degenerative joint disease, bummer. *update*

[irkenequine]

My deafblind cattledog isn’t genetically sound ANYWAY, but this diagnosis came out of left field for me.

Very fit and active 1 year old ACD/Aussie Shep; homozygous merle so he’s deafblind but other than that incredibly healthy kid.

Intermittent lameness on L front has been off and on for a few months; we’ve restricted ball play for a few weeks at a time, seems to help a bit, the pain in it waxes and wanes. Never totally NWB, just ‘off’ in his gait. My roommate and I have argued back and forth over it being his shoulder or foot but we couldn’t pinpoint an issue–he’s so stoic and tense when you examine him we had NO idea where the pain was coming from.

However on a walk the other day he became 3 legged lame so I had one of the orthopedic vets I work with examine him; she didn’t feel anything, so we xrayed him from shoulder to toes. Antech radiology reports just came back as degenerative joint disease present in the elbow.

Of course the vet I work with was being very comforting–no worry! Just take it easy, get him on some dasequin, etc but I really want to start educating myself and hashing it out with some people. Anyone have problems with this in their young dog? He’ll be 2 on June 6th. I am ABSOLUTELY heartbroken; I don’t care if he’s got 1, 2, or 3 legs but this little guy doesn’t have a lot in the world…he LIVES to play tennis ball. Its ALL he cares about from his first waking moment until the second he goes to sleep. I cannot imagine spending the rest of my life telling him ‘no’ and redirecting him since he’s SUCH a good kid, and a little ‘special’ and sheltered. I know ball playing can create manic obsession in dogs but since he doesn’t romp and bark and interact socially like most other dogs, I’ve always let him indulge in balls to the fullest. I guess I’m rambling because Im so sad its him. Either of my other two it would have been easier to hear, but other than his eyes and ears he’s actually my ‘healthy’ one.

Any studies, recommendations with joint supplements, exercise ideas more than welcome.

[jetsmom]

Ask your vet about starting him on Adequan. Loading dose for a month, then repeat the loading dose once or twice a year.

Don’t let the vet talk you into one shot a month instead of the loading dose. It’s proven to not be very effective that way.

[JSwan]

my shepherd gets previcox and Pentosan. Much improved. (hips). He jumped up in the truck today.

[Zu_Zu]

JINGLES FOR YOUR DEAR DOG AND HUGS FOR YOUR HEART

JINGLES FOR YOUR DEAR BOY [/I][/B] [B][I][/I][/B] [B][I]AND HUGS FOR YOUR HEART

AO YOUR VET IS ABLE TO DEVELOP A TREATMENT PLAN THAT OFFERS SOME COMFORT AND ALLOWS SOME FUN

[Horsegal984]

I think the hardest part is going to be for you to decide if you want maybe 4-6 happy years with him, or 6-8 not so happy ones? If he really lives to play ball, then as hard as it is for us, I think I would say lets do everything preventative ( Glyco-flex/Dasaquin, Adequan, Legend, etc) and let him play all he wants until he can’t. I would rather my own heart hurt knowing I’m limiting my time with him, than watch his heart hurt for some reason he can’t understand.

I’m so sorry you’re having to go through this!

Katherine
Vet Tech

[irkenequine]

Thats the exact boat I’m in, Katherine. I’m so torn. Its all. he. wants. The second you pet him when he wakes up, he darts off to find you something to throw. A perfume bottle, a pillow, an old sock, it doesn’t matter as long as he thinks you’re going to play fetch with it. We’re members of a dog park and he’s never even sniffed another dog. They hump him, play bow at him, and all he does is bring me stick after ball after bowl at my feet to just throw. it.

I wish he was a swimmer, then i could throw it all day and not worry so much be he is really reckless about fetch–stops VERY hard, flips and rolls in circles, jumps through the air etc. he is not delicate at ALL about it.

Will do Jetsmom, I had the orthopedic aspect of it done here at my clinic but I’m going to meet with my GP next week about maintenance. I was just really hoping to hear “Oh he tore x” so this was a total shocker.

He’s the only of my 3 I’ve had since puppyhood and I wanted to see him into old, old man-hood. Wish there were ways of making his games of fetch more controlled…I wonder about scentwork maybe.

[Canaqua]

[QUOTE=Horsegal984;6093021]
I think the hardest part is going to be for you to decide if you want maybe 4-6 happy years with him, or 6-8 not so happy ones? If he really lives to play ball, then as hard as it is for us, I think I would say lets do everything preventative ( Glyco-flex/Dasaquin, Adequan, Legend, etc) and let him play all he wants until he can’t. I would rather my own heart hurt knowing I’m limiting my time with him, than watch his heart hurt for some reason he can’t understand.

I’m so sorry you’re having to go through this!

