I never said that being thin means someone has an eating disorder and I think you are derailing the thread onto an entirely different subject. Eating disorders are characterized by eating habits and rituals. Not body weight.
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[QUOTE=Fig;8642336]
I never said that being thin means someone has an eating disorder and I think you are derailing the thread onto an entirely different subject. Eating disorders are characterized by eating habits and rituals. Not body weight.[/QUOTE]
Actually, diagnosis of anorexia nervosa does require extremely low body weight, per the DSM-5. But that’s beside the point.
I’m not attempting to derail the thread, simply participating in it. My first comment was simply an observation. My second, a response to you. I apologize if I’ve struck a nerve with you.
[QUOTE=541hunter;8641853]
OH MY GOD I can’t believe I forgot to tell this story!!! This has become a favorite in my barn because it is so outrageous and blatantly idiotic, and it gets retold over and over again.
Just to give you some background, I am 5’4", 160 pounds but muscular, size 4/6. I’ve gained a little bit in the last 3 years because I went from a college student with all the time in the world to work out and hang at the barn for hours on end to being a cubicle dweller, but I’m fairly fit, lift weights, ride 4-5x a week, etc. Definitely not a twig but I still look pretty good in a bikini 
So I was at a show in the fall on a sainted horse who was helping me get my confidence back after a bad fall over the summer (freak accident, both horse and I were fine but it shook me). Doing the 2’6" because horse was older and the owner had decided to move him down from the 3’ to preserve him. This horse had BTDT and is well known on our local circuit.
I was at the back gate (on foot) checking the schedule, and the back gate lady sidled up to me. She starts going on about how unfair it was that I was riding Dobbin in the 2’6" (I think she was trying to be complimentary?). I laughed it off and said he’s a great horse, I really just need a confidence boost right now and he’s perfect for that. Her response? “Why do you need more confidence? Ohh, cuz you’re out of shape?”
:eek: My jaw hit the floor!
So now it’s a running joke at the barn that I’m out of shape – every time I drop something on the ground, miss a distance, whatever, someone chimes in to say, “It’s just cuz 541 is out of shape!” It never gets old lol but we have to be careful to explain it in case someone overhears who doesn’t know the story![/QUOTE]
Are there really people out there in the world who would (first) pay enough attention to the “back gate lady” comments that they would even think to spread it around to the rest of their barn? And if the answer to that question is “yes”, is everyone associated with that barn so shallow and empty inside that they have nothing better to focus on but this random, ridiculous comment by some stranger at a horse show that happened way back in the past? Are there really barns out there that are like this?
[QUOTE=ynl063w;8642347]
Are there really people out there in the world who would (first) pay enough attention to the “back gate lady” comments that they would even think to spread it around to the rest of their barn? And if the answer to that question is “yes”, is everyone associated with that barn so shallow and empty inside that they have nothing better to focus on but this random, ridiculous comment by some stranger at a horse show that happened way back in the past? Are there really barns out there that are like this?[/QUOTE]
?? It was a weird comment that I relayed to my friends because it was such an odd thing to say to someone’s face (or really at all). They also thought it was a ridiculous thing to say. So we laughed about it and then it became a running joke. I hardly think that qualifies us as shallow.
ETA: If you’re also trying to imply that by writing “back gate lady” I’m somehow being disrespectful, I should mention that I, too, am a “back gate lady.”
I have struggled with different eating disorders for quite a few years.
I was never told that I had to be a certain shape because of riding, or directly told that I need to be a specific weight. However, riding and showing created a perfectionist-type attitude for me that definitely contributed to my issues. Also, I cant even count the number of times I have heard “you look so great on that horse, with your long, thin legs” or “you should do the equitation, you have such a great body for it.”
I definitely think it’s tough to grow up showing and not develop some body image issues (“big eq diet,” anyone).
