Dover saddlery in trouble?

[mvp]

I can see why folks would think Dover might be over-extended, given its expansion of the bricks-n-mortar stores in the last few years and then the giant slowdown caused by the virus.

But! There are somethings Dover also did better while its new and winning challenger, Smartpak, was doing worse.

First, Dover figured out that it needed to make its shipping more inviting.

Second, over the last year or so, Smartpak decided to revamp its software or business’s organization such that returns and refunds took for…ever, as in more than 21 days. That meant that free returns on sized items could might involve you carried the balance on your credit card through your billing date. That made me feel like Smartpak was borrowing money from me because it had bad software. Enter Dover, who not only opened a store in my town but also took my returns there.

I’ll do business with the best business.

[akhunterrider]

I ordered two helmets to try from Smartpak a while back. They did an early refund on one, but it took several weeks to get the refund for the second helmet. At that time, they were still processing holiday refunds and this was in February. I have had a handful on issues with Smartpak the last few years. To the point where I will typically order from somewhere else. Every once in a while they have a sale I can’t pass up.

I had avoided ordering from Dover for several years and I don’t like in an area with one of their brick and mortar stores. However, I wanted an item that I could only find through them and not only was the shipping free, but my item went out the same day and I had it two days later. I definitely shop for low prices, but after my most recent experience, I wouldn’t hesitate to order from Dover again.

[trubandloki]

I will start shopping from Dover again when they give up the whole - different price in every catalog - theory.

[cheektwocheek]

I’ve had a love/hate relationship with Dover lately. Ordered a Rambo Optimo in Feb plus an extra liner. Got the liner, called and asked about the blanket, rep stated it was coming from a different wearhouse. A week later got an email saying the blanket was permanently out of stock until next fall.😒 Ordered a $$$ bit, received an email 5 days later about it being back ordered.

Why have items listed for sale if they are not in stock? Complete time wasters in my opinion.
My in store experiences are always pleasant but the prices are higher with very few sales.

[Linny]

Dover has not been sending lots of catalogs of late. They do send emails daily with different offers but I haven’t seen those catalogs with the different prices in years.

Cheektwocheek, I am told that Dover is now selling things that they don’t stock, but which the manufacturer will send direct to the customer. It lets them offer more things (or sizes of certain items) without having to stock them. That might have been the case with the bit.

[OnTheBitTack]

@LexInVA

That much is definitely true. They have been low-performing as a company for many years and their retail expansion was an ill-advised attempt to invigorate the company and brand in the face of heavy Internet competition and the in-person competition of show vendors that people tend to buy from, when they find good deals or need something ASAP. Like other retailers, many customers will go into a Dover store, look at things, then buy them online or from other sources, cutting down on store revenue. Physical retail locations really only work when you have a solid customer base that has to buy from you or wants to buy from you and it’s a niche business as it is, especially with the decline in Equestrian sports over the past twenty years.

I would like to point out that as mentioned above, Dover is in financial trouble and then also mentioned, sell product 30% less than competition. In such a competitive market, big box store drop their price because they have a substantial purchasing advantage over the small mom and pop shops. Its their way of hedging out the competition but it often back fires when its now expected. Businesses cannot sustain selling everything at 30% off. After overhead costs are paid, there is little to nothing left. I mostly support mom and pop shops. They are the ones that go the extra mile. They know their product and are willing to make a workable deal.

[mvp]

@trubandloki

I will start shopping from Dover again when they give up the whole - different price in every catalog - theory.

Wha…?

You mean things have different prices in print catalogues? Or do you mean that special/beautiful/devious/favored by God people can get their website to spit out different prices on-line? Just want to know if I should study up on Indulgences.

[NaturallyHappy]

@mvp

I can see why folks would think Dover might be over-extended, given its expansion of the bricks-n-mortar stores in the last few years and then the giant slowdown caused by the virus.

But! There are somethings Dover also did better while its new and winning challenger, Smartpak, was doing worse.

First, Dover figured out that it needed to make its shipping more inviting.

Second, over the last year or so, Smartpak decided to revamp its software or business’s organization such that returns and refunds took for…ever, as in more than 21 days. That meant that free returns on sized items could might involve you carried the balance on your credit card through your billing date. That made me feel like Smartpak was borrowing money from me because it had bad software. Enter Dover, who not only opened a store in my town but also took my returns there.

I’ll do business with the best business.

Ditto. I always have really great customer service from Dover. I have not had the same experience w Smartpak.

[JenEM]

@mvp

Wha…?

You mean things have different prices in print catalogues? Or do you mean that special/beautiful/devious/favored by God people can get their website to spit out different prices on-line? Just want to know if I should study up on Indulgences.

