Experiences with Live-In Barn Help With Horses?

[Tornado_Run_Farm]

After years of non-use, I’ve decided to offer my barn apartment to someone in exchange for live-in barn help. I’ve done this twice before – once with a family member and once with a friend. Both experiences had more downs than ups, which is why I have been reticent to do so again – although neither time did the tenants have their own horses. However, I’m at the point now where I physically can’t get all the work done that needs to get done AND take care of my horses the way they need. So while my horses have every need addressed, what slips is the plethora of little stuff, but the little stuff has piled up. I need help.

Through word of mouth, I found a lady who really likes the apt and wants to move in asap. She has much horse care experience and seems capable of the extra farm work. She comes with 2 horses (one 23, one 11) whose activity level matches mine – primarily pasture puffs. I have far more pasture than I need, and my set-up can easily accommodate the 2 extra horses.

I’ve called my insurance agent, and getting quotes for different riders, including Care, Custody & Control, Workman’s Comp `and for her renter’s insurance. I’m setting up a contract with set $ affixed for the rent and $/per horse for board – I’m supplying hay only. She will work off rent & board for $/hr. I know to include the basics: cleaning/picking stalls, feed, water, etc., as well as mowing, weed-eating. I’m also including a 6-month renewable clause as an out should things not work out. I think it would probably be wise to have it drafted through an attorney, as well.

My question to those who have had this sort of arrangement – what unforeseen gotcha’s did you encounter? What other kind of things should I consider and/or spell out in a contract? I’m still a bit nervous about this, but having a manageable to-do list, not having to rush home to feed and actually going out of town for a week is more alluring.

[oldfuzzyhorses]

Hours? Days? Overtime or lack thereof? Medical emergencies? Basic, routine medical care? A set schedule with days off (for her own life, emergencies, illness, etc.) or an understanding of how that will be negotiated and re-negotiated as schedules change. Your vet/farrier appointments, if they don’t line up with hers? Other appointments (carpenter, plumber, etc.). Things that are specifically not her problem or jobs she for which she’s not responsible (carpentry, plumbing…).

Having been live-in barn help, nothing is worse than an evolving assumption that you will be there 24/7, and eventually everything under the sun and moon becomes yours to deal with. That was at a boarding barn, though, so not like your situation.

TL;DR: Specify what is not part of the job.

[Weluvhaha]

Problems arise when the person helping you takes on other jobs to earn more money and then isn’t around to do your stuff. It’s hard to tell someone not to earn needed money. Also, her trips/travel/emergencies… how will they be covered? Surely she is entitled to some absences, but it can get out of control first with trips then emergencies on top of that. Like using all the vacation days and THEN getting sick.

You don’t need Care, Custody and Control if she’s there making decisions for her own horses. And unless they are super high value, not worth it.

Be positive.

[khall]

The problem I ran into as the barn help (I was a WS for over a year) is that unless I left the farm entirely I never got a day off. At the time I was trying to go to college and work/ride at the farm as well. I ended up making myself incredibly sick from getting run down and ended up going back home even though I loved the college I was attending. BO told me afterwards she realized that I should have had time off and not worked every day I was there (at times taking care of 23 horses myself, BO was pregnant) so she realized her mistake. I did enjoy and learned so much from my time there but the work just ended up too much for me.

[gloriginger]

[QUOTE=oldfuzzyhorses;8577180]
Hours? Days? Overtime or lack thereof? Medical emergencies? Basic, routine medical care? A set schedule with days off (for her own life, emergencies, illness, etc.) or an understanding of how that will be negotiated and re-negotiated as schedules change. Your vet/farrier appointments, if they don’t line up with hers? Other appointments (carpenter, plumber, etc.). Things that are specifically not her problem or jobs she for which she’s not responsible (carpentry, plumbing…).

Having been live-in barn help, nothing is worse than an evolving assumption that you will be there 24/7, and eventually everything under the sun and moon becomes yours to deal with. That was at a boarding barn, though, so not like your situation.

