Dressage scene in different states-relocating

[OceansAway]

Hello,

My husband and I are likely relocating, and we are trying to narrow down some states of interest. If we stay east (Massachusetts currently), we are looking at Vermont, Maine, or parts of Virginia, and if we go west, we are thinking northern California, Oregon, or Washington. We would be looking for more rural areas, as a reference point, though a reasonable proximity to bigger cities is fine. We just don’t want to drive 5 minutes and end up in a densely populated area.

That being said, I am curious if there are any particular areas that are dressage-friendly, with some trainers to choose from, without having to haul all over the place. I am a 3rd level rider, so I would be looking for trainers that could help me reach my goals of continuing up the levels with my young horse. Any insight, opinions, or advice would be really great. Thanks!

[DawnJL]

I’m in Vermont so can speak to my area. I’m in northern Addison county and we have a pretty robust dressage community in the Chittenden/Addison county area in particular with plenty of other good dressage folks scattered throughout the state. There are excellent schooling shows in the area plus USDF shows (primarily at GMHA). Vermont has a surprisingly high per capita number of USDF gold medal riders. We have some good breeders in the area, too.

I’m in Ferrisburgh which is 45 minutes from Burlington (the largest city in VT) but only 5 minutes from the tiny city of Vergennes (town sized, but has city government structure) and 20 minutes from Middlebury. This means we are rural, but still have access to small shops and grocery stores and can get to what passes for a metropolitan area in VT in a reasonable amount of time.

I grew up in RI in a densely populated suburb of Providence and lived in Boston for a few years after college and have no desire to live near densely populated areas now, though I still enjoy occasional visits I love the rural nature of this area of VT that still has an accessible small metro area for shopping, dining, good medical care, etc. (For bigger metro access, Boston is 4 1/2 hours drive and Montreal is less than 2 hours.)

My husband and I often vacation in Maine. The dressage community is much thinner there than here in Vermont as far as I can tell.

Additional note: Climate change is already disrupting the west coast with drought, wildfires, etc. so that is a factor to consider with OR, WA, or northern CA.

[J-Lu]

You said that if you go west, the entire coastline is up for grabs! That’s a huge swath of the country!! I don’t know your budget but CA is very expensive and has a great dressage scene. From north to south you can live more central and eastward to live in a rural community. If you have millions, you can find a nice remote place closer to a city (within 1 hour drive) where dressage scenes are absolutely hopping and are super strong! (I’m thinking between Marin County (SF Bay area) and San Diego) OR and WA are relatively less expensive and are wetter. I know there’s a pretty strong dressage community around Eugene and Portland. The eastern sides of the states are much dryer and cheaper, but I think have more of a “Western” flavor. I don’t know the local dressage scene. Try contacting the local USDF affiliate the Group Member Organization (the GMO) to see what is going on there.

Virginia also has a strong dressage scene but it is a pricey state, at least in the east. There are definitely more rural areas in the state. You might want to contact the local GMOs (or visit their websites) and see what trainer is where and where the shows are at these days.

Good Luck!

[Turntable]

So Cal is a dressage mecca, there are amazing top professionals but somehow it is also very down to earth and welcoming. There are a lot of excellent local trainers and there are a lot of good amateurs and juniors so classes fill at most shows. You will have many peers there. And the shows are fun and there are tons of them, it’s easy to get out and get experience and see different judges, sometime you can just hack to a show and very often trailer 20-30 minutes. The weather is great, there are lots of trails with good footing and lots of boarding options at different price points. Barns area relatively affordable and chilled out north and east of LA and San Diego and quite acceptable to just take clinics and lessons and not be in full training but be competitive. There also used to be a good scene in the Malibu mtns which I think you would have loved but the fires has damaged that community, which is very sad. Facilities get more expensive and more east coast “training board” only style as you near the cities or the old “enclave” style beach communities between LA and SD. Housing is insane all over but you know that.

There is some dressage in the Central Valley but not much and you are hours from everything and it’s hot. And I mean HOT. Be aware that all the real estate photos are taken during the 3 moths the grass is green and not brown and dead, lol. Sac/ Bay Area has a better scene but it’s not great- you are getting into east coast style boarding costs and I personally find the Bay Area dressage scene not-so-fun and more snooty and without the really strong amateur/ local pro component you likely want. There is no scene between Sacramento and Portland. Hardly any vets or farriers either fyi. There is more of a do it yourself scene in Oregon and southern WA and more and more trainers from CA are heading north to buy property. But there are still limited showing opportunities (people go to Canada or LA for big shows). Then Seattle I’ve heard is similar to the Bay Area- long commutes, few barns, hig boarding costs and lots of rich people buying horses that their trainers ride.

