Eight Belles

[MistyBlue]

I think this says it well:

“This horse showed you his heart,” winning jockey Kent Desormeaux said, "and Eight Belles showed you her life for our enjoyment today.

“for our enjoyment” :sigh:

but have there not been been studies which indicate that early and rigourous training actually helps bones grow stronger and tougher.

That which does not kill us makes us stronger.
Yes, the horses that come off the track with sound legs do have legs like iron due to thir racing conditioning. But those are the ones who make it off the track sound. There are many who don’t make it off the track sound…OTTB’s are often sold through Canter with all sorts of soundness issues from their conditioning and breeding. Some don’t make it off the track at all.
It’s business…simple business. Racing is a huge money maker and a time-honored tradition. To the general public it’s probably the last big sports event (triple crown, breeder’s cup, etc) that has any class at all. Heck, I’m a huge football fan but I do acknowledge that half the time it’s more “defense and prosecution” rather than “defense and offense.” :winkgrin: A lot of sports are filled with a bunch of talented thugs. :yes: Racing has class…and racing has money. Classy looking money. Sport of Kings and all that.
They’re going to race horses in the best financial possible way. And since the athlete’s can’t talk, can’t reason, don’t have unions or agents…the methods they use can’t be complained about. The best financial way is to get them young, start them young and get them winning as fast as possible so they can hopefully go on to make more money breeding. Business and they’re more than allowed to make their incomes however they see fit to.
The best financial way also tends to end a lot of young horse’s careers or lives. That’s the way it goes. I personally don’t agree with it though.

[ohrebecca]

[QUOTE=DickHertz;3188107]
Any time a horse is going to be put down on the track they bring every vehicle they can (jockey amublance, gate crew truck, etc.) over just to obstruct the view so nobody can see what’s going on. Even though she was down, when they euthanize the horse always rears up before it dies which is why they get so many vehicles to block the view.[/QUOTE]

The horse always rears up when being euth’d? I’ve never heard that. Or seen that.

I’m not done with racing. I’m hurt by racing and what’s happened here and in countless other non-televised injuries that don’t receive the media attention and public outcry that this has. But I’m not done with it.

Racing has not always been like this, I stand by that, and I stand by the affirmation that it WON’T always be like this. Obviously no one knows how long it will take, but something has GOT to give.

[DickHertz]

@ohrebecca;3188273

The horse always rears up when being euth’d? I’ve never heard that. Or seen that.

I’ve seen it as a bettor and standing next to one. The vet says “now after I give the second shot, the horse will rear then flip over.”

[Twomanydawgs]

Hmmm I worked at the track and at breeding farms for years and have seen countless horses put down for one reason or another and I have never seen that…and “the second shot”??? HUH??? More often than not it only takes one shot of T60 to do the job…if they are standing they fall like a ton of bricks…end of story. Have no idea what you are talking about Dick. Whatever Dick…I’m really sorry for your single horrific experience…you are the perfect example of why a little knowledge is a dangerous thing…euthanazia is usually a peaceful passing…and more often than not it’s the right thing to do…

[Showpony]

[QUOTE=DickHertz;3188283]
I’ve seen it as a bettor and standing next to one. The vet says “now after I give the second shot, the horse will rear then flip over.”[/QUOTE]

Not true.

[DickHertz]

[QUOTE=Twomanydawgs;3188292]
Hmmm I worked at the track and at breeding farms for years and have seen countless horses put down for one reason or another and I have never seen that…and “the second shot”??? HUH??? More often than not it only takes one shot of T60 to do the job…if they are standing they fall like a ton of bricks…end of story. Have no idea what you are talking about Dick.[/QUOTE]

I’ve seen five in person between Penn National and Charles Town and they’ve all been the same (a break down during the race). Perhaps they do it differently on the track compared to the farm??? 40 CC’s of the blue stuff, then 10-12 cc’s of clear, then 40 CC’s of blue.

