Dumb feed question: How long to take switching feeds?

[Natalie]

Hi all–asking a question I kind of know the answer to, but wanting opinions. My horse is currently on Legends Carbcare Balancer…he gets 3/4 lb twice a day. He does well on it and eats it…BUT it requires trips to the feed store by me, as my barn doesn’t stock it. I’ve been looking around online to see if there’s anyway to get feed shipped to the barn since I obviously want to avoid trips to the store as much as possible right now.

Chewy stocks Buckeye feeds, so I could switch him to the Buckeye Senior Balancer w/ Joint support. It’s a little more expensive than the Carbcare, but obviously I’ll gladly pay more for convenience.

Question–how gradually would I have to go to switch him from one balancer to another? I know general wisdom is to do it over several days, slowly increasing the new feed. That’s what I’ve done in the past. Issue is, he’s at a big barn where the care is good, but not reliably “personal,” especially now that extra work has been heaped on staff during the stay at home orders. I clearly can’t be out there day after day to supervise a gradual changeover during this time. Would I be ok to just dump a bag of the new feed into his bin and make sure there’s some “old feed new feed” mix at the top? That feels so haphazard to me, but I also realize I may be overly worried. :rolleyes: Horse is not particularly sensitive to changes (from what I’ve seen) and happily eats whatever feed he’s given.

[JB]

In general, it takes about 2 weeks for the gut flora to switch over to effectively digest a given foodstuff.

When it comes to balancers, they are generally very similar - very similar ingredients, fairly similar amounts in many cases. Wheat middlings, soy hulls and/or meal, maybe some alfalfa meal. Sometimes there are some different main ingredients. But in the context of the amount fed - 1-2lb for most horses - the amount is still small.

That means you could make changes pretty quickly, even cold turkey for all but the most sensitive horses.

So yes, you could absolutely dump the new balancer, then add the old balancer on top, and dig a little when you scoop, so each successive scoop is generally grabbing a little more and a little more of the new stuff as the old stuff on top gets used up.

If you were talking about a regular feed, at 6lb, then if you wanted to get into details, you’d look at how similar in ingredients they are. The more similar, even if amounts vary, the faster you could change. But if you didn’t want to get that technical, then swapping 1/4 of the old for the same weight (might not be the same volume) of the new, and making the same swap every 3-ish days, would be a good conservative approach. It just doesn’t make sense to do that with balancers that are so similar already, and the amounts of main ingredients relatively small.

[Simkie]

I’d feel totally comfortable going straight from one balancer to another. Yeah, your plan of mixing in the storage container sounds fine.

But I will occasionally go straight from one high quality low carb feed to another high quality low carb feed, with no ill effect. Sometimes the feed store is unexpectedly out 🤷 I’d worry more transitioning between really dissimilar feeds, or on a horse that’s getting a significant amount of it’s total feed from a bucket.

[Natalie]

Thank you both for responding! Yeah, I had a feeling I was overthinking this. Clearly I have too much time on my hands. :o

[BlueDrifter]

I go straight from one to another, but also just feed less than a pound of anything – it is mainly supplement transport!

[B_and_B]

I’ve done the mix the two bags together thing with no issues. What i’ve done is get another bag/mixing bowl and dump the two in together in equal amounts and mix them up really well. That way they don’t get a slug of one and then the other. Generally I aim for the mixed bag to last for a week or so, and then transition to the new food completely.

[Herefordgirl]

I agree with you. I would just mix the 2 bags together to the best of your ability. It shouldn’t be a problem.

[mmeqcenter]

Mine eat 8-10 lbs of grain per day so, I do a 14 day transition no matter how “similar” the two feeds might be. For a horse getting just 1.5 lbs a day, I agree with everyone else, mixing enough of the two RB together for 5-7 days should be fine.

[tabula_rashah]

Just switch it- unless your horse has some major digestive issues. In all of the years I’ve spent working for vets and barns, I’ve never actually seen anyone do a gradual switch.

[luvmyhackney]

My pony gets 1/2 lb twice a day. I switched him over in 2-3 days with no issues.

[endlessclimb]

From what I understand, changes in hay are far more likely to cause issues than grain or balancers. I always do a week, two if it’s a big change. I ramp supplements up one at a time over a good period of time though, perhaps I’m extra cautious but I know I feel like crap when I take vitamins so I dont want to induce that in my horse.