TL;DR: Specify what is not part of the job.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this. I like that you are doing a set $ amount for board/rent and then having her work the hours to pay for that. I also agree that it is super important to give her days off, and consider what would happen if she has a medical emergency.

I did this sort of arrangement last year, and i got really run down, eventually very sick and have been paying for it for the last 9 months. I had to have surgery this summer, and the BO expected me to be mucking stalls the day after.

In my experience I felt like I was very taken advantage of…there was an expectation that if I was home I was available for any little thing that came up.

In these sort of arrangements, the more you can have in writing spelled out to eliminate subjectivity the better. It may seem like you are being uptight or overly cautious, but when things go sideways, it is really helpful to be able to look back and see what the details of the agreement were.

I pushed the BO where I lived to have the chores spelled out, and she resisted, saying it didn’t need to be so black and white. But I was really thankful that I did insist.

[Wonders12]

You’re off to a very good start by having board & rent worth $X and she works for an hourly wage of $X. Do make sure you settle up at the end of each month.

Something important: Are you expecting her to work part time, mainly just in exchange for board and rent? Or are you expecting her to work full time as her primary source of income, with board and rent just being a benefit?

If it’s the first, you need to be extra respectful of her time and the fact that she will need to have another job. So her hours should be pretty darn set in stone. Any hours outside of that (like for a vacation) should be planned well in advance with her permission, and potentially compensated extra. For true emergencies, if she is able to help, compensate her appropriately and thank her profusely for going above and beyond the call of duty.

If it’s going to be her primary source of income, make sure you’re paying her appropriately. If she can’t live a comfortable modest life, she’s likely to become resentful/find another job, which then causes the problems above. This scenario gives you a little more leeway with scheduling, but there still needs to be a lot of consideration. At least one FULL day and 2 half day/evenings off. Ideally 2 full days and 1 or 2 evenings off. She should almost never hear from you during her time/days off, once per month MAX. The more time off, the better the pay, and the more predicable the schedule, the longer she’s likely to stick around.

As everyone has said, be honest upfront.

[4THEHORSES]

OP this is something we’ve also been considering g since we have a very nice 5th wheel trailer that DH and I lived in briefly while we were waiting to close Escrow on our house.

Check your homeowners policy. Some carriers include workers comp in your policy or can add it at a discounted rate. There are however a few carriers who won’t cover workers who handle or work around livestock. If any of then Berkley companies operate in your area, try them for a quote. They’re neither the cheapest nor the most expensive but they are very good at paying out on genuine claims and will usually offer help in assessing workplace safety.

I’d be realistic about how much can be done in an hour especially in very hot or cold weather. Also, I’d supply the person with good equipment to set them up for success. Like a lawn tractor if grass cutting is involved, for example.

I would try to set a consistent schedule for them then, based on the schedule, book vet and farrier appointment in advance. I understand that’s not always possible but sometimes it is.

I’d also have some sort of petty cash or a prepaid credit card available to them for small work related purchases.

Be clear about the standard you expect in terms of them cleaning and keeping their living area too. And other things like having friends or family visit, is anyone allowed to stay over, and so on.

It’s a great idea but like anything else success is all about setting clear expectations and finding the correct fit.

[Huntin_Pony]

I’d recommend using an attorney familiar with housing law in your area to at least review your contract (IANAL). You want to be as assured as possible that when the employee stops working for you that they also move out and the horses too. You don’t want to have to deal with an eviction.

Also, depending on many factors, the arrangement you propose could involve income to the employee and to you as well as the concomitant reporting requirements. You may want to consult your tax advisor or maybe the above-mentioned lawyer can advise.

Beyond that, I have found that having an employee’s horses on premises ultimately creates problems. For instance, how do you track time spent caring for her horses versus yours? What if you want her horses in a different pasture than yours - I had an employee object that my horses were getting “better” accommodations. (Well, maybe, but it IS my farm and your horses are in a perfectly safe and healthy situation.)

I no longer offer space for horses even if the employee is living on premises.