[QUOTE=541hunter;8642353]
?? It was a weird comment that I relayed to my friends because it was such an odd thing to say to someone’s face (or really at all). They also thought it was a ridiculous thing to say. So we laughed about it and then it became a running joke. I hardly think that qualifies us as shallow.[/QUOTE]
Well as long as all of you think it’s normal I guess it’s good to have this moment that bonded you all together? I don’t know it just seems really weird to me to base so much of your life on something a complete stranger said to you at some time in the past, that you would remember it enough to speak to it in such detail. But I get that maybe you just had to be there or something.
Check your pm’s op
[QUOTE=Happyhooves;8641464]
I always appreciate it when eq judges pin riders who appear normal/healthy, not just pin the 12- 13-year-old “phenom new discoveries!” who also happen to be prepubescent shapeless wisp sticks and who you know don’t really have the strength to pilot a horse effectively in demanding situations while ignoring the older kids with a few curves and more true skills. Yes, fitness and strength are so important. It’s hard to watch kids with eating issues struggling not only while riding but in other areas of their lives. Seen it too many times over many years.[/QUOTE]
Sounds like you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder…
I can still, at age 60, put up 3 tons of hay. I can set a horse down on it’s ass. Surprise…I can “pilot a horse effectively in demanding situations.” I’m 5’10"+ and on a good day, weigh 135.
Just because someone is thin doesn’t mean they aren’t “normal and healthy.” I come from a long line of tall, skinny people. It’s how we roll. A lack of curves doesn’t mean someone doesn’t have “true skills,” and aren’t fit and strong. We all come in different shape and sizes. THAT’S normal.
I’m not sure where you show, but I’ve truly not seen that many “waif” sized girls/women on the circuit(s) in my neck of the world. I see a lot of fit, healthy girls/women who like any athlete, understand that fitness and good eating habits contribute to better performance.
Are there eating disorders? Of course…but eating disorders are not exclusively a problem of show people and manifest themselves across all walks of life. Horse shows and bad trainers are not what started the problem in the first place.
Are there eating disorders? Of course…but eating disorders are not exclusively a problem of show people and manifest themselves across all walks of life. Horse shows and bad trainers are not what started the problem in the first place.[/QUOTE]
exactly.
(not to sy they can’t exasperate what is already brewing)…
but eating d/o’s are far more complex
[QUOTE=ponyjumps;8642355]
I have struggled with different eating disorders for quite a few years.
I was never told that I had to be a certain shape because of riding, or directly told that I need to be a specific weight. However, riding and showing created a perfectionist-type attitude for me that definitely contributed to my issues. Also, I cant even count the number of times I have heard “you look so great on that horse, with your long, thin legs” or “you should do the equitation, you have such a great body for it.”
I definitely think it’s tough to grow up showing and not develop some body image issues (“big eq diet,” anyone).[/QUOTE]
This was an entirely more succinct way of putting the novel I wrote.
Thank you to those who offered feedback on my story!
A friend of mine (who had an eating disorder) remarked that society is concerned with women taking up as little space as possible-- literally. When she had her eating disorder in check, she was just a little overweight. Not lots, but she said that was healthier than being dangerously underweight, and she was trying to manage her life and her relationship with food and her health in the best way she could.
I used to run long distance in high school ( cross country and track). I got way too thin. Did I have an eating disorder? I don’t know. I was so thin my periods stopped for a few years. My body fat was very low. I ate-- a lot-- but I ran most of it off. My natural body type is not that thin. When I stopped competitive long distance running while in college, I grow about three inches, and went from so flat chested I needed no bra to run in, to a rather voluptuous D cup. That is a rather late growth spurt and I think my body was under developed because of the strain of the running and being thinner than was natural for my body type.
Certainly there was stress placed on being very very thin by coaches, etc, when long distance running.
As an adult rider I have had people remark unkindly on my chest size. Again that idea that a rider should be stick thin and prepubescent in figure seems to predominate. By that time I was old enough to just shrug off the comments and think to myself that as soon as we were away from horses, the same women were bemoaning their flat chest and paying lots of money for breast surgery to get what nature gave me. There was another adult ammy rider at my barn who while a thin person had a large chest, and she and I used to just laugh to each other about the remarks we would get, deciding the remarkers were secretly (or not so secretly) jealous of our own ammy success with horses ( she and I cleaned up at the ammy classes at shows) AND having boobs.:lol::lol:
This rider and I shared boots, clothes, shirts, jackets, if needed, and it was fun to have a riding twin!
