the xray.[/QUOTE]
The gal at the lab recommended that 1st, before the Dex suppression test, not sure why, maybe in case there is cancer instead or something else that could be causing his bladder not to hold (mis-alignment???) but I think it’s the water consumption more than anything.
[QUOTE=Beckham03;8454023]We have had dogs with it do well and I see dogs do well at work everyday. Once you do the Dexter suppress, you need to get an abdominal ultrasound to rule out adrenal vs. pituitary based cushings as they are treated differently. It it is adrenal, you do surgery to remove the adrenal tumor. If there is no adrenal tumor, it is presumed to be pituitary based. Then you use meds.
We used lysodren on my parents old girl and she did great for around 2 years. She was over 15 when she passed and had terrible arthritis. Would blame it on the cushings. Her symptoms pretty much went away during that time.
Trilostane is more expensive. Ask your vet to go over each med with you so you can pick the best one for your situation.[/QUOTE]
He’s “coming” 15, and I wouldn’t do surgery on him, so I guess that’s where my hang-up is. They actually want to do the x-ray and u/s first. :-/
[QUOTE=Crockpot;8454059]I just realized this was an old thread and that I had already replied last year. I was happy with the decision- my girl did extremely well on the meds for over a year- unfortunately she developed unrelated cancer of a type without good prognosis for surgery - so the hard decision was made. No regrets treating Cushings though. I have no doubt she would still be here if not for the cancer. I guess it depends on the overall health of the dog going into it.
we didnt do the xrays to determine which type- we did the dex suppression tests and treated with vetrolyn, based on the advice of the vet. we knew we would not be doing the surgery anyway if abdominal( based on advice from vet) so took this approach which fortunately worked[/QUOTE]
Yes, I agree with the no surgery. Our dog is 14, coming 15, actually and while he doesn’t have many other problems he has been treated in the past for kissing spine (but is doing well)…he IS getting OLD and I can tell his vision/hearing are going and I just wonder what else is next…?? Hence the hesitation…but the input is definitely helping so thanks for that everyone!!!
Since Our vet said the the abdominal surgery is very difficult we decided we were not going to do that - so there was no point doing the xrays. She really did amazingly well on the meds. We were lucky. Good luck with your guy.
[QUOTE=Dune;8453849]
I’m wondering how all of your dogs are doing on the Cushings meds now and if you’re still happy you went with that decision. I have a 14 year old Jack Russell cross that they want to do all sorts of testing on (x-ray/ultrasound/Cushings dex test, etc) and I’m wondering if it’s worth putting him through all that (he would have to be heavily sedated for the x-rays because they lie them on their back) and if the meds are worth it. ???[/QUOTE]
I don’t understand your thought of “putting them through that”. An ultrasound and radiograph is nothing more than your dog having a belly rub and laying still for 5 minutes for xrays. Having symptoms of cushings is putting them through more suffering than sedation for some xrays! Xrays rarely need heavy sedation, ask your vet about lighter sedation (if any at all is needed!).
