Downsizing to Mini farm- Need advice!

[jeniloohoo]

Hi everyone!

We have been 28 years at a 180 acre farm with miles of trails and plenty of pasture. We are moving to a suburb of a big city and our new farm is 3.6 acres! No access to trails, neighbors really close. It will be a huge transition. I have added an overhead shot, and will add pics when I return friday.

We have 3 horses in their late teens, one goat and chickens. We have to convert a HUGE chicken barn on the property to accommodate them. The property is really hilly, although there is a nice flat field for a ring. There are no fences, no water to the barn, no stalls, no tack room. So in many senses, we are starting from scratch. Money is tight.

We have to have them moved in 5 weeks. I would like to use this thread to ask random questions that pop up. I have read a lot about waterers, fencing, manure management, etc.

Right now we are focused on getting the back of the property cleared to make way for a pen where they will spend much of their time. I have a fence guy coming to give us an estimate on Ramm Horserail for the perimeter. This property has gullies that would be deathtraps if our babies escaped and the farm is on a busy road. So secure fencing is our biggest immediate concern. Of course our goat complicates things, but he is part of the herd, so we will probably have to add wire. Luckily the barn has electricity already.

I am trying to figure out if we should put in a frost free hydrant plus a Bar Bar A so we can make sure water is not an issue in January. Our barn is 2 stories, and the second floor is ground level near the house, but only 75 inches in height, so we probably have to put the horses in the ground floor, out back which is far from the house and will make the water issue even more complicated.

Looking for moral support and thoughts as I progress. It is a bit overwhelming having to do so much in such a short amount of time with very limited funds! After fencing, our second biggest issue is water. It is going to be tough to get water from the house as there is driveway, garage and an unground pool in the way. I will post pics soon.

Is there anything you have learned about downsizing that you can share? Any thoughts from mini farm owners housing 3 horses on basically 3.6 acres? We live in a frigid zone, so that will make it even more essential that we get it right. Thank you. This forum has been a lifesaver so far…

Jennie

[AKB]

Small acreage makes things tough. Many of the issues can be solved with money, but it isn’t easy without money. Access to shelter, water that doesn’t freeze, hay storage and good fencing, are priorities.

I would have two frost free hydrants put in, one of which is inside the barn. If your barn needs a lot of work, building a run in shed will allow you time to work on the barn. Put it in your sacrifice area, if you can. The sacrifice area needs to have good fencing. That will allow you extra time to work on affording and putting in the perimeter fencing. Think about electricity and having outlets with plenty of power for a trough heater and bucket heaters. An outlet and water hydrant near your sacrifice area and run in shed will be very useful.

Make sure you think about your layout. How will you remove manure? How will you get hay delivered? Where will the farrier work.

Good luck. Have been in your shoes, and it was not easy.

[jeniloohoo]

Thanks AKB. Good advice. We are really fortunate, in that there is a driveway to the barn and then along the south side to the back. I will post pics so folks can visualize things. The barn will allow plenty of room for hay, etc. It is just kind of awkward as the easy access for them is at the back of the property, far from the house which will be tough in the winter with 4-5 feet of snow on the ground. We are getting a plow for it.

The barn in the back ground floor is concrete. So for this first phase, we will make it a run in by putting up corral panels and rubber mats. I think you are right to start with hydrants and use our heated tank (they paw the darn thing and it is a mess, but we can be pretty sure they’ll have water…).

These guys have been together for 16 years, so we don’t really need stalls, but I might try to buy some stall dividers and put those up to avoid rolling issues with the corral panels. We have had nice gravel/mat run in stalls all these years. Concrete is not optimal for dealing with their comfort and the water issue.

