I have an imported Hanoverian mare (Walt Disney - Novize - Argentan - Joachim) that has a dorsal stripe, has produced 2 chestnuts, two bays with dorsal stripes, a golden bay with a sooty face (not what I would call a buckskin but very similar to the warmblood “buckskins” I’ve seen), a fading (?smokey?) black. two non-fading blacks, and now a black filly with a dorsal stripe and silver tipping. Does anyone know 1. If there is a dun factor in Warmbloods? and 2. Where does it come from?
http://www.canterbury-court.com/westwind.html
I sure dun is not in Han. Maybe it is the sire? Who were the sires? Or maybe just it is sun fading and dun stripe really is counter shading?
The dorsal stripe is there year round. It is more prominent in the summer when her coat fades a little but it is clearly seen in the winter as well. Half her babies having the same trait makes me suspicious.
the stripe really sounds like countershading. The link I posted explains it a small amount
Picture?
Much more likely to be (strong) countershading than be a dun dorsal stripe 
My imported Hano mare, Wendenwinter, also has that darker stripe along the spine. I think her Contucci son had it too.
To the best of my knowledge the dun gene is NOT in WBs, although the creme gene is.
I have a bay Arab mare with strong counter shading, a very obvious dorsal stripe. She had a light bay daughter that looks almost like a buckskin – when she was younger many folks thought she was. I knew her sire was a bay, so I knew she wasn’t, but to the eye she looked that way.
I find it fascinating that for so many years in the world of horse color our eyes have been lying to us…
dun gene should not be in hanoverians,
but I know about someone who ha a WB dun (4 generations of breeding after a dun was added), so the horse can go into a WB mare book…
fading (?smokey?) black
Fading black isn’t the same as smokey black. Smokey black is a black horse with the cream dilution gene (Cr). (Just thought I’d clarify.)
A lot of the mystery about colors can also be easily confirmed/denied with easy and inexpensive testing (around $40 or $50). UC Davis is my personal favorite for this. (OP, the “Dun Zygosity” test is $50, if you’re really curious .)
To the best of my knowledge the dun gene is NOT in WBs, although the creme gene is.
This is my understanding as well. Dun is common in breeds like Quarter Horses, but stockhorse blood isn’t accepted into the Euro Warmblood registries (RPSI may be an exception, maybe after enough generations of diluting the non-warmblood blood? and of course there are COP’s, but that’s a different story altogether.)
The ‘colors’ which can be found in Warmbloods are the dilutes (cream dilution gene) and pinto/tobiano (not to be confused with Paint.)
I find it fascinating that for so many years in the world of horse color our eyes have been lying to us…
It’s also interesting how some registries didn’t recognize “colors”, like the Jockey Club which didn’t recognize palomino until 2004, and instead called them chestnut…
Good info on dun factor vs. counter shading.
http://www.grullablue.com/colors/dun_factor_markings.htm
In general all dun factor horses have a dorsal stripe, but not all horses with a dorsal stripe have the dun factor.
Have a bay tobiano Paint stallion without a dun anywhere in his pedigree. Has a pretty clear dorsal shadow and has passed this to half of his foals (none of them from dun mares) as well as several this year with strong countershaded shoulder patches and secondary neck patches. Will be interesing to see if those foals retain the countershading once they shed foal coats. Apparently there is some thinking that “dun” is similar to sabino in that multiple genes may be involved…ones producing primitive markings (and maybe more than one for those since there is a wide variation in expression) and one producing the diluted body color.
Dun in Irish Draughts
We do have the dun gene in Irish Draughts via the stallion Cork Arthur.
http://www.solutionfactor.com/stallions/regaliaprincearthurrid.html
http://www.irishdraught.com/horses/profile.php?unid=6014
Both also have the grey gene…as does Cork Arthur. They have been genetically confirmed. There is also a dilute gene left in one mare line but it is likely to disappear soon. PatO
It might not naturally be found in Warmbloods, but my question to color experts is - - could it come through an Arab or TB somewhere way back? And also, could it be possible that the color was “not recognized” somewhere way back and just called brown, or chestnut?
Neither TBs nor Arabs have Dun.
Arabs also don’t have cream or Tobiano
Lovely filly, Sheila. What’s her pedigree?
Thank you rodawn. She is by Zillionair out of Glenhill’s mare Delimain who is Diamont/Prinz Gaylord.
Just my opinion, but that mare does not look dun to me. Spanish Mustangs have a lot of duns so I’ve seen quite a few. She looks bay to me. I suspect the countershading is what is going on.
Duns will have a “mask” typically and are darker on their legs with leg barring most of the time. You also usually see guard hairs on the mane and tail (lighter hairs on the outside kind of like a Fjord’s mane).
Johaniter swb. Was a very nice colour but I think they called it Golden bay.
Wish I could find a pic. of him.