They used to, at least, have the same item at different item codes priced differently. So you could in theory search for the same halter and find it for $45, $50, and $30. I haven’t seen that lately, but I most often shop from them in person, because it’s one of my local retailers.

I have gotten excellent service when I’ve dealt with them in store, and as far as having the online chat look up store stock from me. I hate their priced-based shipping rates, but like the ship to store option. I also find it incredibly frustrating that they pretty much do not carry breeches in Long. There are numerous times I’d have bought a pair from them, but nope, not a thing that will fit and I end up purchasing elsewhere.

[Linny]

@JenEM

They used to, at least, have the same item at different item codes priced differently. So you could in theory search for the same halter and find it for $45, $50, and $30. I haven’t seen that lately, but I most often shop from them in person, because it’s one of my local retailers.

I have gotten excellent service when I’ve dealt with them in store, and as far as having the online chat look up store stock from me. I hate their priced-based shipping rates, but like the ship to store option. I also find it incredibly frustrating that they pretty much do not carry breeches in Long. There are numerous times I’d have bought a pair from them, but nope, not a thing that will fit and I end up purchasing elsewhere.

Have you asked about long options in store? My local store staff will look up what is available in “off” sizes and see if it’s available to order. One of my friends is 5’11 and needs extra tall boots and long breeches and she doesn’t like Tailoreds. My local store has been able to find stuff for her. If you order stuff through the store they usually don’t charge shipping, unless it’s something really big or heavy. Shipping to the store from the warehouse is free.

[add_leg]

I had an incredibly WEIRD experience with Dover recently.
Bought a Rambo flysheet off eBay for $130 (retail is $200, didn’t see online any less than $175 anywhere) - seller was some randomly named account, with 1 or 0 feedback, but I figured, eh, PayPal, whatever. Confirmed, paid, okay. Next day an e-mail from eBay saying they closed the seller’s acct due to suspiscious activity or something, but I could file a claim. Annoyed, but okay, I’ll do it later.

Fast forward three days, the fly sheet shows up - in FULL Dover branded packaging. With a Dover receipt. For $220. I went back and checked my account, nope, paid $130. Receipt has my name, address, etc.

I have no earthly idea what happened, but the flysheet fits my horse and I’ve moved on except for my total puzzlement.

[trubandloki]

@mvp

Wha…?

You mean things have different prices in print catalogues? Or do you mean that special/beautiful/devious/favored by God people can get their website to spit out different prices on-line? Just want to know if I should study up on Indulgences.

@JenEM

They used to, at least, have the same item at different item codes priced differently. So you could in theory search for the same halter and find it for $45, $50, and $30.

JenEM described it well. That could even happen in the same freaking catalog/flier. On one page the halter is $30 and some where else in there it is $45, same exact item.

So frustrating to have to dig around to make sure you were getting the best price. If you just searched for halters on the website it was always the $50 price, never the $30 or $45 price. But if you keyed in the code from the catalog that was with the $30 price then it came up as marked down to $30.

[Laurierace]

@GraceLikeRain

I find that dewormer, fly spray, treats, grooming supplies, etc. are a solid 30% more expensive at my local independent shop than through Dover.

Those products are sold at cost or even a loss in hopes of getting you to buy other stuff while you are there.

[js]

@Linny

…Cheektwocheek, I am told that Dover is now selling things that they don’t stock, but which the manufacturer will send direct to the customer. It lets them offer more things (or sizes of certain items) without having to stock them. That might have been the case with the bit.

The only thing I dislike about this is some stores then charge a restock fee if you want to return it because the return goes to them and not back to the manufacturer. I don’t know if that is true with Dover but it is with some other tack shops.

[mvp]

@add leg

I had an incredibly WEIRD experience with Dover recently.
Bought a Rambo flysheet off eBay for $130 (retail is $200, didn’t see online any less than $175 anywhere) - seller was some randomly named account, with 1 or 0 feedback, but I figured, eh, PayPal, whatever. Confirmed, paid, okay. Next day an e-mail from eBay saying they closed the seller’s acct due to suspiscious activity or something, but I could file a claim. Annoyed, but okay, I’ll do it later.

Fast forward three days, the fly sheet shows up - in FULL Dover branded packaging. With a Dover receipt. For $220. I went back and checked my account, nope, paid $130. Receipt has my name, address, etc.

I have no earthly idea what happened, but the flysheet fits my horse and I’ve moved on except for my total puzzlement.

It could be that a Dover employee was treating Dover as their wholesaler. That’s explicitly forgiven by Dover, of course. I don’t know if it makes sense in your story, but perhaps Dover figured out that someone was doing this and got Ebay to close that selling channel to them (among other things)?