Ultimately though dressage finals are not held in CA so if you want to compete nationally you will end up travelling back east but most people cross that bridge when they come to it.

If I were you and had a high housing budget I would look at Ventura County, CA. If not I would look at Virginia/ East Coast I think, unless you like to ride indoors a lot in the winter!

[sparkygrace]

@Turntable

There is no scene between Sacramento and Portland. Hardly any vets or farriers either fyi.

Excuse me? This is not true. Maybe northern California is a dressage desert, but not western Oregon. I would suggest the OP check the Oregon Dressage Society website to see how much is going on in Oregon. There are USDF/USEF shows in the Willamette Valley and southern Oregon, with easy access to shows in Portland. A person could show at at least eight approved shows within a two hour or less drive. Excellent vets and farriers are available and the Oregon State Vet school is conveniently located in Corvallis. Clinicians from California are regularly scheduled at local facilities.

Areas outside Salem, Corvallis, and Eugene and north to Portland are very “horsey” and there are beautiful horse properties. They aren’t cheap, but certainly not California prices. Yes, winter is rainy, but indoor arenas are plentiful. Summers are the best in the country. Warm and low humidity.

[J-Lu]

@Turntable

How much, in your opinion, does it cost to 1) purchase a house in SoCal and 2) board a horse in SoCal.

Yes, there’s a lot in the MTS east of Malibu-ish, LA, the Moorpark area if you have millions to spend. You find the Bay Area dressage scene “snooty”? Do you honestly think people in OR go to Canada or Los Angeles for shows? I highly suspect most ammies don’t have your budget and the OP has yet to disclose if they can buy a remote place around Moorpark.

How odd…do you have a problem with riding indoors in the winter? So many people do it without problem.

I stand by my comments that it would take millions at retirement to follow your plan. Please tell me if I’m wrong and please provide examples. Maybe the OP has many millions to spend and can retire to SoCal and bring her horses/show dressage/work with SoCal priced trainers on a regular basis.

[atlatl]

@sparkygrace

@Turntable

There is no scene between Sacramento and Portland. Hardly any vets or farriers either fyi.

Excuse me? This is not true. Maybe northern California is a dressage desert, but not western Oregon. I would suggest the OP check the Oregon Dressage Society website to see how much is going on in Oregon. There are USDF/USEF shows in the Willamette Valley and southern Oregon, with easy access to shows in Portland. A person could show at at least eight approved shows within a two hour or less drive. Excellent vets and farriers are available and the Oregon State Vet school is conveniently located in Corvallis. Clinicians from California are regularly scheduled at local facilities.

Areas outside Salem, Corvallis, and Eugene and north to Portland are very “horsey” and there are beautiful horse properties. They aren’t cheap, but certainly not California prices. Yes, winter is rainy, but indoor arenas are plentiful. Summers are the best in the country. Warm and low humidity.

Interesting, as I would agree with @Turntable on this. We almost moved to Ashland and one of the several reasons we decided against it was the apparent limited dressage opportunities. I had asked an FEI judge I know in the area and she pointed me to one possible facility. I did check out the ODS website too.

Granted, I’m in So Cal so am admittedly spoiled.

Where are you located?

[atlatl]

@J-Lu

@Turntable

How much, in your opinion, does it cost to 1) purchase a house in SoCal and 2) board a horse in SoCal.

…

I stand by my comments that it would take millions at retirement to follow your plan. Please tell me if I’m wrong and please provide examples. Maybe the OP has many millions to spend and can retire to SoCal and bring her horses/show dressage/work with SoCal priced trainers on a regular basis.

In my non-horse property neighborhood, homes are going for right around $1M and I’m on the east side of LA county near the Orange curtain. These were built in the mid-60s, most have pools, decent sized lots and around 2000-2200 Sqft.

Board in LA, Orange or San Bernardino counties varies but likely ranges around $700 to $1200 a month depending on where you are and if you’re talking about a stall vs a pipe corral.

Most places do NOT include any type of care in the board so if you aren’t there everyday, that’s extra. If you work with a trainer, they likely are going to add on a grooming fee if you aren’t there everyday to tack up for them. Turn out is likely going to be extra too.

