English to Western Training Tips

[shadedingray]

My 6 year old OTTB mare has been trained/schooled (by me) english for the time I’ve had her (2 years). I just started transitioning to western riding as I’m at a barn where I do a lot of trail riding. I’m also without an english saddle at the moment and I find western saddles more comfortable to ride in for flatwork and trails.

I’ve been working with my mare to teach her neck reining cues and getting her used to riding on less direct contact with her mouth. She’s very intelligent and has started picking this up beautifully, but I’d like to hear any tips or advice you guys have on continuing to make this transition.

Anyone else have successfully re-trained their OTTB from english to western or a horse that is more forward/english style? What are the best ways to get them to relax and slow down on less contact?

The way I’ve been teaching her to neck rein is using outside leg aids when turning, and using two hands on the rein. So direct reining to turn, while also applying the neck rein cue and slowly trying to wean her off the direct rein cue so she is only responding to outside leg and neck rein. When working on trot and canter work, I typically start with more contact on two reins and then slowly lengthen the reins and get her listening to my seat and legs only. This works great at the trot, but she needs more help at the canter. I will use the same approach, but have to pick up more contact in order to settle her and help get her body straight before lessening the contact again. I have gotten a few strides of a true lope from her, but she typically can’t hold it for that long.

[beau159]

Just to mention, there is no reason why you can’t ride her the way you normally ride her (English) while you are trail riding. Tack is tack. You can “ride English” in Western tack, and “ride Western” in English tack. The tack really has little to do with it; it’s about how you cue your horse and what you expect from them.

And really, what makes a type of riding “English”? What makes it “Western”? Mostly, the show ring. So if you are not in the show ring and just enjoying your horse … who cares?

Of course, there is nothing wrong with teaching your horse new concepts if that is what you’d like to do.

[QUOTE=shadedingray;8790217]

The way I’ve been teaching her to neck rein is using outside leg aids when turning, and using two hands on the rein. So direct reining to turn, while also applying the neck rein cue and slowly trying to wean her off the direct rein cue so she is only responding to outside leg and neck rein. When working on trot and canter work, I typically start with more contact on two reins and then slowly lengthen the reins and get her listening to my seat and legs only. This works great at the trot, but she needs more help at the canter. I will use the same approach, but have to pick up more contact in order to settle her and help get her body straight before lessening the contact again. I have gotten a few strides of a true lope from her, but she typically can’t hold it for that long. [/QUOTE]

This is essentially how I teach horses to neck rein. Give them the direct rein (that they know) but also add leg and add the supporting neck rein. Slowly, over time, you’ll drop the direct rein, but still give them the neck rein and the leg cue. And then lastly, you technically can drop the reins all-together and steer strictly with your legs and seat. That can be your ultimate goal.

[QUOTE=shadedingray;8790217]
What are the best ways to get them to relax and slow down on less contact?[/QUOTE]

Neck reining is one thing. Relaxing and slowing down is another.

If you are talking about a nice slow job or a nice slow lope, that takes a lot of collection from the horse. Just like you have self-carriage with an English horse (where they are not hanging on the reins and you are just “supporting” them), you will have self-carriage with a Western horse and a loose rein. You are still supporting them with the rein, but they don’t need it there all the time.

Of course, collection takes a long time to achieve (correctly, that is).

In general, I find putting lots of miles and wet saddle blankets on a horse teaches them to relax and not be in a hurry to get anywhere. So start logging some serious miles trail riding!

Give them that loose rein on the trail and give them time. You can also help them to start to think “slow” by doing lots of serpentines, or even lots of stop/go transitions.

[dog_amp_horsemom]

I had a ottb that bucked his previous owner off and was demonstrating some bad habits when I rode him so I bought a book by Clinton Anderson - its green and has a pic of him and his horse on it and inside are step by step instructions for an english rider and a western rider. I bought a barrel saddle and basically did the entire training method on him and he turned out wonderful - he was in a ‘frame’ with an extremely soft mouth and trotted and loped very quietly. I was diligent about practicing six days a wk and I did have to get Clinton’s dvd ‘leads and lead changes’ & used one of the exercises in it to get this horses right lead. That was the lead that he bucked on and this method fixed that. He ended up going like a western pleasure horse - very enjoyable to ride and he loved every bit of it. ( the lesson that gets them to slow down is called ‘the cruising lesson’).

