We went to Ortho today and had xrays done. I’ve known for awhile that I have DDD in my L4 and L5 vertebrae but now there is nothing that can be done. It is inoperable and because of the compression, Dr feels injections will have no effect as it is bone on bone. If it was any other vertebrae, he said there would be options but now it is just pain management. I’m only 41 and his prognosis was not very comforting. However, I appreciated his honesty instead of shooting rainbows up my ass lol
So does anyone on here have this issue? Are you able to still ride? The L4 and L5 vertebrae are the last vertebrae in the spinal column before the pelvis so having DDD here is not like having it in the cervical or thoracic vertebrae.
I can barely bend over or backwards very far. I can’t sit with my legs out in front of me like in a chair. I can’t stand or walk for long periods without pain. I can’t lie down without pain.
I am concerned because my sole income is from my boarding facility and I had hopes of expanding, but I can’t imagine what my back will be like when I am able to do that. I’m not running a big operation so I can’t afford to hire someone nor am I able to give free board in exchange for work.
I am unsure of what this means for my horses, my riding, my future. If anyone else has experienced this in specifically their L4 and L5 (the most weight bearing of the vertebrae as well as the vertebrae that helps you to bend) please let me know what you’re doing to help alleviate the pain.
My dr prescribed voltaren pills and water therapy and has sent me to pain management. I won’t take narcotics so we are hoping the voltaren pills will help. I know nothing will fix this and it will get worse so I’m trying to enjoy my life now before it does get to the point that I’m in a wheelchair.
Thanks for your help 
Get another opinion what you wrote about what he told you makes no sense.
There is help for what you have so there something wrong with this story.
What I find so odd and I have been quilty of it to is we think our doctors know everything, in what other field would we just believe what the “expert” says and not go looking for other opinions.
Really get some more help you don’t have to live like you are living. I have been in pain managment for yrs soi am not a doctor but been around enough to know you need some better help.
I agree with getting a second opinion. My husband had seen a neuro surgeon yesterday for bone spurs and bulging discs in his L4/5, and that Dr told him there was nothing to be done and suck it up. Didn’t offer anything to help alleviate the pain. I told him to ask for another referral to a different Dr.
I am starting to have back issues and am going to see a manipulative Osteopathic doctor. See if you can find one in your area. The last person I want to see is an ortho guy who just wants to cut on me. There are good doctors and there are bad ones out there. Talk with folks, figure out who the good ones are. Get a second and even a third opinion.
Actually this is the 3rd Dr that has said this. I was diagnosed with DDD several years ago but because I have a birth defects in my L5, surgery will not help. Several years ago when we first found out, I did PT meds exercise to help. Well 3 years ago I went to a different Dr when I moved out here because the pain was getting worse. That Ortho said the same thing, it will get progressively worse and because of my defect, surgery is not an option. Do the Dr I saw today was yet a different Dr (different insurance so different dr) and was told that there was nothing they could do because of the position of my L5. He said pain meds, PT and possibly injections might help with the pain but it will only mask the condition, which will get worse even still.
I had seen a chiro earlier in the year and she looked bewildered (for lack of a better word) when she saw my xrays.
So while there might be things that can minimize some of the pain, there isn’t anything they can do to fix it, mostly because of my L5 abnormality.
I have DDD as well, though not as advanced as you.
Last year I had a bad episode that had me in severe debilitating pain for months.
After nothing else worked I got the book “How to Treat your own back” and did the simple exercises religiously. They got me back on my feet and eventually riding again.
Massages can also do wonders.
Nothing can truly fix it, but maybe those tips can help.
Have you done any research on stem cells? I know someone with a similar issue and this is the route he is going.
Also, for pain control, have you talked to your doctor about Neurontin (Gabapentin)? I’ve known a couple of people who had really good luck with this drug for DDD pain control. It was really like a miracle drug and made them much more comfortable.
I feel your pain, literally… You need to talk to a neuro surgeon. I had severe compression at L4-5 from stenosis. I had all your symptoms for years. The surgeon cut the back half of my vertebrae off to make room for the nerves, then bolted them together.I was off pain meds. in two weeks and riding in 6 months. I have permanent nerve damage (weakness) but pain is gone. Good luck
MY DH has had 5 back surgeries yes 5 and is a PT and is still riding though I fear a fall.
Anyway new things on the horizon, do some research into Regenerative Medicine, very cutting edge but it is being done on backs. May be the answer we all are looking for with our hips,knees and ankles but right now they are doing it just for strokes, heart and BACKS.
Thats all i know it is stem cell but your stem cell.
A congenital problem wouldn’t make any difference Maybe…
Its experimental but low risk since its not surgery and its your tissue.
Let us know if you find out anything.
My L5/S1 has been trouble since i could spell the word so I will be looking into it also.
Medicine is really changing but u need to be near a large cutting edge Medical schools.
don’t give up and see young docs for the above reasons.
Ask your dr about having an artificial disc replacement. As long as you haven’t had a laminectomy yet, you should be a candidate. It better than a permanent fusion. You will still have your mobility in your vertabrae and facet joints.
Thanks everyone. These are all helpful suggestions. It gives me hope to hear others are able to still ride
I am 28 and was just diagnosed with DDD throughout my entire back. For the past 8 months I have been dealing with a herniated L5 and bulging L4 & L3. I have blacked out twice due to pain level. Painkillers (hydrocodone) did not help at all. Meloxicam helped for the first month and then it seems I built a resistance.