[ElementFarm]

I grew up keeping 2 horses on about 4 acres in southern Maine. I was young so everything was still exciting and doable. I could never do it now

Winter was the worst. Figure out how you’re going to get manure to the manure pile in 2 feet of snow. Having an easily shovelled/blown path to the barn from the house is essential. We ran hoses from the house to the barn for water most of the year. Winter meant I had to take up the whole hose and put it someplace above freezing (the garage) or carry hot water from the house. You also need to have a place to keep tack from freezing and all the misc shampoos/hoof oils/vet supplies/fly sprays during the winter, as once they freeze, the bottles split and make a mess. (so maybe a designated tack area in the garage or a spare bedroom?)

I didn’t have a ring as our land was too hilly. I was able to access logging trails by riding down the rural roads. Now things are built up too much to do that safely.

Fencing was an issue for us as well. Very ledge-y area, so no way to do fenceposts in some places without blasting. It also had to be deer-safe, as they will run right through electric (ask me how I know). We ended up going with a vinyl-coated no-climb wire with a top rail. It worked just fine for the few years we were there.

At a certain point, I moved and commercially boarded so I could have access to an indoor, as it just didn’t work not riding 2-3 months a year. Now we live South and have a farm again. It’s hot and humid now but I sure don’t miss those New England winters. Good Luck with the downsizing!

[jeniloohoo]

Thanks for your thoughts Elementfarm! I envy your southern move! Maybe when the kids are out of school! I cannot imagine dragging the hose from the house for a whole year!

Manure removal is on my mind. We have a slope on the north side of the barn, so we can just dump and then remove it with the tractor periodically. We have a big spreader that eventually I’d like to put there with a big ramp, platform. But that is a phase 3-4 detail.

I have about $8-10K to spend. That probably sounds like nothing to some and a fortune to others. That needs to cover getting water from the house to barn, getting stalls in the barn or at least converting part of the barn to a run in, fencing, mats, etc. Luckily we have about 150’ of corral panels to bring down and 8 gates varying in size from a 6’ walkthrough to 16’ electrified corral gates. The panels should cover the sacrifice area/pen near the barn and the gates should cover all the paddocks and pasture areas as well as the pen.

So far my budget is

$700 -land clearing (He will also dig posts for the corral panels for the pen area)
$1,000- water
$2,800- stalls/mats
$4,000-fencing

Worried my fence estimate is too little. I could go to no climb with a top rail of Horserail and electric. I saw a few pics here of folks that have done that and it looked very nice.

ETA_ Just found 3 used stall fronts/dividers/window grills almost new for a decent price so pretty excited. And found a plumber who knows how to install frost hydrants, and will do so in a few weeks, so fencing is biggest unknown now.

[spacytracy]

We have three ponies on about 2 acres of fenced pasture. We are on 4 acres total.

They have a three stall barn, where everything is stored. I have a small sacrifice pen that they go on pretty much every day from November-April. That part is essential. During summer months, I often put them in the sacrifice area for a week at a stretch to just let the grass rest.

What I used to do (and probably should again) is seperate the 2 acres into 3 sections and rotate every three weeks or so.

[SLW]

Do share a photo of the layout when time allows. I’m wondering if you can run water half-way down to the barn for now and use a stock tank heater. Then next summer when funds might be freer run water the rest of the way to the barn and complete the set up.

I can’t imagine dealing with months of snow on the ground so some sort of pit where I could push it out of the way would seem ideal.

[AKB]

Don’t forget to put $1000 in the budget for stone dust or pea gravel in the part of the sacrifice area next to the run in area.

I would run all of the water at once. When you have 3’ of snow, or an ice storm, you will want that water hydrant and electric buckets in the barn as well as in the usual spot in the field. I have had my hydrant in the field freeze when we have had freezing rain and snow. I strongly dislike carrying water to the barn by hand in 3’ of snow. Make sure your electric line will handle a trough heater. Our circuit breaker turns the electric off in extreme cold if we use a trough heater. The electric buckets draw less electricity so are better for us.

[jeniloohoo]

That is all excellent advice! I overlooked that. Most of the sacrifice area/pen does have a gravel base! But you are right to add more into the budget, as I am expanding the size of it. The contractor clearing the area just called and will start Monday or Tuesday. I am so excited! This area could potentially allow us to use this as a small ring, so for footing you recommend stone dust or pea gravel?