[JB]

@endlessclimb

I know I feel like crap when I take vitamins so I dont want to induce that in my horse.

A lot of human vitamins, IME, don’t sit well in the stomach. I HAVE to take Ester C or I’ll feel gross for an hour or so after taking regular C. Zinc? Not sure which type I had but after a week of queaziness for an hour after taking it, I finally just threw up. There are others which don’t sit well with some people, but they can take a different from without problems.

[endlessclimb]

@JB

A lot of human vitamins, IME, don’t sit well in the stomach. I HAVE to take Ester C or I’ll feel gross for an hour or so after taking regular C. Zinc? Not sure which type I had but after a week of queaziness for an hour after taking it, I finally just threw up. There are others which don’t sit well with some people, but they can take a different from without problems.

That’s good to know about Zinc, as I was going to try to locate some after speaking with my nurse friend abut COVID stuff.

My recurring ulcers don’t help with the settled stomach feel. Iron comes out as fast as it goes down. Does the vitamin queasyness go away with time? I admit that I take them for about a week, get sick of feeling like hell, stop for a couple weeks, then try again - repeating that cycle over and over.

[JB]

@endlessclimb

That’s good to know about Zinc, as I was going to try to locate some after speaking with my nurse friend abut COVID stuff.

Oh dude, you have no idea how bad it was. I was trying to boost my immune system (logically or not), prior to our last cruise (years ago). All week I got more and more nauseous for a while after taking it in the morning. The DAY we left to fly down to Ft Lauderdale to spend the night before boarding the next day, I couldn’t take it, and upchucked it all. When you get on the ship, you have to fill out a short health form “Have you vomited in the last 48 hours?” Uhhhhhh…

I also don’t know if there are better forms to take, so that’s something to look into. I’ve also seen many articles saying there’s no evidence that zinc will help with covid like it can with colds, as the virus has a different mechanism.

Iron comes out as fast as it goes down.

If you’re not taking iron bisglycinate, switch to that.

Does the vitamin queasyness go away with time? I admit that I take them for about a week, get sick of feeling like hell, stop for a couple weeks, then try again - repeating that cycle over and over.

IME no. It has to do with the form of the vitamin (ie Ester C, not just “C”), how a product is buffered, etc.

[endlessclimb]

@JB

Oh dude, you have no idea how bad it was. I was trying to boost my immune system (logically or not), prior to our last cruise (years ago). All week I got more and more nauseous for a while after taking it in the morning. The DAY we left to fly down to Ft Lauderdale to spend the night before boarding the next day, I couldn’t take it, and upchucked it all. When you get on the ship, you have to fill out a short health form “Have you vomited in the last 48 hours?” Uhhhhhh…

I also don’t know if there are better forms to take, so that’s something to look into. I’ve also seen many articles saying there’s no evidence that zinc will help with covid like it can with colds, as the virus has a different mechanism.

If you’re not taking iron bisglycinate, switch to that.

IME no. It has to do with the form of the vitamin (ie Ester C, not just “C”), how a product is buffered, etc.

From my nurse friend - there is some lysing (sp?) of red blood cells with COVID. One of the major treatment attempts at this time is a Zpac (again, sp?). I started asking about it, because I just made up my horse’s supplements and one of the things given is cooper and zinc to counteract the high iron in the water. If the RBC lysing is releasing iron, causing toxicity impact, maybe taking zinc would help.

Or maybe I’m just full of s***. Both are equally possible.

Thanks for the tips on the forms for the vitamins. I thought I was just a wimp. I haven’t been able to give blood in ages due to low iron, I’ll try the form you suggested and give it a go.

[candyappy]

@JB

A lot of human vitamins, IME, don’t sit well in the stomach. I HAVE to take Ester C or I’ll feel gross for an hour or so after taking regular C. Zinc? Not sure which type I had but after a week of queaziness for an hour after taking it, I finally just threw up. There are others which don’t sit well with some people, but they can take a different from without problems.

I would get the dry heaves after taking a women’s multi vitamin on a daily basis. I finally got wise and stopped taking one. Never felt better! I try to eat healthy and well rounded so I really don’t need it anyways.

OP – At the amount your feeding of the balancer, I too would just mix the new with what you have left of the old.

[JB]

Most people just don’t need a multi-vitamin. Most people simply need to eat better. WAY better.

Many people do need specific nutrients, whether Mg or Fe, or Vit E or C, or whatever.