Denny Emerson on Mr. P

[Texarkana]

Viney, I have to respectfully disagree with you on this one.

Ireland may export more thoroughbreds than the US, but that does not mean that US breeding (specifically with Mr. P) is undesirable or unpopular in the UK or Australia. In fact, quite the opposite is true.

For example, 24% of Australian mares were covered by a shuttle stallion in 2014, the majority of those shuttle stallions being North American bred.

Australia’s most popular stallion of 2014, Pierro, covered 220 mares. While an Australian-bred, has 4x5 inbreeding to Mr. P.

If you look at Australia’s top 25 stallions by fee, 6 of them are North American shuttle stallions, who have also made a serious impact on the stallion rankings in the country.

Ireland’s international phenom, Galileo, is from almost completely North American lineage for the first 3 generations. He’s out of a Mr. P granddaughter.

If you look at Ireland’s top 25 stallions by fee, 5 of them are North American bred.

England’s most expensive sire, Dubawi, is a Mr. P grandson. And again, if you look at their top sires, you’ll find plenty of American influence.

Considering the racing and breeding culture is drastically different in North America vs. UK vs. Australia, it’s amazing how much North American breeding has permeated the latter two regions. We may not be exporting a lot of stock to race overseas, (which makes sense because we have totally different breeding goals), but our North American bloodlines are inescapable!

[vineyridge]

Another quote by Mr. Kavanaugh:

The evolution of the Irish breeding industry in the last 25 years is fascinating, and whereas 25 years ago European breeders came to America to secure the best blood lines, the traffic is now in the opposite direction. Europe and in particular Ireland has become home to the best stallions in the world. However, if you look at the top Irish stallions and go back just two generations, you’ll find most of them are based on American blood lines: Galileo, Danehill Dancer, See The Stars, Raven’s Pass, Cape Cross, Invincible Spirit, and Holy Roman Emperor and Shamardal all have at least two American grandparents while Teofilo has four.

What does this say about our breeding industry? It tells me that bloodstock is a highly mobile commodity and any country that has developed or is developing a bloodstock industry should never become complacent about its situation.

At the 2014 Round Table Hiram Polk presented a study on US genetics in Australia which concluded that horses with 100% and 50% US genes are able to be competitive there without Salix. In that talk he stated that Australian sprinters are the fastest in the world. The Australians may have jumped on Mr P/No D like ducks on a junebug because Mr. P famously produces notable speed.

A year or so ago, I broke down the top 100 Australian stallions, and I seem to recall that only 6 were Mr. P on top. I also seem to recall that something like 70, maybe 80 were Northern Dancer and many of those WERE shuttle stallions from Europe and the US. The amount of Danzig, Sadler’s Wells and Fairy King in Australian breeding is remarkable.

I think its interesting that this year’s winner of the German Derby is standing in the UK, not Germany. Sea The Moon is by Sea The Stars and was/is? German bred and owned.

BTW, the US exports far fewer “horses for breeding” than it does “other horses, donkeys, mules, hinnies” by a factor of more than 10-1.

[Texarkana]

That is an interesting quote!

I think the Irish are much better at using our bloodlines than we are. :lol:

But these are the same bloodlines that many of the casual sport horse folks will claim “ruined” all North American thoroughbreds.

[Linny]

From Equine News:
"Temperament is certainly a factor in deciding which stallions make good candidates for shuttling, but it is only one small piece of the decision-making process. Bloodlines are a larger factor. John Messara, the founder of Arrowfield Stud, explained, “Obviously we look for a horse that we believe will suit our local racing program but also one that will have commercial appeal to breeders. This is an issue of judgment and then marketing. It is always preferable to target a stallion whose progeny have done well in conditions that approach those in Australia. An example of this would be Zafonic. He was a sprinter/miler which is ideal for Australia. He was also an excellent two-year-old himself, and is a progenitor of good two-year-olds. The Mr. Prospector sireline is known and appreciated here and has crossed well with Sir Ivor- and Northern Dancer-line mares which are prolific in Australia.”

Mr P was a dirt horse and as a foal of 1970, his career predates the rise of Europeans buying in the US. Into the mid 80’s while the Euro’s were raiding the July sale for ND and his sons’ foals, Mr P was perceived as a “dirt speed” and not many of them ended up in Europe. As such, they didn’t earn the reputation as grass horses.

A few ran on grass and a few of his daughters threw grass runners and soon his reputation was enhanced. Until there is some proof that they go on grass, many Euros or Aussies aren’t going to spend much for them. Certain of his sons were proven on grass (Kingmambo) but for others, trying their sons on turf was a leap of faith or act of frustration (Gone West a nice dirt miler sired grass rocket, Elusive Quality.)

[aquafarms]

The Mr. Prospector son Not for Love seems to produce horses that hold up well, scroll down on this link to see a conformation shot. http://www.northviewstallions.com/index.php/stallions/maryland-sires/not-for-love

[Linny]

The Niarchos’ sent the great Miesque to him several times. Clearly, they had confidence in him.

My old horse is a grandson of Mr. P by a stallion who stood in Louisiana and even covered QH mares. He race 'til 9, retired sound and was still carting kids around the crossrails last I knew in his mid 20’s. He had tight and straight legs and a bit hot well up in his teens and extraordinarily athletic.

I think Mr. P puts some mental toughness in them, in a positive sense. They have that “go” that makes them bold jumpers and willing athletes.