The barn I am at currently has people of all shapes, sizes and ages, and I have never ONCE heard a remark about body shape or size, positively or negatively, said about anyone.
But in the hyper competitive world of horses, yes, I can see where the pressures exist that can cause a disorder to occur. Those pressures are not unique to horse showing, but with other environments that might cause a disorder to manifest, there is an emphasis on perfection, form over function if you will ( thin wins no matter what else happens), and a constant comparison to others, and the idea you are never quite good enough.
I ride for fun. It is a hobby. If I win at a show, well, fantastic. If not, oh well. Because my goal is fun, not winning, and while winning can be fun, fun can occur without winning as well. Having my horse progress, just having a nice afternoon at the barn on a sunny spring day-- those are fun too. I get funny reactions sometimes when my answer to whether I have goals for my horse is no, just to have fun, it is just a hobby-- rather than being hypercompetitive. Been there, done that. It is not fun. Not my choice- and in rejecting that choice, I also become more immune to the whole body pressure that exists. Because it is still there-- but at this stage in life I have more tools to see it for what it is and avoid it.
[QUOTE=ynl063w;8642361]
Well as long as all of you think it’s normal I guess it’s good to have this moment that bonded you all together? I don’t know it just seems really weird to me to base so much of your life on something a complete stranger said to you at some time in the past, that you would remember it enough to speak to it in such detail. But I get that maybe you just had to be there or something.[/QUOTE]
FWIW, I didn’t react to the story at all the way you did. Lots of random, silly comments made by strangers turn into running jokes among friends IME. It doesn’t mean someone is “shallow” or that someone is basing a lot of one’s life on the comment. I thought 541’s story was appropriate; to me, the fact that she and her friends turned it into a joke shows that they had a very healthy attitude toward a comment that might have been considered hurtful.
[QUOTE=Dewey;8642414]
FWIW, I didn’t react to the story at all the way you did. Lots of random, silly comments made by strangers turn into running jokes among friends IME. It doesn’t mean someone is “shallow” or that someone is basing a lot of one’s life on the comment. I thought 541’s story was appropriate; to me, the fact that she and her friends turned it into a joke shows that they had a very healthy attitude toward a comment that might have been considered hurtful.[/QUOTE]
Thanks Dewey - this is more the way I see it. I WAS hurt in the moment, and I brought it to the barn family as both “isn’t that ridiculous?” But also with that little nagging doubt of “oh my god, that’s not really true is it?” So the fact that it became a joke helped me view it as what it was - a dumb and outrageous comment by someone who is either not very nice or has a serious case of foot-in-mouth disease.
I hope that story didn’t make any of you who have struggled with dysmorphia or disordered eating think I was being flip - it was just an example of the things people think of as acceptable comments in the h/j world.
Thank you to everyone who took the time to reply. I really appreciate it.
Here is a link to the video that I ended up creating https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghjLF9_Hfac
Unfortunately I had so many replies and not so much time in the video I could not get everyones replies in it! I did, however, use all of your replies in the response paper I wrote! 
Thank you so much again for helping me with this project!
Go Fish, I agree thin people can be strong. Look at my post again: I specified people “who you know aren’t strong” to separate those out from the ones who happen to be thin and not strong enough to pilot a horse. I have worked with kids with eating disorders in my line of work. I have ridden alongside them and watched them struggle and cry. I have attended the memorial service of one of them. If that’s having a chip on my shoulder, well then I guess you’re right and I have one. (But it’s okay. I am thin and strong enough to hoist it on my shoulder and hug the chip and squeeze it and name it George ) Not sure where people want to turn something sad and serious like this into something unpleasant between posters who are all dismayed about the same thing: the struggles of some lovely people in our horse world. But a lot of things baffle me…
I’m very impressed with those of you who bravely shared your struggles on here. I have a non-rider friend who has struggled with anorexia her whole life (now mid 50s) and I’m pretty sure she would not have been able to share her struggle on a public forum. She has shared it with me and even communicated back-and-forth with me when she was in a recovery facility but she has so much shame, fear and denial that she really spends most of her energy hiding it. Breaks my heart!
