Deworming with only Quest?

[Iride]

I’m considering rotating Quest with Quest Plus only, and not any other dewormers. Since Quest gets small encysted strongyles and bots (and tapeworm with Plus), in addition to the other worm types is there really any need to use anything else?

Frequency I have in mind was twice a year (Quest in Spring, Quest Plus in fall for tapeworm). But I may increase to every 3 or 4 months as my mare is in a large herd 24/7 and there is no access to pasture rotation.

Anyone else started this plan? Open to hearing comments.

[cnd8]

I do Equimax twice a year–after the first freeze and again in Spring here in South Georgia.

[LCDR]

Will this regimen be for your one mare only, or for the entire herd or barn?

[Iride]

@LCDR Entire herd…there are a couple on daily Strongid 2x

[Janet]

I do a fecal analysis every fall, and worm according to the vet’s direction. For the last MANY years, it has been to use Equimax Plus(or equivalent) in December, and nothing the rest of the year

[LCDR]

Then no worries. Dosing twice a year should be fine. Especially coupled with fecal egg counts.

And Quest is a good choice since one syringe treats a 1500 pound horse. Some dewormers are packaged in 1000 pound syringes and thus many horses receive a less than than recommended therapeutic dose. I speak as an owner who owns a horse scale and no horses who weigh under 1,375 pounds.

[2DogsFarm]

I do same as @Janet
Spring fecals, then paste according to results.
Last 4yrs it’s been Equimax in Fall (I have a pony & mini who can’t do moxidectin) then ivermectin in Spring.

[cnd8]

I’m not aware of an Equimax Plus.

[Simkie]

The issue with using only Quest is resistance. It’s like going to the biggest, baddest broad spectrum antibiotic for every infection. It’ll work great for awhile, but you’re selecting for organisms that are resistant to that particular agent and never wiping them out with something else.

Moxidectin is the best anthelmintic we have, and afaik, there’s nothing on the horizon when it stops working. There ARE studies showing resistance, which is just so frightening.

You get really similar coverage using it once a year and Equimax once a year, and are hopefully preserving the useful life of moxidectin as much as possible.

[Iride]

Unfortunately encysted strongyles do not show on fecals. And the only drug class that will get those are moxidectin (Quest) and fenbedazole (double dose for 5 days, Panacur Powerpac)

[Iride]

She may have been thinking of Zimectrin Gold?

[Iride]

Precisely. My horse is closer to 1500 lbs and I have to adjust (increase dose) accordingly

[Iride]

I do worry about resistance for sure. I may try your plan but would make sure it’s Quest Plus in the fall to cover tapeworms. Also I will add a second Quest regular to make it 3x/year since we don’t rotate pasture

[Janet]

Sorry- I mis-remembered, Equimax or Quest Plus

[JB]

Even though moxidectin and ivermectin are in the same macrocyclic lactone class of drugs, it’s still best to alternate between the 2 to slow the resistance issue.

This means I wouldn’t use Q/QP twice a year, and wouldn’t just use Equimax twice a year. An exception is a horse who cannot have moxidectin.

Most horses need to have bots and tapeworms controlled twice a year. If bugs and grass are at a minimum or only for the Summer months, then once a year, especially for tapeworms, is usually fine.

I always use moxidectin in the Spring, since ivermectin kills beneficial dung beetles and those are most active in Spring and into early Summer. Then, Equimax roughly 6 months later.

A Power Pack has lots of resistance issues now, thanks to long-term over- and mis-used of it, along with the over- and mis-used of single doses for adult strongyles. Don’t bother doing it unless you’ve got that horse who can’t have moxidectin, and then you do the best you can.

@Iride

Also I will add a second Quest regular to make it 3x/year since we don’t rotate pasture

I wouldn’t do that unless you’ve got a FEC showing you need an additional deworming. I don’t rotate pastures either, and nearly all my FECs are low/clean

[Iride]

Thanks for these points, much appreciated.
So it sounds like your preferred plan is Quest Plus in Spring, then Equimax in Fall?

[JB]

Yep, QP in Spring, Equimax in Fall.

[Simkie]

@Iride

I do worry about resistance for sure. I may try your plan but would make sure it’s Quest Plus in the fall to cover tapeworms. Also I will add a second Quest regular to make it 3x/year since we don’t rotate pasture

Are you actually running fecals that are showing a load? Most horses do fine with twice yearly deworming. And no, encysted strongyles don’t show on a fecal, but they have to be there first to encyst.

I was SO surprised once I got my horses home and I started actually running fecals. I never bothered boarding because I controlled so few variables, I just didn’t see the value? But I was so excited once I could–I was going to run fecals and rotate fields and deworm very precisely and omg it was going to be so awesome! You know what I saw? Damned near nothing, ever. Fecal after fecal with nothing. One horse was a very light shedder, rarely. I manage them now exactly as I did boarding–twice yearly deworming, with Quest Plus in the spring and Equimax in the winter after a hard freeze. Ho-hum, nothing to see here. Was actually kind of a let down

In other words, don’t assume there’s a problem when there might not be, and definitely don’t overuse the few tools we have treating a problem that doesn’t exist.

[Iride]

@Simkie Haha. I firmly believe that half of what we do with/to horses we simply do “for ourselves”! In the end anyway.

Part of my…paranoia in this case, if you will, is that the pasture is at its max with horses, and the manure is harrowed but never picked. So, you can imagine the poop load. Not my farm. I love the farm in every way except for that. It’s probably 13 acres so no one is going in there to pick the poop lmaooooo.

But yes, we do fecals usually once a year, and for sure many have nothing but a few have high load. Seems some always do, some never do! But I still worry about the encysted strongyles developing insidiously over time.

[Simkie]

@Iride

But yes, we do fecals usually once a year, and for sure many have nothing but a few have high load. Seems some always do, some never do! But I still worry about the encysted strongyles developing insidiously over time.

Yep! This is normal. Most horses do fine maintaining a near nothing load. So target more aggressive treatment at the horses that DO need it, and use maintenance therapy for the rest. Using moxidectin once yearly is fine to address any “sneaky” encysting.

One size here definitely doesn’t fit all. It’s great that you’re running fecals–keep doing that to identify your problem children (who might change over time! Age, illness, stress, etc can all impact ability for individuals to manage their worm load) and treat their unique needs. It’s not an indication you need to carpet bomb the whole herd, that’ll work against you in the long run If you’re running fecals and finding your overall number of horses with high load is only increasing year over year, reassess…and then strongly consider anthelmintic resistance as a cause.

To ease your fears, you might like to do FECRT on your shedders. It’s how you measure how well your tools are working. Maybe something to add to your management?