After your suggestions yesterday, I found a plumber and asked for 2 frost hydrants. He is going to put a heater on the line from the house (an extra $150) that we only plug in IF the line freezes. He knows what he is doing, so he said this was just an insurance measure, which I think sounds great. If I cannot get the hydrant in the barn (concrete floor already there), I will build something around it. There is an awesome frame made of 4 x 4’s sitting in that area that I will move, still a roof and siding on and insulate.

Thank you for your thoughts about the trough versus buckets. I am extremely mindful of the snow issue! We will have our electrician check things over. I probably have to add a bit for electricity in the budget, but we do have lighting and outlets there.

I am hoping I have time to finish off a tack room, so our poor barn cats can be warm. One is tamed and one is feral and they have always come into our home through a dog door from Dec to March, but our new house will not have that option. So I need to add a little for a door, insulation and a heater. CL is my friend…

The budget just rose since yesterday.

I am financing this with a windfall. My uncle died 22 years ago, and my dad found an unclaimed account online! So he is giving me some of it. I initially told him I needed $5k but have upped it to $10k. I encourage all of you to look online for unclaimed money. I found $1,000 of my own a few years ago!

I will post pictures of the place tomorrow when we head back there.

I can’t tell you how much i appreciate your time, insight and experience. Thank you!

[QUOTE=AKB;8250476]
Don’t forget to put $1000 in the budget for stone dust or pea gravel in the part of the sacrifice area next to the run in area.

I would run all of the water at once. When you have 3’ of snow, or an ice storm, you will want that water hydrant and electric buckets in the barn as well as in the usual spot in the field. I have had my hydrant in the field freeze when we have had freezing rain and snow. I strongly dislike carrying water to the barn by hand in 3’ of snow. Make sure your electric line will handle a trough heater. Our circuit breaker turns the electric off in extreme cold if we use a trough heater. The electric buckets draw less electricity so are better for us.[/QUOTE]

[Wonders12]

How tall are your horses? Most of the barns here are converted cow barns with low ceilings. I’m not sure, but I would guess they’re about 75 inches. At first they made me really nervous, but the horses do well in them.

We have one barn like that and we cap it off at 16hh + a few horses who are just over but naturally carry their heads lower. Other barns keep all of their horses in these barns.

High ceilings are always preferable, but if the upper level is really going to make your life a lot easier, I wouldn’t rule it out.

[jeniloohoo]

[QUOTE=Wonders12;8250616]
How tall are your horses? Most of the barns here are converted cow barns with low ceilings. I’m not sure, but I would guess they’re about 75 inches. At first they made me really nervous, but the horses do well in them.

We have one barn like that and we cap it off at 16hh + a few horses who are just over but naturally carry their heads lower. Other barns keep all of their horses in these barns.

High ceilings are always preferable, but if the upper level is really going to make your life a lot easier, I wouldn’t rule it out.[/QUOTE]

I have to measure. I have thought this way. The floors are plywood. I like the concrete on the lower level. I did have a brainstorm 2 days ago of getting a contractor to cut a small 4’ door into the lower level on the side, which would allow us pretty good entry, near the front. But it is on the north side, which will be tough in the winter. I will measure the ceilings. I don’t know how I could do water on the second floor, with the 1st floor so exposed. I can have the hydrant outside, which is located on the east.

I am looking forward to posting pictures, so you folks can visualize even more. You all have such great wisdom!

ps- I am dying to go to Costa Rica! Sailed from WA to New England through Panama Canal, but did not get to CR on that trip!