When I was in full training, granted in San Diego county, at a private facility I paid $2K a month per horse. It was excellent care and included hay and grain (grain typically is not included in board IME).

Yes, it is expensive. We can do it because we bought in the 80s and the house is paid for. That said, you cannot beat the weather and that’s worth a lot to me.

[Turntable]

I said BETWEEN Sacramento and Portland. So yes I know there are scenes in those places but not between them.

Also the last time I drove from Portland to Corvalis it was 1.5 hours. Which is not so convenient.

[J-Lu]

That is so great that you bought in the 80s and it all works for you!

This is another story for other people. Leaving MA likely means selling a house for lots of money. But few people can buy into the million dollar price range that is SoCal and afford to pay $1000/month for boarding and much more for training. Yeah, most working people aren’t there to tack up for the trainer so that adds another $1k to having a horse in training. Most people can’t afford 2K/month in boarding fees, like you paid, on top on a million dollar home with the taxes of CA. Most people who can afford it don’t want to pay it here in NC.

The OP is planning on moving. S/he obviously wasn’t there since the 80s. SoCal is too expensive for anyone who isn’t independently wealthy to move in to. And is a waste of money for many who could just go elsewhere and get a lot more bang for their buck.

[BlueDrifter]

As a local boarding right across from Hilda’s place, I agree completely. $2k per horse for board, full time train, farrier, supplements, routine vet is about right, maybe slightly more. Biggest drawback is lack of turnout – usually stalled all day and an hour or two in a small dry lot is “turnout.” As a result, most I know ride their horse daily or at least ensure they are exercised (walker, lunge).

Lots of skilled trainers available, shows within a few miles.

[Turntable]

@J-Lu

How much, in your opinion, does it cost to 1) purchase a house in SoCal and 2) board a horse in SoCal.

Yes, there’s a lot in the MTS east of Malibu-ish, LA, the Moorpark area if you have millions to spend. You find the Bay Area dressage scene “snooty”? Do you honestly think people in OR go to Canada or Los Angeles for shows? I highly suspect most ammies don’t have your budget and the OP has yet to disclose if they can buy a remote place around Moorpark.

How odd…do you have a problem with riding indoors in the winter? So many people do it without problem.

I stand by my comments that it would take millions at retirement to follow your plan. Please tell me if I’m wrong and please provide examples. Maybe the OP has many millions to spend and can retire to SoCal and bring her horses/show dressage/work with SoCal priced trainers on a regular basis.

OP only asked about the availability of shows and the dressage scene, I assume they can use zillow to look at houses and I am not familiar with their finances. But I can confidently say that boarding in Vermont is more expensive than Moorpark by a margin, unless you go to the highest end place in Moorpark. There are more options there, basically. OC and LA proper will be more comparable to high end NE barns for sure. Seattle area is also very expensive. (I have heard that southern Virginia is much, much cheaper than Seattle from a friend who moved there and was giddy at how cheap it was.)

I have a friend who is in Portland now. And to show at the FEI and get qualifying scores for amateur stuff she wants to qualify for she has had to travel a lot more than she expected. She’s a nurse so hardly rich btw so it is a hardship for her for sure.

I spent many years riding in a climate that meant being in the indoors all winter and yes I am tired of it and would be happy never to do it again.

Have I answered all your curiously angry questions? I think so.

[J-Lu]

@Turntable

OP only asked about the availability of shows and the dressage scene, I assume they can use zillow to look at houses and I am not familiar with their finances. But I can confidently say that boarding in Vermont is more expensive than Moorpark by a margin, unless you go to the highest end place in Moorpark. OC and LA proper will be more comparable to high end NE barns for sure. Seattle area is also very expensive. (I have heard that southern Virginia is much, much cheaper than Seattle from a friend who moved there and was giddy at how cheap it was.)

I have a friend who is in Portland now. And to show at the FEI and get qualifying scores for amateur stuff she wants to qualify for she has had to travel a lot more than she expected. She’s a nurse so hardly rich btw so it is a hardship for her for sure.

I spent many years riding in a climate that meant being in the indoors all winter and yes I am tired of it and would be happy never to do it again.

Have I answered all your curiously angry questions? I think so.

Passive/aggressive seems to be your thing. Whatever.

OP asked about the dressage scene, and obviously they can look at prices on Zillow. The OP asked about the entire west coast which said something to me.