[Linny]

@trubandloki

JenEM described it well. That could even happen in the same freaking catalog/flier. On one page the halter is $30 and some where else in there it is $45, same exact item.

So frustrating to have to dig around to make sure you were getting the best price. If you just searched for halters on the website it was always the $50 price, never the $30 or $45 price. But if you keyed in the code from the catalog that was with the $30 price then it came up as marked down to $30.

They don’t do it anymore. The idea was to get you to look at everything in the book, it’s not uncommon in primarily catalog based stores. The better pricing was a reward for signing up to get the catalog or now, the email. People get different pricing in stores all the time. Have a coupon? Get a better price. Have a promo code? Get the discount/bonus etc. It happens everywhere. Since Dover is now sending out 2 big catalogs a year and only 2 or 3 smaller ones, not sale based but new merch based, they are doing promo codes etc in daily emails.

[trubandloki]

@Linny

They don’t do it anymore. The idea was to get you to look at everything in the book, it’s not uncommon in primarily catalog based stores. The better pricing was a reward for signing up to get the catalog or now, the email. People get different pricing in stores all the time. Have a coupon? Get a better price. Have a promo code? Get the discount/bonus etc. It happens everywhere. Since Dover is now sending out 2 big catalogs a year and only 2 or 3 smaller ones, not sale based but new merch based, they are doing promo codes etc in daily emails.

I do not really think having a coupon is the same thing.

A coupon or a promo code usually applies to a group of items. 10% off all this brand breeches or Buy two of this and get that half off. What they did before required you to look for a code for every item you might buy. And since everything, everywhere was advertised like it was on sale (even though it was not) with a crossed out price and a reduced price it took some serious looking.
It always felt deceitful to me. I am glad to hear they are not doing it that way anymore.

[JenEM]

@Linny

Have you asked about long options in store? My local store staff will look up what is available in “off” sizes and see if it’s available to order. One of my friends is 5’11 and needs extra tall boots and long breeches and she doesn’t like Tailoreds. My local store has been able to find stuff for her. If you order stuff through the store they usually don’t charge shipping, unless it’s something really big or heavy. Shipping to the store from the warehouse is free.

They generally haven’t carried the, at all, though they’re starting to online. I’d rather spend my money at another, smaller shop if they’re just going to have to special order anyway.

[mychestnutvalentine]

@add leg

I had an incredibly WEIRD experience with Dover recently.
Bought a Rambo flysheet off eBay for $130 (retail is $200, didn’t see online any less than $175 anywhere) - seller was some randomly named account, with 1 or 0 feedback, but I figured, eh, PayPal, whatever. Confirmed, paid, okay. Next day an e-mail from eBay saying they closed the seller’s acct due to suspiscious activity or something, but I could file a claim. Annoyed, but okay, I’ll do it later.

Fast forward three days, the fly sheet shows up - in FULL Dover branded packaging. With a Dover receipt. For $220. I went back and checked my account, nope, paid $130. Receipt has my name, address, etc.

I have no earthly idea what happened, but the flysheet fits my horse and I’ve moved on except for my total puzzlement.

This has happened to me on ebay a few years ago. I have received a few Ogilvy half pads that I won for $60-$80 and received it brand new from Dover. My information and paid via their CC.
What the seller does is has a phony CC and pays with that. I believe the Paypal they use on ebay is fake too. So Dover and eBay end up with the losses. Hence why the ebay gets shut down almost immediately.

I had one sitiation where I opened a claim becauseI felt like the user was a scammer, got my money back from ebay and then still received the item from Dover that the ebay frauds had ordered… I’ll never understand the chain of events for that to occur.

[Crashing_Boar]

A lot of the quality there has really gone south lately, and the legacy brands are not what they were. Best example, “Horseware Ireland” blankets now made in China, and it shows. You’re lucky if you get 3 seasons out of them when the old ones were good for 20! Their clothing also seems cheesy, is all made foreign, and seems sized for kids.

Best comment evah (from male boarder): “Why the hell is a tack catalog nothing but women’s fashion?”

If they’re in financial trouble, trying to be “Vogue” crossed with “UnTacked” might be why. And as others have noted, the “sale” prices are bogus.

For WAY better deals on basic barn needs including meds, vax and dewormers as well as grooming needs, try either Jeffers Vet Supply or Valley Vet. They also carry dog and livestock stuff too! Sometimes they have super deals on short-dated dewormers if you’re lucky, and they do bulk orders which can’t be beat for the barn pro.

Blankets of similar or better quality to the English-market “name” brands can be had on any and all websites catering to the Western horse market, and they have draft, oversize, and mini too.

As my great-grandma used to say, “Spread your eyes!”