Hermann Oak still vegetable tans in the US: http://hermannoakleather.com/about/environmental
I worked for an American footwear manufacturer for a few years and I saw there that one of the primary reasons for the decline in the quality of strap goods (all manufacturers buying leather buy them from the same vendors, for the most part) is because consumers want cheap and easy. And the best way to get cheap and easy is to have things manufactured outside the U.S. where labor standards and worker compensation are lower resulting in cheaper products. Making things in the U.S., or any first world country is EXPENSIVE. Those pricey European saddles are being made by workers with government funded healthcare, many weeks of paid time off, and some with maximum hours of work per week. Those benefits are expensive and we help pay for them when we buy products made there.
A nice American made bridle is going to cost at least $300 without reins (most of the time), yet I hear myriad riders state they would NEVER pay more than $150 for a bridle with reins. So, they will have to buy imported products to get that price point. Many imported tack items are made of quality leather, but it won’t compare to leather that was tanned in the U.S. 50 years ago and made by an American worker.
I have sourced impeccable shoes, leather uppers, leather lined, leather soles, made in Europe or the US. Styles that I like, slightly funky. There is one store here that sells a beautiful selection and everything that catches my eye is about $500. Sigh.
Now when I read novels from the 19th century it’s clear that except for the very wealthy, people had a limited stock of clothing. Indeed up through the 1950s people made do with far fewer clothes than we’d think necessary.
So my guess is that yes, things were probably made better in the past but also that they were likely equivalently expensive to incomes.
Growing up we were taught that a standard cavesson should fit halfway between the corner of the mouth and the protruding cheekbone - not 2 finger widths below the cheekbone. IOW bridles were designed from way back in the day to be fit in a different way.
1 Like
I think one of the biggest differences today is brand name. Part of the cost for everything is associated with the brand name. I have yet to be disappointed in the quality from Smith Worthington’s strap goods or Dehner for example. The prices are fair for the product, but at the same time they are not the popular brand names. You pay for the name.
2 Likes
Xanthoria - huh - I just learned something new from your post! Thank you and that makes sense. J.
1 Like
When I use leather tack (which other than my saddles isn’t very often because I far prefer the look, feel and ease of beta or biothane), I find the local Amish harness makers to have nicest quality (and for far less than paying for the name on other stuff).
The other thing to keep in mind when shopping vintage anything is that the high quality items survive and the cheaper stuff is long gone.
Yep, I have a bridle that is over 50 years old that is still going strong. But I have had several bridles of similar age that have long since “bitten the dust”.
Similarly, the leads with “potmetal” snaps have long since broken, but the ones with brass snaps have mostly survived.
I know a man who can make you want you want, at excellent quality & price: https://www.facebook.com/GarysLeatherShopLLC/?timeline_context_item_type=intro_card_work&timeline_context_item_source=100003009728810&fref=tag
Trust me… his leathers are da bomb!!!
2 Likes
IMO, the cavesson hangars are always still made to be way too long. In fact, I have always wondered how this dimension was so off vis-a-vis the length of the cheek pieces and crown, or the total lengths from bit ring to bit ring. I mean, both part of the bridle will be on the same horse head! You partially explain that. Thanks! But boy-howdy, I still think the cavesson hangar would be too long even if you hung the noseband lower as you describe and not right under th cheek bones.
3 Likes
If we are going to get technical and talk about leather quality, then, sadly, I have to disagree with you.
I ordered some top drawer black leathers from Gary and the leather was relatively thin. Of course, I was chasing the standard set by my Courbette leathers made in the late 1980s. I think those were considered excellent leathers then. They certainly lasted a long time for me. And when I wanted a new pair of leathers, I thought I have learned my lesson and searched around for more Courbette leathers. I found some and even they were drier and thinner than my original ones.
Yessirreebob… even though we were still in the Cold War, the music and the tack were great in the 1980s.
1 Like
Ohhhh 
Hmph
And I do agree on the 80’s tack quality… da bomb!!!
Rosy colored glasses. There was bad cheap tack back then, there is bad cheap tack now.
The difference now, is that people are comparing old, very well broken in tack, with new, unbroken in tack. My 30 year old Stubben bridle sure feels fantastic when compared to to a brand new bridle of similar quality… but give that bridle some time to be broken in, and it’s a very nice feel too.
