Equation Saddlery

[ec412]

@Dressage_Rider;4198222

Same here. I ended up buying a Custom Saddle from Custom Saddlery and LOVE it. The customer service is unbeatable; the saddle is super nice and comfortable. My horse moves better in his new saddle by Custom Saddlery. Hensley Georges saddle did fine when we did walk/trot/canter but once we started to work on upper level movements the horse was locked in his shoulders due to saddle fit. The new saddle solved the problem. I have been waiting for months to get my Equation saddle fixed and fitted to my horse with no luck.

I too noticed the first time posters. [edit] In addition, if you are not in a heated barn, it affects the air in the saddle. The problem I found with the way he fits saddles is that your horse continues to change unevenly, which requires constant attention and adjustments. What ended up working best for me was getting the best fit on my horse (Albion), then using a mattes while my horse muscled properly and evenly. After a year, I was able to stop using the mattes pad. I now only have someone look at my saddle once a year.

I had the same response from Patricia, she can only do so much, and eventually she also stopped calling me back. I was waiting 6-8 weeks on an adjustment that did not work, and I had to stop riding in the saddle as it was causing my horse terrible back pain. I also did not have a back up saddle, and it was during my show season as well.

Boomer, If you love Georges saddles go for it, but be prepared for continuous maintenance and no other fitter will work on the air panels. If it ends up not working out- HE WILL NOT TAKE IT BACK. I wanted to part ways- as he could sell the saddle to another client, but he stopped responding. If you noticed, I did point out to George after his post that most of the complaints were of a customer service nature, not the quality of the saddle parts. He did not respond. Typical.

[ec412]

horses hocks are fine

[QUOTE=hollyb5424;4196159]
I’ve been using George for over 10 years. He’s helped me advance from training level to FEI. I have always been happy with his saddles - as have my horses. Yes, it can be hard to get him booked, but he is one busy man. My horses have never had sore backs. Sore backs can result from sore hocks. Before you blame the saddle fitter, look at your own riding position and training techniques first. A good saddle fit isn’t the cure all for poor riding.[/QUOTE]

It does seems like you were asked to post, as were all the other rave reviews. All of us work on our position every day, every stride, but since getting the right saddle for my horse, moving up the levels just fine-My Vet, Chiro, and massage therapist all pointed to my new “custom” saddle as the source of pain, and when I bit the bullet and bought an Albion so I could RIDE, the pain disappeared. My horse has never been off, never a bad step since getting the Canterbury off his back. The canterbury also put me in a chair seat and the saddle fit was tight for my build. If I stayed with George, would probably still be stuck at first level with a sore and unwilling horse. 2 years later, showing 3rd, schooling PSG in my perfect Albion.

[Gloria]

Wow. I don’t know this person George. Never used his saddles. Am on the fence seeing what other people say about the saddle… Always interested in other nice saddles.

BUT how curious that after he posts the long winding reponse filled with anatomical terms that really say nothing, all the sudden the thread is flooded with I-love- you-George posts from greenies that sound directly out of a sale brochure. Ummm very curious…

[edit]

[Dressage_Rider]

[QUOTE=ec412;4202193]
It does seems like you were asked to post, as were all the other rave reviews. All of us work on our position every day, every stride, but since getting the right saddle for my horse, moving up the levels just fine-My Vet, Chiro, and massage therapist all pointed to my new “custom” saddle as the source of pain, and when I bit the bullet and bought an Albion so I could RIDE, the pain disappeared. My horse has never been off, never a bad step since getting the Canterbury off his back. The canterbury also put me in a chair seat and the saddle fit was tight for my build. If I stayed with George, would probably still be stuck at first level with a sore and unwilling horse. 2 years later, showing 3rd, schooling PSG in my perfect Albion.[/QUOTE]

After reading your post I thought “wow this post sounds like mine.” The saddle that I have from George also puts me in a chair seat and my lower leg is hard to keep steady. I almost feel like I am floating in the saddle instead of feeling secure. I refuse to ride in it for a few reasons, one I cannot continue to struggle with my position, and two the saddle does not fit my horse and makes him angry. My horse does not buck but he does with George’s saddle. Hmmm you have to wonder why.

