[QUOTE=TickleFight;8642700]
If you’re writing a paper for a college class, then you shouldn’t be soliciting anecdotes from anonymous nobodies on an internet message forum. Having taught at a Big Ten university in the past, that sort of thing would earn a failing grade from me.
Do some real research and use citable sources.[/QUOTE]
The OP produced a YouTube video. I think there’s a link in the similar thread she started in HJ world.
College ain’t what she used to be.
[QUOTE=Manni01;8643500]
This is kind of ridiculous…who decides what looks weird and what not?? And I would really be interested who determines what a healthy weight is… Obviously there are different point of views about it…[/QUOTE]
If you look in the OP (and life in general), OP mentioned eating disorders, she is talking about a mental illness/mindset/specific behaviors, many of which can happen regardless of weight.
In response to “TickleFight:” The purpose of this assignment was not a research project. The purpose was to raise awareness of my self and in the community about mental illness (this happen to be my chosen topic). Many people, as you can see by reading the replies on here where not aware of how often equestrians are struggling with mental illness. The discussion on here was meant to raise my own awareness which I then used to create the youtube video which I have shared with the people I know in the equestrian community (including everyone on here) in order to raise their consciousness of the subject. Thank you for your concern but it is not relevant to the purpose of this discussion.
Piggybacking off of hillhavenmercedes, testimonials from actual people are perfectly valid and acceptable for certain topics in research. I mean, where the hell do you think primary sources come from? When I was in school I had to write a paper for an urban planning class on environmental issues in my home town. How did I do this? By interviewing actual residents in my town, citing their responses in my paper, and using the hard data to either refute or back up their claims. Honestly, if you don’t think personal testimony is a valid primary source, then you need to learn how to do research in the humanities.
I have never encountered myself-however, I have been to clinics in which the clinicians have no qualms about pointing out a riders physique, weight, lack of fitness as the root of their riding problems. Funny-because I am sure these folks are aware of their faults and I applaud them for getting out there. If a clinician is up to snuff, they really ought to be able to improve anyone’s riding-I would assume.
[QUOTE=Groovin!;8643931]
I have never encountered myself-however, I have been to clinics in which the clinicians have no qualms about pointing out a riders physique, weight, lack of fitness as the root of their riding problems.[/QUOTE]
Comments about fitness are fair game from any trainer or clinician. A lot of times trainers are more sympathetic to their long time, AA students, and go a little easy on them in order to keep their confidence up. And that is one of the valuable things about riding with a different trainer or clinician every once in a while. They don’t know you, so they can give you an honest assessment of your riding. If you aren’t fit or coordinated enough to sit up and ride correctly, it doesn’t matter how good the clinician is. They aren’t magicians, and they may not be able to help you very much.
In all my 30+ years of riding and working with trainers, I don’t think I have ever heard one comment to a student that she should lose weight. Ever. Never. Perhaps I was hanging with the wrong crowd, or not listening enough to other people’s lessons, but seriously I never heard it.
Nor has a trainer ever said anything to me (although I suppose I fit into the category of thin enough, but I wasn’t overly so).
The only time I have ever really noticed someone’s weight was with a seriously overweight lady who rode a small horse and she wasn’t one of those good riders who was well-balanced. This poor horse, she got on and his back went “ouch” and he was probably so overburdened that he couldn’t even try to buck her off. She should not have been riding any horse, let alone the petite little one she rode. But even then I don’t know if anyone said anything to her because she still kept on showing up to clinics and shows.
Is this more prevalent in the english disciplines than western? Think of all the big guys on the QHs - does anyone say anything to them? Probably not, because they are men. Is there a “skinny look” that is desired in WP or ??
[QUOTE=hillhavenmercedes;8643835]
Many people, as you can see by reading the replies on here where not aware of how often equestrians are struggling with mental illness. The discussion on here was meant to raise my own awareness which I then used to create the youtube video which I have shared with the people I know in the equestrian community (including everyone on here) in order to raise their consciousness of the subject. [/QUOTE]
I think that this discussion has been interesting, and mental illness has a huge presence in the horse industry. My friends and I talk about it all the time. What I do find interesting is that of all the issues out there, you chose eating disorders. Perhaps it fit into the parameters of your assignment better? I don’t know. And I am not criticizing you by any means, I think what you have done here is great! But next time, can we talk about a different mental illness, like addiction or narcissism? I find raging-alcoholic barn managers and trainers to be more worrisome than the girls who eat just four almonds a day.