I just did my first ESI this week… I am three days post injection and pain is significantly worse, though my understanding is that will subside within the next two weeks.
Chiro is saying I need to seriously consider limiting my involvement in riding, become a trail rider, and do no more than walk-trot.
Ortho is saying riding isn’t going to make it worse. It’s genetics and any disc could herniate at any time, so why avoid doing what I love.
I have been out of the saddle since Mother’s Day last year due to sheer pain.
Anyone with thoughts?
Oohh, 2DR, that is so not fair at only 28!! Darn, so sorry. I think it is pretty normal to feel worse a few days after an ESI. There is now more pressure from the volume of the cortisone they put in there. It does get (lots) better. I used to work in Pain Management myself, where they do the injections, besides being a patient. Most people need all three injections for it to really work. My back did not feel much better until after the third one.
Codiene is a rough pain killer to take. It makes lots of people nauseous. I find Ultram with two Motrin or Tylenol and/or small doses of Neurontin (a med specifically for nerve pain) to be best. Best wishes and please keep us updated! Big Huggies to you!
Check out the Gokhale method. It’s basically a way to do gentle traction on your spine in everyday life and a guide to better alignment and strength. It’s was very helpful to me when I herniated a disc to get it to heal fast. I was turned on to it by a friend who has severe spine issues from a car accident that they have to manage. My friend has been able to stay very active despite like 6 bulging discs and a smushed vertebrae that was rebuilt with chicken wire and metal rods 15 years ago. I’ve seen her x-rays and MRIs and they are awful! But she skis black diamonds all winter long and mountain bikes all summer using this, massage and a chiro (I don’t really believe in chiros but hey, it seems to work for her). It’s not perfect and she still has pain but she’s amazingly active.
They do webinairs too.
Second opinion for sure. I have no idea why he says it’s inoperable just because its L4-5. In fact,that’s the most common place that people need spine surgery. Without your MRI I’m only guessing but it sounds like you just need to find a different doctor. Plus,pain doctors can do things other than injections,at least the good ones can. RFA,implanted morphine pumps,implanted electrostimulators.
Did he even suggest you take gabapentin and get PT?
Core strengthening and yoga should help a great deal both with or without surgery.
Update from me is that I am scheduled for micro discectomy on 2/25.
My back ultimately “rejected” the first injection. I walked into the clinic experience a 6/10 of pain (basically, daily aching with electric shock spikes when I step or twist wrong, plus weeks of 8/10 pain when I do something I shouldn’t - like volunteer for barn duty on Christmas day).
After the injection, I spent three weeks at 10/10 pain. Painkillers took me to a 9/10 and away from my vasovargal response ledge. At my followup appointment, doc said we basically added fuel to a raging fire, and that my body is saying there just isn’t room in the disc to be injecting fluid.
I am nervous jumping to surgery, but considering I am now at 9+ months of no riding, can no longer run without aggravating back, and the timing is right in terms of work and family travel for the 3 month recovery, it seems like the right thing to do.
Celebrated my 29th birthday on the 26th and less than a week later get signed up for back surgery. Nothing better to make you feel so OLD.
DH had a spinal fusion of his L4/L5. The round part of his L4 had broken off the rest of the spine and was sitting on L5. He had rods and mesh. He had it done 10/6/2014. He is doing great. It has not really affected his flexibility. It has gotten rid of his awful pain.
OP- I understand that you have a defect also but I am still surprised that they can’t fuse it especially since it is one level.
DH had a local orthopedic surgeon do it but had a second opinion at Rothman Institute. Rothman is our local BIG orthopedic group. They are the docs for all the local pro sports teams.
As part of his original diagnosis process he sent them his history, xrays and they round tabled his case to determine which doctor for him to see. Due to his original symptoms everyone thought hip since that is what hurt and he did not initially have anything that radiated down the leg. His hip xray also showed a cyst in his hip socket but it shouldn’t have been causing the amount of pain he was having. In the long run it wasn’t.
Basic point is I wonder if some place like Rothman could do a remote review of your records and determine if you might be a candidate for surgery. If so, then you could go to them for an in person exam or they may know of a surgeon more local that could do the surgery.
I had a L5-S1 fusion at 30 due to degenerative changes. That is coming up on 3 years ago this June. I had mine done by a local orthopaedic that did lots of this procedure. I have the poly cage, rods and screws, with a bit of bone from my hip. Before that, I did injections and chiro, but it got to the point where it didn’t help.
Surgery was Tuesday, I went home Thursday - I can’t take any pain meds, so I told them I could take Tylenol and be cranky in my own home, where I wouldn’t get MRSA, lol. My rehab was textbook and I was back on a horse in 6 months. Originally was told I’d be in a brace for 7, but I was a good patient!
My range of motion has actually improved, since I don’t nearly pass out when I bend now. I can ride without issue, including sitting trot on my big-moving mare. I did have my first fall last fall, and landed on my butt. All was still fine. And I wiped out Tuesday on the ice. That one hurt, but not due to the back!
OSTEOPATHY!!!
You owe it to yourself to get a second opinion from an Osteopathic doctor!
I am just 7 weeks out from surgery on L4 and L5. I was on pills before surgery and nothing helped. Just off of a 4 pound restriction. All I can say at this point is that now the cyclobenzaprine and tramadol help and they didnt help at all before surgery. \
I will be on a horse in a week.
Will find out if I made a mistake with the surgery or not.
I was measured. My “backwards bend” is a whopping 5 degrees.