[jeniloohoo]

I found a decent image on google earth to offer a birds eye view. What this does not show is the topography. The barn is located on a rise. Around it are steep gullies on the north and south sides (long sides). The east is the house side, behind the pool, and the west is where our sacrifice area will be, and there are 2 working large barn exterior doors. Our house is also on a rise. The backyard goes down a slope. The property is pie shaped and goes all the way down to the small river. Unfortunately the land going down to the river is also a steep gully. But this suburban property is zoned farm and forest and allows us 1 horse per acre, so we can have 3.6 equines, which means I might end up again with a rescue mini or donk. lol

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7369112,-70.2844286,71m/data=!3m1!1e3

[walkers]

If you are running water to frost frees t a cheap way to get warm water is to add a instant (forget what its called) on demand water heater. I had that in a 10 stall barn and could flip a switch on fuse box to turn it on as needed. No need to haul water and very cheap to do especially if you are running new lines.
In my new place I couldn’t run underground pipe to the sacrifice area but when the house was built they ran the hot water line to a outside facet. It wasn’t a farm but maybe they did that for dog washing? who knows but its great as the water is so hot(50 gallon gas water heater in the house) that it will melt ice in a stock tank. works really well as long as you do it daily when its bitterly cold.
Do everything to makes life as easy as possible. I have the sacrifice area very close to the house and store my feed in the garage. I went from a huge barn to run-in with one stall for emergencies. I put a overhang on existing outbuilding and thats for the farrier and small equipment storage. I have 3 acres of pasture and for ten yrs. now have managed to keep it healthy by having a lovely sacrifice area , the run-in can be used in there or move a gate and its available for pasture days…. I have 3 horses and takes very little time to feed.
Visualize your day and imagine doing your chores and then build your property around that, run through it all in your head first before you build a thing.
I added a ten foot overhang to the run=in and so 3 horses could use a 20X14 run-in, they love the overhang and use it more than going deep in the shed except to escape flies. Also keeps the dominant horse from kicking the others out.

[Cindyg]

My 1.5 horses are on 1.5 acres. (We have a bit more room for the house, yard, driveway, etc., and some under water.) Random thoughts:

I love my breezy open barn with rubber mats (discourages using the barn as a toilet) and automatic waterer.

I wish I had cross fenced. For years I thought my property was too small to cross fence. I have come to understand that is incorrect. You’ll get far more use out of your land and protect it better if you cross fence, and rotate them off a section before they over graze it.

Think about moving tractors and trailers through your gates. Make them big enough.

Put some human step-over or walk-through areas in your internal fences – narrow openings that you can conveniently get through. Nothing is more annoying than having to walk all the way around a pasture to get something that is only a few yards away from you (if the fence weren’t there).

On the upside, the horses are always nearby. Every time I open the door, they’re aware of me. Every time I walk to the barn, they join me. That’s nice.

Where to ride is going to be a problem. You said you were going to put in a ring, which I don’t have; though I do have a round pen. If I make more than two laps in my pasture, it seems to kill the grass under the horse’s hooves. I so wish I had a proper riding arena.

Anyway, good luck to you. I do love having my horses right under my nose.

[Miss_Motivation]

Well you have a lot to do and good ideas and advisors! Horsekeeping can vary so much with where you live… we have 50 horses on 5 acres on the west coast- it’s so different than your area, but there is no grazing and we laugh that we have climate, not weather…

In the midst of all the activities getting ready to have your horses arrive, don’t lose sight of the fact that it might take awhile to realize the tradeoffs of a smaller place. Your current farm sounds great but that must be a huge amount of work and responsibility with that much land.

Betcha you’ll be surprised how well and quickly all your animals settle in, and soon you may find yourself enjoying a simpler lifestyle with some time to enjoy new things and relax a bit more.

Here’s hoping…!

[jeniloohoo]

Miss Motivation, I cannot imagine 50 horses on 5 acres, lol. THANK YOU for keeping this in perspective for me!!! You are so right about 188 acres. It has been stressful. Probably the hardest thing has been keeping poachers off. I was at our new property yesterday and I think if we can get decent grass in the 2 area which are pretty wasted currently, we should be fine.