:no:RodeoFTW and cowgirl, really.
Check out their comments on a similar Off Course thread a day (?) before this one.
Exactly my point-huge chips on your shoulders and then trash those not like you. How is this not the same as what perceived injustices are done to you?
Bullies, man, bullies.
[QUOTE=mvspencer;8644000]
I find raging-alcoholic barn managers and trainers to be more worrisome than the girls who eat just four almonds a day.[/QUOTE]
And let me clarify that I don’t mean eating disorders aren’t serious- they certainly are. If there is something in the dressage culture that encourages eating disorders I would like to help change that. It’s just that there are lots of other issues that have a broader impact on the horse community as a whole.
[QUOTE=right horse at the right time;8644007]
:no:RodeoFTW and cowgirl, really.
Check out their comments on a similar Off Course thread a day (?) before this one.
Exactly my point-huge chips on your shoulders and then trash those not like you. How is this not the same as what perceived injustices are done to you?
Bullies, man, bullies.[/QUOTE]
Oh goodness you aren’t exaggerating. Their comments on that thread, combined with this one…wow. It sounds like they’re really hurting inside about this topic.
Especially when Rodeo goes so far to even claim that small/thin women riding large horses is partially to blame for eating disorders:
I think in the topic of eating disorders and crash diets in the eq. world, part of the problem with these unattainable “image standards” that are out there is seeing women who are tiny on huge horses and that’s the normal people are used to seeing in the ring.
[QUOTE=aaka208;8643915]
Piggybacking off of hillhavenmercedes, testimonials from actual people are perfectly valid and acceptable for certain topics in research. I mean, where the hell do you think primary sources come from? When I was in school I had to write a paper for an urban planning class on environmental issues in my home town. How did I do this? By interviewing actual residents in my town, citing their responses in my paper, and using the hard data to either refute or back up their claims. Honestly, if you don’t think personal testimony is a valid primary source, then you need to learn how to do research in the humanities.[/QUOTE]
Interviewing people about environmental issues is totally different than collecting medical information. Collecting personal health data requires participants to sign HIPPA forms, etc. There are a lot of legal hoops to jump through.
Go back to college. Not enough book-learnin’ rubbed off on you the first time.
[QUOTE=TickleFight;8644307]
Interviewing people about environmental issues is totally different than collecting medical information. Collecting personal health data requires participants to sign HIPPA forms, etc. There are a lot of legal hoops to jump through.
Go back to college. Not enough book-learnin’ rubbed off on you the first time.[/QUOTE]
She wasn’t doing a big formal research project and wasn’t collecting medical information. She asked for experiences and perspectives, which is not classified medical information (especially since people are giving it freely). Of course if she wanted to expand this into a full-fledged paper she would need to interview people and have them sign release forms. But for a formal paper on ANYTHING where I interview people I’d have them sign release forms. Even if I was interviewing them about their favorite gummy bear color.
Source: Postgrad study in Social Sciences
[QUOTE=TickleFight;8644307]
Interviewing people about environmental issues is totally different than collecting medical information. Collecting personal health data requires participants to sign HIPPA forms, etc. There are a lot of legal hoops to jump through.
Go back to college. Not enough book-learnin’ rubbed off on you the first time.[/QUOTE]
By writing about their own personal experiences in a public forum, the posters are giving their consent to have that information used. I only do research in historical medical geography, and even I know that.
Oh, and by the way, before you stoop so low to insult someone’s intelligence, you should make sure you’re not insulting someone who is an alumna of the John’s Hopkins Center for Talented Youth Program (why yes, I did score a composite 31 on the ACT at the age of 10), competed for my region’s student AAG World Geography Bowl team at the national level, has had fiction published in a literary journal, speaks two languages, and will be publishing a solo paper on the spatiotemporal dynamics of the 1832 cholera outbreak in Philadelphia at the end of the year. Honey, I can assure you that I am one of the more “learn’d” (If I may quote Whitman) people that you will ever meet.