On a sidenote I would really appreciate it if the show clothes manufacturers such as Grand Prix could start using actual sizes instead of made up equestrian sizes with a note that says you have to add three sizes to your regular size. Seriously? I’m pretty sure that doesn’t cause a problem but it sure can’t help and it makes me feel like crap when I ask for my size. Enough already!
[QUOTE=equisusan;8642917]
On a sidenote I would really appreciate it if the show clothes manufacturers such as Grand Prix could start using actual sizes instead of made up equestrian sizes with a note that says you have to add three sizes to your regular size. Seriously? I’m pretty sure that doesn’t cause a problem but it sure can’t help and it makes me feel like crap when I ask for my size. Enough already![/QUOTE]
I don’t disagree with your sentiment at all, but I actually think that manufacturers like GP are some of the only ones in the garment industry who haven’t succumbed to the vanity sizing trend that has brought women’s sizes down from what the same measurements would have been just 30 or 40 years ago. Several years back, I put on a dress of my mom’s from the early 70s. At the time, I was 120 pounds at 5’7". The dress was a size 10 and fit me like a glove. 10’s from 30 or 35 years ago are now 4’s.
This seems to me a conscious effort by clothing manufacturers to play into and exploit women’s desire to perceive themselves as thin. A single digit number is better than a double digit number, etc., in a world in which self-worth is too often associated with numerical descriptions of size. The bridal industry has also, for the most part, resisted the slide to smaller numbers. My wedding dress, bought in 2010, was a size 8 when my dress size at J.Crew was more like a 2. Because it seems like equestrian outfitters and bridal gown manufacturers are “the last men standing” who haven’t scaled their sizing down, it can the have effect of making a woman who might already be self-conscious about her size even more so when trying on these types of clothing.
I don’t dispute that there’s a part of me that would rather see the smaller size, but I don’t think Grand Prix and others are inflating their numbers; I actually think they’ve simply resisted the trend to move the other way.
I agree imlacross but I don’t see the point in being hold outs especially in a sport that maybe focuses a bit too much on thin rather than fit.
I was never ‘skinny’ and I’m still not but I’m not obese either. I’m built with a small waste and very thick thighs. Not the ideal equestrian look.
I was never told by anyone besides my parents I was “fat”, “obese” or “need to loose weight”. The barn I rode at was very inclusive to that sort of thing.
However, in my teens I developed an eating disorder. For me it was the little things that eventually built up. I still have distinct memories (pre eating disorder) or being about 14 shopping for a school uniform. At this time I was about 5’7" weighing about 150. I wore a size 12 pants and medium shirt. When I was fitted for a uniform the sizes were so small that I ended up buying a 2x shirt and size 40 pants. I shrugged it off but on the inside it affected me deeply. Especially it being a school uniform. You’re really going to make a whole school of kids go through that?!
During high school (I think I was 16 or 17) I dropped down to 115 pounds. At this time I started I getting compliments on how good I looked from both teachers, students and fellow riders. Personally, I thought I looked (and felt!)sick but didn’t want to change since I was getting these compliments.
In college I was on a budget, started buying crappy food and put the weight back on. I was probably an ideal weight at this point but not healthy because I gained it back by eating cheeseburgers. Eventually, I became depressed at my weight gain and in turn started eating more due to the depression. I went up to 185 pounds at my heaviest. Once I was more financially stable I went vegan, joined a gym and haven’t looked back. I currently wear a size 12 or 14 and feel much better than I have in a while.
Grand Prix sizes are UK sizes I think? I wear the same size in Barbour.