[Showpony]

Originally Posted by SBT
1t’s absolutely ridiculous to say that all horse sports carry the same risk. That’s like saying you’re just as likely to die in a fender-bender at 15 mph as you are in a head-on at 65. A breakdown in the dressage arena and a breakdown at a full racing gallop are NOT the same. Add in solid obstacles and unstable footing (eventing) or immature bones (racing), and your odds of catastrophic injuries increase. It’s not rocket science and it’s not a numbers game. It’s a fact of physics that the faster you go and the harder you hit, the more damage you will do.

Add me to the list of those who are officially DONE with racing and eventing. It’s JUST. NOT. WORTH IT. I would be very happy to see eventing dropped from the Olympics, and just as happy to see racing restricted to horses age 4 and up…or done away with altogether. If you feel the need for speed, thrills, and chills, get into NASCAR. At least the cars don’t suffer when they break.

Well said!! And so true!

[hundredacres]

[QUOTE=ohrebecca;3188273]
The horse always rears up when being euth’d? I’ve never heard that. Or seen that.

I’m not done with racing. I’m hurt by racing and what’s happened here and in countless other non-televised injuries that don’t receive the media attention and public outcry that this has. But I’m not done with it.

Racing has not always been like this, I stand by that, and I stand by the affirmation that it WON’T always be like this. Obviously no one knows how long it will take, but something has GOT to give.[/QUOTE]

I’ve never seen a horse rear when euth’d either. I’ve been with 5 in the last 5 years. All but one recieved 2 shots…the first is to sedate, the second is the barbituate OD. I’ve never seen any other reaction than a downward, lying down motion, with the exception of a small pony that dropped forcefully and she was the one that did not get the sedative first.

[boosma47]

[QUOTE=BelladonnaLily;3186769]
Findeight, i saw the same thing…she put her head up for a moment like she was thinking about pulling up. I wasn’t sure if I saw what I thought I saw but I must have…

Very sad. I just feel sick.[/QUOTE]

I noticed a check in her stride, also. Perhaps imagined, but she continued on unsound, a little short strided and unbalanced.

And, I concur that Big Brown showed unsoundness as he was led away. With his bad feet, freakish strength and talent, he will go to the breeding shed and pass on the weak feet to generations to come, contributing to more breakdowns…

And these babies are so breathtakingly gorgeous and courageous, eager and all heart.

[Twomanydawgs]

Still no idea what you saw…usually it’s a shot of tranq of some kind and then it’s the T60…it’s called sleep away…it paralizes their breathing which in turn stops their heart…they are so sedated anways before they get T60…which is the blue stuff…it is irrresposable to needlessly alarm the uninitated…and first your story you had seen 2…now it’s 5?. which is it?? I’m thinking you know not what you speak…

[harvestmoon]

[QUOTE=boosma47;3188324]
I noticed a check in her stride, also. Perhaps imagined, but she continued on unsound, a little short strided and unbalanced.

And, I concur that Big Brown showed unsoundness as he was led away. With his bad feet, freakish strength and talent, he will go to the breeding shed and pass on the weak feet to generations to come, contributing to more breakdowns…

And these babies are so breathtakingly gorgeous and courageous, eager and all heart.[/QUOTE]

I thought Big Brown was just bobbing up and down, still wanting to go. According to his trainer, he’s fine.

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/article/45043.htm

[hundredacres]

nevermind…I read incompletely (d’oh)

[Twomanydawgs]

I was referring to Dick not you…my bad…I thought it was his post that said he had seen five which would have contradicted his first post…my mistake.

[MSP]

It may be the difference between track vets and regular practice but my filly was put down by the track vet and I had to run away from her as soon as she got the injection. She leaped up and came crashing to the ground.

It adds to the bad memories and forever heart ache. The track vet was the only one I could get to come out. I had to wait 3 hours to put her down and I think I called every vet in New England. Track vet had to finish duties at the races before he could come out.

I love racing but I hate racing if you know what I mean. It could be soooo much better.

[HuntrJumpr]

[QUOTE=DickHertz;3188283]
I’ve seen it as a bettor and standing next to one. The vet says “now after I give the second shot, the horse will rear then flip over.”[/QUOTE]

Uh…? Sorry, but I’m pretty sure that is 100% incorrect. I work a vet clinic - they do not rear up, flip over, then die.