[Pocket_Pony]

Are you expecting her to take over all the work now and you do none of it? Or are you job sharing in that she will do the harder tasks and you the easier ones; or she will take over certain days and you will have the other days; or she will do mornings and you will do afternoons? I think it is important to be very clear on exactly what it is you expect her to do.

For example, she could do morning turnout and feed breakfast and muck stalls and sweep the barn aisle on a daily basis. You could bring in at night and feed dinner. Once a week she could mow and weed eat. Once a month she could go to the feed store. Or whatever. But it needs to be clearly explained and laid out, as do your expectations for the quality of work done.

Same with the work-for-rent fee structure. Will it be per task or per hour? How will she track her hours? Does she get extra consideration for emergencies (to be billed at regular rate or double/overtime rate?)?

Will/does she have another job? Will she do her chores in the morning and then go to work and you do afternoon, or something similar?

Considering this person will live on your property, I would definitely talk it out thoroughly way beforehand, go to a lawyer to draft an agreement, and have an exit plan in case it doesn’t work out well.

[betsyk]

Haven’t read the whole thread so hope I’m not being redundant. Based on experience from both sides of the fence, consider charging her actual rent and board, and paying her taxable wages. This protects you in case she gets hurt and can’t work - you’ll get the income for the apt. and board - and keeps it tidier with the IRS, etc. I would also suggest you come up with a work schedule that includes 40 hours/week, or whatever you decide, and have an understanding that she would clock in and out (literally or figuratively) each day. In some settings you may be responsible for paying overtime, so look into that before it happens.

[Arzny]

I just left a job like this. I came with no horses, and only one dog, and was meant to be working while at school full time. I left, because as the months went on, I began absorbing more and more responsibilities with no compensation.

Please be sure that she has time off, prepare for medical emergencies (I had to have my appendix removed, and couldn’t work for 6 weeks, which led to conflict), as well as other things that other posters have mentioned. Also remember that the apartment will be her space, and unless she gives you permission to enter, don’t! (this was another issue I had).

Also make it explicit if she can have people over, what times she has to be there, etc. Basically, treat it like a real job, and it will be more successful.

[Displaced_Yankee]

So I am a tenant in this sort of set up. My situation is: I pay my rent plus my utilities (detached house) and “board” for my horse (what he eats in hay and grain). I get $15 reduction in rent per feeding. Currently I feed Friday PM, Saturday AM/PM and Sunday AM/PM. Owners cover the rest. If myself or the owners will be out of town, we offer to switch days. Or I may do a few extra feedings (pay less rent) or not as many (pay a little more) depending on what is going on that month. As I live closest to the barn I do fill water tubs regardless of the day if they are low (even though they are checked twice a day) as a courtesy when I see them low or if I am out walking the dog etc.

Why this works for me: No one gets burned out or over worked. My chores are scheduled and predictable and I can make plans around them or in advance. No tallying of hours, no bickering over how long I was “on the clock” to do chores. I have a very clear picture of what my next months rent will be by last week of the month (truthfully, we are in such a routine that its been the same for the last several months).

The issue that I see with an hourly pay structure is who is going to monitor it? What if she decides to groom her horse before he is turned out, before she picks stalls? Is that on the clock or off? How quickly do you need to reconcile so she can get you a check?

As far as projects go, my landlords are able to do all that. But in your situation why not supply the materials and say for x project, you can take y amount off your rent. Projects may be reoccurring or not, but that way the amount is determined up front and she can work as slow or as quickly as she wants and you aren’t on the hook if she spends all day scrubbing water tubs (we all know THAT person).

Just thoughts to consider…

[IronwoodFarm]

I would NOT combine the rental and the board/work agreement. Keep is separate. That way if the wheels fall off one arrangement, the other ones don’t automatically terminate. If she stops working for you, perhaps you want to keep her as a tenant or as a boarder.

If this is her only job, then I would think 112 times about doing it. She really needs to have another source of income to cover her expenses and the rent, if necessary. It’s not a good idea to have a situation where if something happens, like she gets a bad case of the flu that keeps her out for a couple of weeks, then she may end up owing money. You do not want to get into a situation where the tenant owes you money every month and can’t pay it.