However, one thing I think people are overlooking is back then, leather came very stiff, and had to be broken in over lots of cleaning and hard use; now, leather is sold brand new as quite soft - soft leather doesn’t age or wear as well, so when you have a brand new floppy Vespucci coming out of the bag, it is going to wear quicker than its hardier competitors.
What has changed is the tanning process, too. There are pros and cons with both processes, I prefer vegetable tanned, but it is expensive, time consuming, and very costly as a finished product.
There’s good and bad leather out there. Stubben still makes the same high quality bridles they made 30-50 years ago. Passier & Kieffer do too. The price is different, though, because the cost to make it is much more astronomical… so there is also a disconnect there, since people remember that back then, bridles seemed more affordable.
Frankly, people confuse “soft and supple” out of the bag with quality. This is not the case. Red Barn is a very soft and supple leather brand new, but it is not high quality. Conversely, Courbette comes out of the bag stiff as a board, but is a very high quality brand - but it is overlooked because it does not have the feel people think translates to quality.
2 Likes
Gary’s leathers - we’ve used him before. Although people rave, doing business with him is frustrating honestly. His method of payment doesn’t jive well with our purchasing card. One or two pair here and there = fine but I tried to order 28 pairs and poof - couldn’t get him to respond to have a conversation with me (about the double set of holes and custom length). I can’t wait on this stuff - when we need it, we need it NOW.
@beowulf - agree with you.
Also I think people today often haven’t experienced really good quality leather, or think any leather needs to be basically boiled in oil to make it good.
(Heres a tip: if you have to soak it in oil often and clean and condition the leather every use to keep it supple, it’s likely the leather isn’t great. If you can ignore it for quite some time* and it’s still supple, doesn’t have a rough flesh side, doesn’t crack or fluff up, it’s probably better quality. )
A lot of people recommend Quillin halters and I don’t think the leather quality or finishing workmanship is great at all: they’re certainly tough halters and steeped in oil to withstand all sorts of weather and abuse, but aside from that they’re not fine quality strapwork. And they’re probably not intended by the makers to be that either, but people always refer to them as top quality.
Then there are the soft French calf saddles that have been mentioned that won’t last 30 years. Or the likes of Voltaire with the colored plastic or rubber inserts that again are not designed for longevity…
*Shame on you/me!
1 Like
Here is Hermann Oak Tannery’s simple explanation of the difference in the two tanning processes: http://hermannoakleather.com/resources-and-events/tanning-process
For what it’s worth, Royal Sports tack claims to be vegetable tanned. They are made in India, sold direct online, and have never been called high end
The tanning flow chart points out the tanning method is just one part of the process.
I think a lot of people are impressed with the durability for the price point. For a leather halter that can sit outside and be exposed to the elements 24/7 and then come in and clean up and look new AND not wear quickly-- they’re hard to beat. No, they’re not high end bridle leather but they’re not meant to be.
Slight hijack of the thread, but your comment about people in the 1950s making do with far fewer clothes than we would think standard–I think that is apparent when comparing TV shows from back then to those now. Take a show like I Love Lucy, for example–she really has a handful of outfits that she cycles through. I readily recognize what she is wearing. Shows now–you hardly ever see a character wearing the same thing twice. I realize that’s just TV, but it reflects the same idea. People now expect more variety in their wardrobe and it is supported by “fast fashion” stores. People have more clothes, but they probably don’t get more than a season or two out of them, whereas back then people had fewer outfits but they lasted years.
The same kind of concept applies across the board, including to tack.
1 Like
I totally appreciate that ordering/purchasing through Gary isn’t as smooth of a process as a modern online transaction. I would expect that any small (especially extremely small!) business is going to be a bit clunkier of a process than an Amazon or Dover or Smartpak. Knowing him as long as I have, he’s taken some extended breaks from leatherwork while he dealt with life’s hiccups. Maybe your order came at one of those times. Maybe he saw an email for 28 pair and assumed that it was a scam or something. Who knows–I don’t have a psychic hat. But I’ve never had a problem with any order I’ve personally made. The craftsmanship was lovely. The price point was outstanding. And they were shipped really fast for a custom item that clearly takes a minute to prepare. I’m sorry you had a disappointing experience. I think the idea of a set of leathers with adult and child sized holes is brilliant, btw.