[hundredacres]

[QUOTE=Twomanydawgs;3188347]
I was referring to Dick not you…my bad…I thought it was his post that said he had seen five which would have contradicted his first post…my mistake.[/QUOTE]
Mine too - so sorry…I read on and see why you got confused. I deleted my snippey comment (blush).

[DickHertz]

[QUOTE=Twomanydawgs;3188330]
Still no idea what you saw…usually it’s a shot of tranq of some kind and then it’s the T60…it’s called sleep away…it paralizes their breathing which in turn stops their heart…they are so sedated anways before they get T60…which is the blue stuff…it is irrresposable to needlessly alarm the uninitated…and first your story you had seen 2…now it’s 5?. which is it?? I’m thinking you know not what you speak…[/QUOTE]

From Equineprotectionnetwork.com

" The veterinarian may prefer to pre sedate the horse with a tranquilizer. This allows the handler to better control the fall and reduces the horse’s unconscious and reflex movements. A violent fall and reflex movements can be very disturbing to the horse’s owner and observers who are not familiar with a horse being euthanised. The drug overdose is delivered via an intravenous injection in the horse’s neck. The veterinarian will use two 60cc syringes to administer 120ccs of the barbiturate to the average 1000 pound horse. The drugs used, (barbiturates, anesthetics), directly depress the central nervous system. The overdose leads to a depression of breathing and cardiac arrest."

I don’t think in the cases I saw that the pre-sedate the horse as outlined above. Have you ever seen a horse put down while standing next to it on the racetrack?

I said I’ve seen it in person in two different ways…I didn’t say how many times for each way idiot. Do you want me to give you the horse’s names so you can look them up to make sure their last race had the comment “Broke Down”. And the point of the original post was to explain why they pull every vehichle imaginable to a break down.

EDIT: Further down on the same site

“The horse may or may not become ataxic (wobbly) upon delivery of the drug. The drugs will cause the horse to lose consciousness and collapse. Due to their large size most horses tend to drop rather suddenly. Some horses may go over backwards or lunge forward.”

http://equineprotectionnetwork.com/rescue/euth.htm

[MSP]

[QUOTE=DickHertz;3188363]
From Equineprotectionnetwork.com

" The veterinarian may prefer to pre sedate the horse with a tranquilizer. This allows the handler to better control the fall and reduces the horse’s unconscious and reflex movements. A violent fall and reflex movements can be very disturbing to the horse’s owner and observers who are not familiar with a horse being euthanised. The drug overdose is delivered via an intravenous injection in the horse’s neck. The veterinarian will use two 60cc syringes to administer 120ccs of the barbiturate to the average 1000 pound horse. The drugs used, (barbiturates, anesthetics), directly depress the central nervous system. The overdose leads to a depression of breathing and cardiac arrest."

I don’t think in the cases I saw that the pre-sedate the horse as outlined above. Have you ever seen a horse put down while standing next to it on the racetrack?

I said I’ve seen it in person in two different ways…I didn’t say how many times for each way.[/QUOTE]

Yup, my horse had one injection! I don’t think the track vets like to fool around with making things easier for the people but get right to what is best for the horse.

[Sannois]

Ditto!

@Twomanydawgs;3188292

Hmmm I worked at the track and at breeding farms for years and have seen countless horses put down for one reason or another and I have never seen that…and “the second shot”??? HUH??? More often than not it only takes one shot of T60 to do the job…if they are standing they fall like a ton of bricks…end of story. Have no idea what you are talking about Dick. Whatever Dick…I’m really sorry for your single horrific experience…you are the perfect example of why a little knowledge is a dangerous thing…euthanazia is usually a peaceful passing…and more often than not it’s the right thing to do…

HAve seen many put down, and a few of my own, and never experienced that.
I have seen one bad one, a pony but I know that can occur. the rearing up… hmm not ever.

[Twomanydawgs]

Correct Dick BUT that is NOT the norm…trust us on this…