Dutch harness horse drama. Update major mare/ foal neglect Nov 2023 post 1782 Update Kate Shearer responds post 1930 Nov 25/23

[Caol_Ila]

This is a slight segway from beer dumping but tangentially related to this thread and DHH. But half this thread is a tangent.

A friend of mine is sorta horse hunting, looking for a Dutch Warmblood because her last horse, who died of colic in November, was one. She told me that she has been in touch with a seller who had an ex-racehorse. A warmblood. What? Allegedly, the horse “ran affiliated races and suffered an injury and got surgery for locking stifle.”

I said, “Surely you mean it’s a TB. There are no races for Dutch Warmbloods in the UK.” I am mostly sure that there are no races for them anywhere, but I could be wrong.

She said that the horse had raced in Holland. Allegedly. “And warmbloods race too.” But do they, really? Not that I have ever heard.

I said that the KWPN registry includes full TBs, but she insisted that “warmbloods race.”

Google had not heard of this, either.

I did, however, wonder if they use DHH for harness racing. I know absolutely nothing about the driving side of equestrian sport. Mostly what I found suggests that they are more like the Bentleys of driving. Beautiful and luxurious but not pulling sulkies at 40mph. Used for combined driving, rather than harness racing. I am not sure you would call combined driving racing, though, any more than you would call eventing racing.

However, I don’t know everything about every weird corner of horse sport. Is it possible that a ‘Dutch warmblood’ raced, in harness or ridden, or is this seller feeding BS to the gullible?

There are some breed experts on this thread, so I figured someone here would know.

[jvanrens]

Holland does have harness racing, but so far I haven’t found any mention of the breeds used (in a quick search), but all the pictures shown in articles look more like Standardbreds than DHHs.

Tour Europeen du Trot leg held at Wolvega - Harnesslink

They even have street races!

Short Track Harness Races

[BWP]

Not KWPNs as far as I know, but I have had a couple of Selle Francais that had raced.

[MHM]

@BWP

Not KWPNs as far as I know, but I have had a couple of Selle Francais that had raced.

Really?!? On the flat? Or over jumps?

I’ve always had the vague impression that jump races were not necessarily restricted to thoroughbreds, but I don’t know that for a fact.

[BWP]

The ones I’ve had have been jumpers. Mine were older so SF registered and branded.

I think this article explains it a bit.

A thoroughbred in all but name? - The Owner Breeder

[MHM]

Very interesting! Thanks!!

[Warmblood1]

Your post reminds me of the Knabstrupper stallion, Mikkel, who was defeated only once in his racing career, who would pull a carriage over 40 Km to the race course prior to racing, and who had remained sound and continued racing until 16 years of age. He was out of another incredible mare named Flaeb, who at 15 years of age pulled a carriage on a 9 mile trip (emergency trip to escort someone to a doctor) in an hour and 45 minutes. One of the carriage horses had to be retired permanently from the rigorous trip, Flaeb remained sound and returned to work in the fields the very next day. These two horses helped establish to Knabstrupper as a performance line. Historically, harness horses were bred to maintain a certain level of speed, stamina and hardiness.

[MHM]

@Warmblood1

Your post reminds me of the Knabstrupper stallion, Mikkel, who was defeated only once in his racing career, who would pull a carriage over 40 Km to the race course prior to racing, and who had remained sound and continued racing until 16 years of age.

That reminds me of somebody I know who used to have an ironclad rule that every horse had to walk for 20 minutes when the rider got on, and walk for 20 minutes before the rider could get off, which meant the horse was always properly warmed up and cooled out.

I’ve often thought this person would be so pleased with the way the horse show neighborhood has developed in Wellington, where so many people trail ride the horses to and from the showgrounds. The 20 minute walk is built in each way.

[omare]

When a family member was ill we spent a lot of time watching the racing cable channel at odd hours and it was amazing how much harness racing there is out in the world-with a sulky or (in France) a rider. Most did not look like US standardbreds–mainly because of the variety of colors! (A lot of flaxen manes!) Some almost looked stocky in the northern European countries. That I can remember, the Swedes and French were the most memorable. (And of course the French have used their trotters with so much success in many jumping lines-who would have thunk? :))
(Edited to add–hats off to the French riders–thighs of steel- holding their position at the trot-seemed like a lot of women also.)

[jvanrens]

The racing in France is primarily in a bike like in NA, but the Monte racing is very popular as well. You’ll see that in Sweden and it’s a pari-mutuel race in Ontario as well, though it’s called Race Under Saddle (RUS) here instead of Monte. Most of the horses are actually Standardbreds, though some countries also race other breeds, Sweden races a coldblood breed, that is a much sturdier looking breed.

Standardbreds do come in many other colours besides bay, brown and black, they just aren’t as common. I’ve noticed most chestnuts are found in trotting lines. You’ll see some tobianos and dilutes (buckskin and palomino) in Australia and New Zealand, but not many of them seem to have been fast enough to ship to NA to race and there are a lot of well bred pacers and trotters that are imported to NA to race. There have been a couple of tobianos that I know of that have been in training, I think one was racing or at least training in Kentucky last year, but I haven’t heard of any wins.

[omare]

Interesting to know! I was so surprised to see the chestnuts and lots of white (blazes, white legs). Such a contrast to our (edited to add-mostly) plain bay trotters in the USA. And of course those sturdy horses in the north. It was a great distraction and fun to watch.

[jvanrens]

For some reason white seems to be more common on red (chestnut) horses. I think some of those lines that still have the red gene just might be more popular in different areas There are some lines of bays that have a lot of white (pacers though). There was a red trotter at one training centre we were at, bright chestnut with a flaxen mane and tail. Boy did he stand out in the stable. There was a dark chestnut trotter racing at our home track for a while, big blaze, he sure stood out in the shedrow. There’s one stable currently with a red roan racing here now. He’s definitely easy to spot in a race!

[Jenerationx]

@Arlomine

Picture of my boy because I love him.

Wow… I can see why!

@Bristol_Bay

She kicks other horses (only a well-placed rail stopped her from inflicting damage on my horse), kicks at her owner when he tries to lunge her, tries to bite everyone who walks by her stall, and kills chickens and then eats them.

Wonderful broodmare prospect!

[Jenerationx]

@Mersidoats

Holy baby Jesus. That’s insane. Ya’ll have seen the video where the Shetland eats the birds, right?

The what now? I can’t get that video @smoofox posted outta my head. That is just bizarre.

[anon6796898]

Bullying has always been accepted behavior on coth forums; going back years. Now adults are forced to be subject to gang behavior. It’s never been shut down by mod 1. If your brand want’s to be represented on this webpage, go ahead.
@hegelstrand,

[skydy]

@anon6796898

Bullying has always been accepted behavior on coth forums; going back years. Now adults are forced to be subject to gang behavior. It’s never been shut down by mod 1. If your brand want’s to be represented on this webpage, go ahead.
@hegelstrand,

I apologize, but I can’t make sense of your post in the context of this thread.

[anon6796898]

We are all different. I do see bullying in numbers with the same avatars and made up. I see how this group bullying makes them feel really good. Why did you ask, that I don’t get.

[anon6796898]

Why did you ask?

[skydy]

Because I didn’t understand what you were saying in the context of this thread. It’s no biggie.

[anon6796898]

Then you undertsand my reaction after all off the posts? Scribblers is the ring leader. Has time to post all day every day. Im not shutting my account down until there is some accountabiliy to the gang bulling. Mod 1 lets it all go through.