Here is what George said to me on the phone and it is exactly how he said it. “I am not a sales person; I do not have time to deal with these little insignificant problems. I am out there making and creating saddles, travel all over the world and I do not have time to deal with this. You should be lucky to have my new saddle on trial and you should just buy it because it’s an excellent deal.” This is what he said to me after I told him that his new saddle doesn’t fit me and my horse. I guess I should just buy it because I am so nice and want to give him another $3K. What does it mean he is not a sales person? As soon as you own a business you are a sales person. I think all he wants to do is sell and not service. If he is so busy why not hire someone who can fit his saddles? He was also pretty angry with me not liking his saddles and yet admitted that his older tree will put you in a chair seat but yet he will not buy it back.

[system]

George totally screwed up my saddle

I thought I would follow up on my George experience. I posted earlier about how he came to our barn and sold several saddles. I only wanted my Albion SL looked at and evaluated, and if it needed some flocking, do it. My saddle hadn’t been evaluated for about one year. Anyway, he opened up the tree even wider and removed some flocking. I was surprised that he did that, and told him so, because it looked too wide to me. After riding my saddle a few times, I was sure it was too wide and hard to ride. I might as well have ridden bareback.

A few months later when he came back, to sell some more saddles, which have not turned out real good, we argued about my saddle. I told him I wanted him to put it back to the way it was before he messed with it. He was just sure I was making a big mistake, and I gave in to his BS. He took my saddle and opened it up even wider. He said, this is the way it needs to be. I can tell you without hesitation, that it was terrible, and not only was it hard to sit, but it was also hitting my crotch. I got someone else to try it on their horse, who is a little wider than mine, and it did the same thing to them. The saddle just sucks you forward right into the pommel, because it is too wide, dropping in front. I had to ride my other saddle that I don’t like as much.

About a month later, another saddler showed up at our barn for someone else, and I grabbed him, and I told him what George did, and he agreed that my saddle was way too wide and totally screwed up. He adjusted the tree and added some flocking, and it rides better than it ever has, very comfortable, and I my horse is going better in his lateral work than he ever has, especially half pass. This guy, and his wife are master saddlers, and they know about George, just like we do. George needs to find another way to make a living, because he ain’t too good at this one.

[BitFit_Lady]

I know this is an older thread, but I really want to add my opinions here about George Gulliksen. We were referred to him by Courtney King’s mother at a Chicago show (reliable source – in my opinion). I purchased an equation saddle from him one year ago for my 15 yr old daughter. We had no choice, but to go custom with her due to her length of leg (i.e. she is 6’3" tall with a 37.5 inseam). At the time of his evaluation, I was really hoping that we would NOT hear the words “you need a custom saddle”, as we were going thru really tough times financially. But, that is what happened. I knew George was right, and never felt pressured or taken advantage of. He offered to put us on a paym’t plan, which is not his norm. I didn’t make a decision that day and took many weeks to order, as we needed to sell multiple saddles to earn the money for a custom. Once we had earned the money, we ordered the saddle and paid him the deposit. He did promise us a loaner, which never materialized, BUT, we did have our new custom approx 5 weeks from the date of order. It took Sam (my daughter) a short time to adjust to the new saddle, and the horse was FINALLY unstuck. We had been so frustrated in the past with the horse getting a sore back and refusing even to go forward at times. Sam’s training could finally proceed – THANK GOODNESS!! She will start showing this year – at 3rd/4th level. I know it won’t be long at all and she’ll be at FEI. This has happened for us in big part to our new WONDERFUL saddle, and the incredible expertise of George Gulliksen and his amazing patented ideas. George was just here for our 1st adjustment of the saddle. I hate to have to say that it did take him 5 months of calling, to FINALLY get him here, but it was worth the wait. I’m not justifying his lack of follow-thru with customer service at all, and he is painfully aware of the problem. I know he is planning on some very wise changes in his business, which is going to allow him to be “on the road” more doing what he loves – working directly with the customer. George has absolutely NO IDEA that I am writing this, and we never even discussed this thread, or that I had read it when I was getting frustrated about getting him to come for a saddle adjustment. I have to say that I am absolutely ANGRY at some of the entries on this thread. You people are saying things about a man that you know nothing about, and I am disappointed in myself for allowing this thread to instill doubt in me about George. He is an incredible asset to the riding community and ANYONE needing help solving a riding/saddle issue would be a fool to not try and take advantage of his expertise. I sincerely hope that he does not get frustrated by people like some of you. If we ever lose him due to these types of attacks, it will be a sad day.