VA and ME don’t compare to SoCal boards. Or housing prices. Sure, Southern VA has lots of rural places and is much cheaper than the Seattle area, a major metropolitan area. ??? I don’t get your point.

If you spent many years riding in indoors (I have, too), you’ll recognize they are a Godsend if constructed well enough.YOU may not like them but it is weird that you insist no one else likes them. Read the room here. Mine had music which I loved.

Initially I thought how odd that you think my challenge to your oddly elitist reply is “angry”, but I’m not surprised after reading your reply.

[atlatl]

@J-Lu

That is so great that you bought in the 80s and it all works for you!

This is another story for other people…

Not suggesting it’s the same for everyone. There are plenty of people doing dressage in So Cal with a boatload more than me. Just answering the question of what it costs here.

YMMV

[Fiesta01]

I’m in Ventura County. Live at the beach but boarded my now deceased gelding in Moorpark. It’s a great choice for quality training and easy access to shows. My farrier was great. The local large animal hospital saved my horse’s life twice.

There are rural areas still, but not cheap. The micro-climates here give you many choices of non-horse activities within striking distance. Sailing, surfing, the Channel Islands, snow skiing, hiking, deserts (yes, apparently some people like deserts).

Weather is great on the coast. Somewhat hotter inland, but not like the central valley.

Best wishes on whatever you decide.

[Fiesta01]

@J-Lu

But few people can buy into the million dollar price range that is SoCal

Right now, this is true. With the way the economy is going, I think housing prices will be cooling off soon. Not sure how cool they will go, though.

[Fiesta01]

BTW, I’m not wealthy. Very middle class. Bought during an economic downturn, satisfied with 1250 square foot house, did a lot of my own barn work. But I’ve never been a full-training board type person and always trailered in for lessons/clinics.

[eponacelt]

I’m in Culpeper, VA which is 70 miles SW of DC and about an hour north of Charlottesville. We have a great dressage scene, with a bunch of really top trainers on the outskirts of the DC area, so they’re pretty easy to get to. In Culpeper, I’m no more than 2 hours from most shows and could probably easily show twice a month from May through October if I really wanted to (which I don’t). Great vets, access to farriers. Much more reasonable prices if you’re willing to live a little farther out and travel to trainers. I trailer about 45 min to my trainer every week, but there’s also boarding in the area too.

The summers suck (humidity is lousy) but we have the BEST spring and fall here in VA and it lasts way longer than it does up north usually. More affordable than SoCal for sure, and less danger of fire and earthquake here!

[OceansAway]

Thank you all so much for all of the suggestions, thus far! We are the outdoorsy type, who really enjoy hiking, natural scenery, and wildlife, which is why we want to be more rural (without being totally removed). We used to live in Colorado, which we loved, but there was no horse scene in the areas where we would enjoy living. I really do not like desert, lack of trees or forest, or wide open plains, which is why I know certain parts of the west coast will not be ideal. However, it seems like there is plenty for sale in our budget in the greener areas around national forests and such, and it’s pretty easy to see on the maps where those areas are. The issue being, I have no idea if those areas are TOO remote, or if there is a nearby dressage scene at all, or even a horse scene. In my past experience with Colorado, similar areas tend to have no horse community and be too far removed from groceries, hospitals and the like. In an ideal world, we would be able to afford enough land to keep our horses at home but I’m looking at both options, currently. Unless the house came with a barn, it would be a project to add later. With low housing inventory, I don’t think finding a house with horse facilities is too realistic. Vermont would be my #1 choice if it wasn’t so cold.

No, we are not rich and while we can sell our current house for good money, we will not be looking at million dollar+ homes (I’d actually prefer a smaller, simpler home!), nor will we be affording 2k in board every month. I know that rules out a lot of areas for us, especially in parts of California. I only go to a few shows a year, so more important is consistent access to a choice of trainers and clinic options, without having to haul 2+ hours each direction. Exceptions a couple of times a year aside. Same with veterinary care/farrier access.

Obviously we’ll have to compromise in certain departments, so I am not looking for that elusive perfect match. I just want to gather information so we can make the best decision. Narrowing it down to counties is always really helpful for me, so I can wrap my head around chunks of area. I really appreciate the amount of information and detail everyone is supplying. It’s perfect!

[sparkygrace]

The Willamette Valley. Yes, it’s not like southern California, but there are plenty of opportunities here.