[shadedingray]

Thanks for the input guys! To clarify, I totally agree you can ride english in a western saddle and western in an english saddle. The differences I’m looking for is mainly I feel I should ride two handed with direct rein contact/cues for english and I want to ride one handed, with neck reins cues and more seat/leg aids in a western saddle.

beau, what you said about my end goal being cues with only leg and seat are exactly correct. I would love that to be my end goal with my mare. She is really responsive english and I’ve ridden her bareback a lot as well, but she is only familiar with english direct rein contact. Riding her that way western takes away from why I love western saddles and riding so much! I want her to go on a loose rein like a “real” western horse, haha.

Thank you both for your suggestions. I’ll keep at it and maybe check out the Clinton Anderson stuff. I am not super familiar with his methods and I don’t subscribe to any one trainer. But I love taking bits and pieces from different styles to add to the toolbox.

[TSE]

[QUOTE=beau159;8792721]

This is essentially how I teach horses to neck rein. Give them the direct rein (that they know) but also add leg and add the supporting neck rein. Slowly, over time, you’ll drop the direct rein, but still give them the neck rein and the leg cue. And then lastly, you technically can drop the reins all-together and steer strictly with your legs and seat. That can be your ultimate goal.[/QUOTE]

Can you help me understand how this jives with “inside leg, outside rein”? Doesn’t the outside leg encourage bending the wrong way? Doesn’t the outside leg encourage a shoulder-first turn? Maybe ‘neck reining’ differs from ‘reining’. In reining, don’t you want a head-first turn instead of a shoulder-first turn?

[beau159]

[QUOTE=TSE;8794081]
Can you help me understand how this jives with “inside leg, outside rein”? Doesn’t the outside leg encourage bending the wrong way? Doesn’t the outside leg encourage a shoulder-first turn? Maybe ‘neck reining’ differs from ‘reining’. In reining, don’t you want a head-first turn instead of a shoulder-first turn?[/QUOTE]

I teach my horses to move away from leg pressure.

Imagine the horse having 3 “buttons” for the riders legs. The front button controls the shoulders. The middle button controls the ribcage. The back/hind button controls the hindquarters.

I move my leg into the certain position I desire. I can also alter how strong of a leg cue I give them. A soft cue will ask for a more smaller response from the horse and a strong cue will ask for a larger response.

Knowing those things, you can then “push the buttons” for what you want.

If I want the horse to do a left rollback, I will cue with my right leg forward and strong. I want to swoop those shoulders away from my right leg. If the horse needs it, I can apply a subtle cue with my left leg back, to help them keep their hindquarters in place, but most won’t need that.

Or if you want to lope a nice large slow circle to the right, I can steer the horse with my legs. If I want to make the right circle smaller, I give them more left leg (mostly forward, to steer the shoulder in). If I need to keep their ribcage bent, I can also give a little right leg in the center to keep the ribs out. I can also use my left leg accordingly to move the hips as I need.

So I guess that is how I think of it. I use those “buttons” to move the body parts where I want and how.

@TSE;8794081

Doesn’t the outside leg encourage a shoulder-first turn?

Depends where you APPLY the outside leg. You can use that outside leg to do the shoulders, ribcage, or hindquarters, depending on your placement as I discuss above.

@TSE;8794081

Can you help me understand how this jives with “inside leg, outside rein”? Doesn’t the outside leg encourage bending the wrong way?

Again, it all depends on where you are apply your legs.

Most of the time, if I want a horse to turn to the left using neck rein, I am going to lay the right rein on their neck to “push” them away, as well as use my outside leg (right leg) to push the shoulders away. So I normally use outside rein and outside leg to neck rein, unless I need to help the horse in some other way with my legs.