[SillyHorse]

@BitFit Lady;4824189

If we ever lose him due to these types of attacks, it will be a sad day.

What you call attacks, I read as people relating their experiences. If he were as great as you believe he is, there wouldn’t be so very many people who have had bad experiences. I think you should consider yourself very lucky not to be adding to the negative posts.

[happyhorsegirl]

Glad you had such a great experience thus far. Hope your good luck continues. My experience crashed and burned in a very bad way. But how dare you insinuate that I posted anything other than my truthful experience simply to tarnish one’s reputation. I have a right and a obligation, in my eyes, to educate others regarding something that was injurious to my horses and a financial disaster for me.

[3s1]

Probably totally irrelevant, but nonetheless worth remarking on - what does he have patents on with respect to saddles?

[ToN_Farm]

[QUOTE=SillyHorse;4824216]
If he were as great as you believe he is, there wouldn’t be so very many people who have had bad experiences.[/QUOTE]
What do you consider ‘so very many’? It’s a handful of people on this board that comment over and over about their dislike of him. Nobody can please everybody all of the time.

George has been at my barn, sold a saddle to a friend, and adjusted my saddle (not his) and there was no pressure at all. He spent a lot of time with my friend. I got very good vibes from him, and I’m not easily fooled by charlatans.

Regarding patents, I don’t know if he has one or not, but he did comment on the 3 position stirrup bar of my Cardanel saddle stated that it was his idea.

[system]

very poor bussiness practices.

I gave Mr Gullikson my saddle back, to sell on consignment over a year ago. He seemed very miffed that I did not want his saddle. It just was not what I was looking for, I wanted one with a more close contact feel. Basically he kept my saddle in a locked van in storage. No one would contact me when I wanted to know the status of my saddle. No one knew where it was or if it had been sold. I tryed to be very nice, and polite and bussiness-like, but towards the end of this fiasco I got super mad!
Finally after repeated phone calls 5 months later I got a response and after I contacted an attorney I had to pay to have my saddle shipped back 3 weeks after I bought the shipping. No one with his staff or wife, or who ever that woman is…seemed to know what was going on, she even said that she has trouble communicating with him
Also after talking with several other saddle fitters, I realized that these saddles have a reputation for being poorly fit. The saddles are a blank that are made in England that you buy the little tree adjuster, that George supposedly designed himself. I know several of my friends love him and have had no trouble at all. Their saddles fit great, or so they say…I am really happy for them! But I feel like if you are not going to spend 5k…you don’t get squat. He thinks he is god’s gift to horses and riders, and if you don’t buy into his program you are a piece of dirt.
If you have great luck with George and just love him, which obviously some folks do… I have a almost new 16.5" saddle I will sell you for 750$