Katherine
Vet Tech[/QUOTE]

I agree. Our cattle dog is 14, so it’s not a situation of a dog afflicted with joint disease at a very young age…I’m really sorry you are dealing with that. She has been an obsessively hard charger her entire life, she LIVES for fetching anything and everything. She is lame, always lame, now, with bad arthritis in both elbows and her lumbar spine. She sometimes loses her back legs out from under because of the spinal degeneration and resultant nerve problems. She WON’T stop fetching and running (as best she can)…she’s miserable without being able to hobble after balls and sticks. So, we let her. I know people look at us like we are the meanest owners on the planet, making this poor old, lame, dog fetch stuff. But that’s not the case, she’s miserably unhappy and depressed (and barking and bitching all the time) if she can’t play and we turn her down when she brings us something to throw. We do try to throw on flat surfaces with good footing and not too far. In the summer, she fetches in the lake, which is much better for her.

We have her on Adequan, MSM and either bufferred aspirin or Previcox depending on how bad a day she is having. They help, they won’t fix her, but they seem to make her more comfortable.

She’s not going to live for ever, if it makes her happy to still “run” after stuff in her dotage, we let her.

[SquishTheBunny]

Yep, see it daily especially with labs. Have you had it localized to elbow or shoulder?

We see a lot in for CT’s, find small little chips (which regular vets assume is DJD) and scope them out. Lots of happy labs and owners.

However, not to say it isnt DJD, just saying that there couldbe something else if the only workup done is xrays. They 90% of the time miss small chips.

[irkenequine]

I work for orthopedic vets and they and the radiologist were pretty confident on DJD and not a chip…but you’re right, rads only get you so far.

HOWEVER, I plan on doing a CT pretty immediately since I can have one done here at work; I would die for it to be a chip.

We did every view on earth, AP and lateral shoulder, elbow, carpus and everything in between, they are confident it is elbow only.

Ugh I just hate this for him! Whyyy little buddy, why my ball hound.

[SquishTheBunny]

Aww bummer. Well, if you can get the CT done, hopefully you will see a suprise!! If not, hopefully you can keep him going with some type of medical management. I know a lot of people here are really against hills food here, but our ortho vets own dog (16 year oldlab) looks likea pup since she has switched to the hills JD.

[irkenequine]

It would be nice; I just walked over to IM to see what the price would be and with my discount about 400 bucks. Thats very doable, for the hope that the problem is treatable. Thanks for the CT suggestion. I didn’t hash out any further diagnostics with the vet that did the rads for me because it was a busy as heck day at my job and I had other pups to put my mind on.

I’ll look up the ingredient list on JD and see whats in it on a supplementary level that I could add to his current food. He’s got a glorious bloom and is a perfect weight and I’d love to keep him on what he’s on if possible, but being this young I want this managed as SOON as possible. The past week the limp has really become a permanent thing; before it was just intermittently after play but now its with him all the time. Too young, I tell ya.

[irkenequine]

Update for those who helped me before:

Saw my GP with the xrays. His recommendation was an arthroscopy; when I mentioned the CT he said (paraphrasing) “You work for an orthopedic clinic, why CT when you could just go in and scoop out what you suspect to be there, 5 years ago we all operated 5 without CT’s and you’ll save yourself the cash, so go ask your doctors for surgery.”

I bring this info back to orthopedic vets at work who say that according to current studies, young dogs who have bone fragments of the medial coronoid process in the elbow (which they don’t believe there is any evidence of on the xrays though of course those aren’t very conclusive) are going to show the same amount of arthritic change over time an that the surgery is not worth it. She recommended the same as before–NSAID if he’s painful and some sort of joint supplement.

I absolutely trust the cumulative knowledge of this clinic but this isn’t the news I wanted to hear–I wanted a ‘fix it’ diagnosis, and I was especially hoping to hear it from surgeons since they always want to cut.

Mostly just a disgruntled update in case anyone searches this topic in the future, I dont really have any other input except I am just generally unhappy. He’s a young dog and I don’t want this for him.

[SquishTheBunny]

Awww Well hopefully NSAIDs will help your pup tremendously. What are you putting him on?

We always CT dogs before the scope, but the cost is included. We generally do this to see if its bilateral or unilateral. Less anesthetic time is safer for the animal if its only unilateral. CT is done under sedation, and is cheaper than 3 views x rays on both elbows. But, Im sure each clinic is different with costs.

[irkenequine]

We have Rimadyl and Tramadol for the hard days and dasaquin maintenance (I just saw this response.) Resident and the boarded surgeon were in agreement…long term study shows that doing surgery provides no long term difference in arthritic changes then dogs that avoid surgery. So no cuts.

I am still doing research on my own to the best of my ability because I am NOT convinced it is his elbow. He’s obviously painful but the only reason we even think it is balances on one Antech report, from one set of xrays.

New and different symptom which I think might unlock some clues–he has begun licking the inside of his paw along the area of the dew claw. I have poured over his manus xray and am not convinced there’s anything, and Antech’s view was, “There is a course trabecular pattern within the distal diaphysis and metaphysis of the left radius. The clinical significance of this is questionable. No soft tissue swelling, articular abnormalities, or bony changes are identified within the left carpus, metacarpus, or phalanges.”

But why would he be licking it if that wasn’t the source of hte problem? As horrible as this sounds I have NOT discouraged it in hopes he starts to leave a mark in the area that bugs him. I will not stop pursuing this…I don’t want to take “he’ll just limp forever.”