This whole thread is kind of ridiculous, sorry to say that. Nobody needs to feel bad about any bodyshape or weight… Some of the best German Dressage riders were not skinny and a very good example is I.W. I dont think she ever had the ideal skinny body, but still she is one of the best riders in the world… And somehow her trainer had no problems with her. He was famous when she started to ride with him and he asked her to ride his horses… He did not care about her weight, but about her talent… One of the reasons why she always was my hero, because she did not have the body of a model. It doesnt matter, if you are a good rider and if you have the feeling for the horse your bodyshape doesnt matter…
Anybody who thinks different has no idea… and the discussion in this thread showed it clearly
I swear the boards are dying for a good trainwreck. WTF is WITH you people, really??? Quit with the wars of who is more whatever the **** we’ve decided to fight about now, grab a drink (or several), chill the crap out, and wait for the next NP or Great Mustachio’d One thread to have your fun.
I always think its really less about “size” and more about fitness. We expect so much out of our horses, but rarely put in half the work on ourselves. (Okay, so I have to be constantly reminded to put the effort in myself). The better my fitness, the better my riding and the better my horse goes. Its a lazy shortcut to look at physical size and equate fitness, but I can understand how the link can be made.
[QUOTE=TickleFight;8644307]
Interviewing people about environmental issues is totally different than collecting medical information. Collecting personal health data requires participants to sign HIPPA forms, etc. There are a lot of legal hoops to jump through.
Go back to college. Not enough book-learnin’ rubbed off on you the first time.[/QUOTE]
And if you want to get persnickety, interviewing people means you have to follow formal guidelines for using human research subjects.
The video has some COTHers’ word quoted verbatim. They are not attributed. However, anyone who knows how to google a sentence can connect those phrases with a COTH user name. I suppose one could sleuth further and discover the IRL identity of the people who wrote those words.
Did the COTHers know their comments would be used that way? Were they made aware of any risk incurred by participating in the OP’s research? Did they make an informed decision when they decided to offer their anecdotes to the OP’s research project? After all, there is some confusion here as to how the OP would use those. Some assumed a research paper with a quite small audience would be the product. That’s not the case.
Yeah. That kind of thing is why universities (and others) have formal guidelines in place for using human research subjects.
[QUOTE=aaka208;8644413]
By writing about their own personal experiences in a public forum, the posters are giving their consent to have that information used. I only do research in historical medical geography, and even I know that.
Oh, and by the way, before you stoop so low to insult someone’s intelligence, you should make sure you’re not insulting someone who is an alumna of the John’s Hopkins Center for Talented Youth Program (why yes, I did score a composite 31 on the ACT at the age of 10), competed for my region’s student AAG World Geography Bowl team at the national level, has had fiction published in a literary journal, speaks two languages, and will be publishing a solo paper on the spatiotemporal dynamics of the 1832 cholera outbreak in Philadelphia at the end of the year. Honey, I can assure you that I am one of the more “learn’d” (If I may quote Whitman) people that you will ever meet.[/QUOTE]
As to your first paragraph, I think a Committee on the Use of Human Research Subjects (at someplace like, say, the National Science Foundation or a university) would disagree. The onus is on the researcher to explain, at the outset, what their research is for and what form it will take in the end. The researcher (who knows all this) is supposed to inform would-be participants of possible risks; it’s not the participant’s job to figure those out.
Source: PhD who has, in fact, written grants that comply with Human Research Subject guidelines and who has also helped undergrads do that with their research projects.
[QUOTE=right horse at the right time;8642087]
Hardly.
Here we go again.
No extra body movement because they are underweight? No, how about they are in shape.
Extra points? Hardly. Until I learned to sit quietly and using my core, my rider points were 5.5. No jiggle. Still 5.5!
If you know plenty of beginners who go to trainers because they are slim and look pretty on a horse, maybe they are in shape and maybe they are better riders. But no, let’s trash them (and insult women who chose to be in a sorority too?).
Yep, I’ve seen Laura Graves on the ground, along with many others, and they are in shape.
Sour grapes.
GAWD. Just stop. I thought we were past this. Well, most of us are, anyway.
OP - THIS is the better story. Trashing slim people. And it’s “ok,” because thin people are to be hated. Clearly we have eating disorders and aren’t good riders, just get points for being sorority girls.[/QUOTE]
I know. It’s always, “It’s not my fault! The judges hate me because I’m fat, because I have the wrong saddle, my boots aren’t the right style, etc.” Egad, judges look at the HORSE. It’s a reflection of your abilities. Blame your lousy riding and look for a new coach, and get fit enough that your horse can actually perform. (YES, this is a sport! You are not a passenger! IT TAKES WORK!)
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