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European warmblood registry options for a foal from a SF dam who isn't registered (and may not be able to be)

TLDR: What are my European warmblood registry options for a dam who has known selle francais parentage but for whom I may not be able to get her papers?

I have a lovely riding mare who I adore. I bought her as a “selle francais” but she didn’t come with papers. Oh well, you don’t ride the papers, right? And I was never going to breed. So who cares.

Flash forward four years and I have a 2-year old I’m doing hunter breeding with (not out of her) and I am really enjoying it. So I am thinking… maybe I would like to breed my mare. So I go on a journey to trace her history and I ended up finding out exactly what her breeding is (and, wow, her breeder and former connections could NOT be MORE lovely. I am so glad I decided to try to trace her background).

She is by Ilian de Taute out of Quat’Sous Too. I reached out to SF registry and they have the stallion DNA on file but not the mare’s. And I am not sure I am going to be able to find the mare, or that she’s even alive. I am trying, but let’s assume that doesn’t pan out.

What are my options here to create a situation where the foal can be registered with a European warmblood registry? I know I can take her and get her inspected Westfalen or Oldenburg and as long as I use a stallion in their approved books, the offspring can get SOME papers. And there’s the KWPN book where (seemingly) you can register the cross of nearly any mare with a KWPN stallion. This would be with inspection of the foal.

Are there any options that don’t require inspection at all? I’m not SO anti inspection, but so far none of them appear to be happening anywhere even remotely near where I’m located. And if there’s a decent option that doesn’t require this, that would be easier.

I mean, I might not actually do this… but I would love to know the options from those who know better than me what they are.

You could probably get Auxiliary Book papers with the North American Studbook. https://northamericanstudbook.com/registration/ an inspection wouldn’t be required for mare or foal and you can use any pretty much any stallion you want from other WBFSH member studbooks. Plus, you get to use any name you want! You could probably get Aux papers for your mare too.

PLus you may get some help/advice from Jean Yves and Saret Tola. I think Jean Yves still manages ANSF-US.

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Was Ilian de Taute approved anywhere? KWPN considers mares by an erkend sire as erkend, though you would need to register her somewhere to document and prove the pedigree. And KWPN has great keurings, but it’s entirely possible to register by mail. No mare inspection needed.

He was approved Selle Francais and Canadian Warmblood (I’m in the US). I’d have to research if he was approved with other registries too.

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To clarify, since it looks like your mare’s sire was CWHBA and SF, your mare would very likely be considered “erkend” by KWPN, as long as you register her somewhere and do the DNA to prove her sire. When you breed the mare, if the stallion is KWPN approved, the foal would get foalbook papers. If you use a stallion approved by almost any other legitimate WB registry, the foal would get Register A papers, and would still be eligible for keurings. But keurings aren’t required, for either the mare or the foal. The person to ask is Drew Kemerling at the KWPN-NA.

Oh I follow now. That’s helpful.

Have a look at AES (Anglo-European Studbook) which is a top five studbook but not so well known as the national ones. The American branch is based in Wellington Fl. They use a lot of technology to make assessment and registration as pain free as possible, recognising that everyday life often gets in the way of Breeders.

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The universe smiles on me. We’re getting hair from the dam.

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Good luck!

This doesn’t mean that I will breed her. But at least I’m getting HER papers in order so it’s one less thing to have to think about in the future.

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That was what the good luck was about. :wink:

The DNA gods have shown mercy upon me and I am thankful :wink:

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Some books do online entries and you don’t have to show the mare at a formal inspection. I’ve been looking into this for my mare after going to one inspection and realized I will likely breed her to a different studbook.