Cindyg, the fence guy came yesterday and I am doing a perimeter fence, and will do cross fencing inside it. I appreciate that advice very much.

Walkers, I agree about the run in and the overhang. I think next year when we are settled I will try to get the husband and boys to help me build one, right smack dab close to the fence line facing the house. Then I can see them all the time.

The land clearing guy did a lot of cleanup in 2 hours. I am hoping he’ll finish up tomorrow in 2 more hours, and we will rent a chipper to get rid of all the brush. My daughter and I removed a ton of junk, a plow, an oil tank, and at least 100’ of wire fencing and an old chicken coop. So, the sacrifice area is coming along!

I am waiting nervously for the fencing quote. We are looking at no climb or Horse rail. My pen will be the 200’ of corral panels we have. I have something like 12 gates from this farm, in varying lengths and types, so that should help with the cost of things…I took pictures, and have to figure out how to post here.

[jeniloohoo]

Well I am making progress since I started this thread. Every post has helped me!

I was able to get our pen/sacrifice area cleared for $400, so I am under budget for that. My kids were wonderfully helpful in working with me to clear away old chicken wire and runs that were woven with Hawthorn, roses and other lovely brush, tons of debris and old metal junk. Just gross unpleasant work esp in this humidity and heat. We clipped many saplings and I used our DR trimmer on the low brush like raspberries and thistle.

My biggest angst was putting them in the back of the barn on the first level, farthest from our house. I decided to go ahead with that because the sacrifice area borders trees, offers shade, privacy and is on very high ground with at least 50% of it already graveled. I kept a 60’ hedgerow of brush to keep privacy for our neighbors, us and the horses. The hedgerow is on the north side of the pen/sacrifice area, so it will serve as a wind block. In the fall, we will plant arborvitae on the north side of that brush, to increase the protection from those bitter winter winds.

I decided to look for a used ATV and found one tonight asking price $1,500, a 2003 Honda Rancher 350 es in mint condition. He is willing to take $1,200 for it, so I will be able to get a plow for it. Pretty excited. Now I can zip back and forth from our house, the up and down barn, around the fields, along the fence line and down to the river. We decided this was a better use of money right now, than retrofitting the up barn for the horses (the ceilings are too low, the floors are not strong enough and it would take too much time and money at this juncture). The down barn is now very accessible with my cheap little ATV! I pick the ATV up wed evening.

We have a big old 2wd John Deere with a brush hog and pto. For now, we will keep it. It is NOT the right tractor for this property, but it keeps me close to budget by just purchasing a used ATV.

I am researching a gravel company tonight and hope to get them to bring a load or two delivered this week. I found used culverts for $80 each on CL to use in the low parts of the fields where we will need to put cross fencing to create paddocks.

A friend is lending us a 16’ flat bed trailer so we can pick up our stalls and mats this weekend. I am very excited to get them!

I still have not had time to post pictures. I will try to set up an album somewhere.

Things are coming together quickly!

[hosspuller]

WELCOME TO NC … Daughter lives in Pinnacle so We get up your way often.

Since you have a tractor, consider running the water lines yourself. A single point sub soiler will bury a water line 8 to 12 inches. That’s all that 's needed around here. In 15 years, never had the water to the pastures freeze.

[twelvegates]

[QUOTE=hosspuller;8256779]
WELCOME TO NC … Daughter lives in Pinnacle so We get up your way often.[/QUOTE]

Is OP in NC or in Maine???

[jeniloohoo]

[QUOTE=hosspuller;8256779]
WELCOME TO NC … Daughter lives in Pinnacle so We get up your way often.

Since you have a tractor, consider running the water lines yourself. A single point sub soiler will bury a water line 8 to 12 inches. That’s all that 's needed around here. In 15 years, never had the water to the pastures freeze.[/QUOTE]
THANK YOU for the welcome! Sadly, we are in the Arctic Tundra of MAINE! Our frost line is 5-6 feet!!! Sob.