[ToN_Farm]

marycour:I gave Mr Gullikson my saddle back, to sell on consignment over a year ago. He seemed very miffed that I did not want his saddle.
Can you blame him?
It just was not what I was looking for, I wanted one with a more close contact feel.
Shouldn’t you have known that before you purchased the saddle.
Basically he kept my saddle in a locked van in storage.
So you say.
No one would contact me when I wanted to know the status of my saddle. No one knew where it was or if it had been sold. I tryed to be very nice, and polite and bussiness-like, but towards the end of this fiasco I got super mad!
Finally after repeated phone calls 5 months later I got a response and after I contacted an attorney I had to pay to have my saddle shipped back 3 weeks after I bought the shipping. No one with his staff or wife, or who ever that woman is…seemed to know what was going on, she even said that she has trouble communicating with him
LOL ‘no one’. I think there is only one person that helps George, and that is Patricia. He is a busy man and has only the one helper. Sure, they are going to be slower getting back to customers.
Also after talking with several other saddle fitters, I realized that these saddles have a reputation for being poorly fit.
Again LOL. So many incompetents are saddle fitters. They all diss each other’s saddles and technique for fitting.
The saddles are a blank that are made in England that you buy the little tree adjuster, that George supposedly designed himself.
What’s a blank? All these ‘brand’ english saddles are made by one of a handful of Warsaw saddle makers. Albion, Verhan, Verago, Custom Saddlery, to name a few.
I know several of my friends love him and have had no trouble at all. Their saddles fit great, or so they say…I am really happy for them! But I feel like if you are not going to spend 5k…you don’t get squat.
No different than Schleese, County, Albion and the rest of them. They want to sell, not fit.

He thinks he is god’s gift to horses and riders, and if you don’t buy into his program you are a piece of dirt.
Well, if I don’t buy into someone’s program, I don’t use them. It is the consumer’s responsibility to research their saddler seller/fitter. George states his philosophy on his website. If you think it is bullsh&t, don’t call him. I can tell you this. He knows more about the horse and biomechanics of movement than any other saddle fitter I know.
If you have great luck with George and just love him, which obviously some folks do… I have a almost new 16.5" saddle I will sell you for 750$[/QUOTE] I’m sure you could sell it in a heartbeat for that price. Put it up on ebay, ewarmbloods, or udbb.

[SillyHorse]

Geez, ToN Farm, this last post from you is unbelieveble! To address just one point, yes, I can blame someone for being miffed that I’d want to return their product. Haven’t you ever bought something, decided it wasn’t right, and returned it? According to you, you should have known it wasn’t right before you bought it. It was your fault! Was the vendor miffed? If so, I doubt it showed, or that vendor wouldn’t stay in business very long.

We get it – you think this guy walks on water. It seems that there are quite a few (figure out for yourself what that means, please) who don’t. It’s not a crime, and I don’t understand why you seem to be taking it personally.

[ToN_Farm]

Silly Horse, I am not taking it personally and I do not think this guy walks on water either. I just happen to think that a lot of dissatisfied customers (of anyone) don’t really provide the whole story. Especially when it comes to saddles, I think a lot of people don’t ride very well or have horses that have issues and then try to blame it on the saddle.

Also, it bugs me when people have to generate an alter to complain about someone.

You cannot compare buying a saddle to buying various other articles that are ‘returnable’. There are some things that are not returnable and you’d better be sure that you like what you are buying. You can’t return a car, can you. You can trade it in, and lose money, just like this poster had to do with the saddle.

Hmm, can I return a helmet if I ride in it and decide it hurts my head?

[atr]

Walsall.

[Maude]

Saddlers usually guarantee satisfaction

I have heard that Equation saddlery guarantees satisfaction and will continue to work with the customer to get it right. If that was not the case then people have a legitimate complaint. I have a Schleese and I had 30 days to ride in it. Anyone should know that it’s not like trying on a pair of pants that either fit you or not. You can’t sit in a saddle for 1/2 hour and know for sure whether it is what you and your horse need. If the saddle is going to make the horse sore, it takes several rides to determine that. Not defending Equation as I don’t know them or have dealings with them. I do know that Schleese gives you 30 days to ride in the saddle and decide. Anyone should be able to tell after 30 days whether a saddle works for them and their horse. If a saddler promises satisfaction then I think they are obligated to make it right. And, I know for a fact that Dover Saddlery will take an item back if it doesn’t work out i.e. a helmet that hurts your head. It is good business and attracts and keeps customers. Just my 2 cents.

[SillyHorse]

@ToN Farm;4837214

You can’t return a car, can you. You can trade it in, and lose money, just like this poster had to do with the saddle.

You bet you can return a car, if it’s defective. For my money, a custom saddle that doesn’t fit me or my horse the way it’s supposed to is defective.

[ToN_Farm]

[QUOTE=SillyHorse;4837516]
You bet you can return a car, if it’s defective. For my money, a custom saddle that doesn’t fit me or my horse the way it’s supposed to is defective.[/QUOTE]Your argument is ridiculous. Who decides what is ‘defective’. If there is a serious mechanical problem with a new car, probably you can succeed in getting it replaced, but even then I don’t think it would be easy to do. You’d have to jump through some hoops. It’s not a good analogy to the saddle.

Who decides if a saddle doesn’t fit? The rider? When a rider calls in a saddle fitter to purchase a saddle, they are relying on the saddle fitter’s skill in selecting a saddle that fits both horse and rider. If the rider decides he/she doesn’t like the saddle for whatever reason, I think the burden of proof is on them to show why the custom saddle doesn’t fit (defective:lol:). I seriously doubt that a custom saddle that isn’t quite right cannot be adjusted so that it does fit.

I think that is incorrect about Schleese allowing 30 days to ride in a saddle and then you can return it if you don’t like it. I think that within 30 days, you can get free service for fitting. After that you are stuck with the saddle and have to pay for fittting services. I think Schleese has more customer complaints on this board that Equation.

If some stores, like Dover, are willing to accept returns on worn items, then so be it. Maybe they are big enough to eat the cost. In most cases, after a product has be ‘used’, it is not returnable.

It is true that you can’t tell if you really like a saddle until after riding in it for a while. That’s just the way it is. I can’t tell if I like my shoes until I walk in them for a while, but I can’t return them.

I would suggest that if you buy a product, you make sure up front what the rules are for return and get this in writing, including how long you will have to wait for the refund.

Another thing, when you buy a saddle from someone who is based across the country and that person doesn’t have a staff of people to service clients far away, it is common sense that you are not going to get prompt saddle fit service. Even with Schleese, who has several fitters, a wait of 6 months is typical for out of the way states.

I think that many of you people just like a good debate.

[Maude]

ToN Farm,
So nice that you are the saddle fitting expert. And Schleese does have a 30 day trial. I should know since I have personal experience with same. When you buy a Schleese, you get a free fitting whenever you decide you need it. After that, there is a charge. I’ve had great customer service with Schleese. There are always dissatisfied customers with any product. As far as a saddler knowing “his business” and fitting a rider to a saddle…unless the fitter is an accomplished rider (which most are NOT) they don’t always know and understand what a rider needs. For example, some fitters will drop a person’s stirrups so that the rider’s leg fits the kneeblock. Wrong. The knee block should fit the rider not the other way around. As I’ve said, I have no personal experience with the fitter/saddlery in question, but good customer service is imperative in the saddle fitting industry.

[ToN_Farm]

[QUOTE=Maude;4837737]
ToN Farm,
So nice that you are the saddle fitting expert. And Schleese does have a 30 day trial. I should know since I have personal experience with same. When you buy a Schleese, you get a free fitting whenever you decide you need it. After that, there is a charge.[/QUOTE] That’s what I said about Schleese. I probably have had more contact with Schleese than you, being that I’ve owned 5 of their saddles and they have been to my place at least 7-8 times. How do you interpret the 30 day trial? Do you think if you don’t like the saddle, you can return it? I say that no you cannot. You can have it adjusted for free, but that’s it. As for being a saddle fitting expert…yes, I think I’m pretty good at assessing competent fitters and I am educated saddle fitting. An ‘expert’, no. I got my experience by being screwed by fitters multiple times over the years.