[Hej]

[QUOTE=IronwoodFarm;8578476]
I would NOT combine the rental and the board/work agreement. Keep is separate. That way if the wheels fall off one arrangement, the other ones don’t automatically terminate. If she stops working for you, perhaps you want to keep her as a tenant or as a boarder.

If this is her only job, then I would think 112 times about doing it. She really needs to have another source of income to cover her expenses and the rent, if necessary. It’s not a good idea to have a situation where if something happens, like she gets a bad case of the flu that keeps her out for a couple of weeks, then she may end up owing money. You do not want to get into a situation where the tenant owes you money every month and can’t pay it.[/QUOTE]

I have to agree with this 110%.

Assuming the live-in barn worker is not a full time employee with housing as a benefit, keep rent & board separate from payment for services rendered.

She pays you rent and board, then you pay her for work done, and I strongly advise paying per job rather than per hour, with each job clearly defined.

It seems like just trading checks sometimes, but if your tenant decides that she can’t do some or all of the work, it’s much much simpler. She pays you the same amount of rent and board, and you have your costs covered while you look for a new worker.

BDDT.

[Tornado_Run_Farm]

Thanks everyone for your responses – all VERY valuable!

Ironwood & Hej - I hadn’t thought about making this arrangement into 3 distinct contracts, but that makes great sense: one for the apartment rental (also covering ground rules); one for the boarding; one for labor and compensation. And for others who also say she has to have an outside source of income, I totally agree! I cannot provide full time employment nor could I afford that. That was the first thing I covered when I talked to this lady. She works for her sister’s house-cleaning service, and picks up a couple houses a week. She also has health insurance.

As part of her rent, I’m covering all utilities except phone and anything > $100 electric. I’m running security lights, fans, enough heat/air to keep the tack room comfortable & pipes from freezing, so I have no qualms paying my fair share – first $100. Argzny - As far as privacy, I concur. I have a separate bathroom and small refrigerator in the common tack room. There will be no need to access her apartment except in emergency. The apartment also has a fenced, enclosed patio & small yard for which she’ll be responsible for keeping mowed & kept up – and off my nickel.

Regarding the labor, I really do want to be fair and not burn her out. Khall, OFH, GG - Although it’s been many decades ago now I was on the other side of things, too, when I worked off a garage apt. rent in exchange for kennel help, so I hear your perspective. I’ve already told this lady I will never ask her to do something I haven’t done myself or wouldn’t be willing to do myself. Also in hopes of keeping things from getting too messy, I want to treat this as contract labor – if you don’t work you don’t get paid. Betsyk – I plan to issue a 1099. D’Yankee - I know exactly how much time it takes to do the jobs I’m asking her to do, since I’ve been doing them myself. I have also considered the $/hour vs. $/task. I’m asking her to keep a timesheet – anything that seems to have excessive time applied will be opened for discussion. I’m offering her 2 days off/week, which she was a little surprised by but very appreciative of. Wonders – we loosely discussed schedule, but haven’t really nailed that down yet – I will. 4tH – I hadn’t thought about a petty cash jar but think that’s a good idea to cover gas for mower, etc. I’ll ask that money out be replaced with a receipt in. As far as tools, I have as many gidgets & gadgets & mowers I can afford - always looking for ways to save time, not to mention my back.

For the board, I went through the breakdown costs of feed/hay, bedding, and labor. Of course, she’ll be doing the labor – but I also pointed out those 2 days off she’ll be off-premise? I will be charging her the same $ for taking care of her horses as I pay her to do mine. And at the end of every month, we’ll settle up the different aspects of the arrangement in separate transactions. What I have made clear to her is the #hours she will need to work to cover her rent & board, and she will have the opportunity to make more given my needs and her schedule.

4tH – I’m going to insert a pretty hefty ground rules clause to address “guests” and grounds keeping. Advanced overnight/weekend guests notice required. I’ve been down that road before. I have a small fishing lake with picnic table and fire pit. I was home one day when all of a sudden 6-7 young men walked up with their fishing poles because “Eli” said it’d be ok. Eli was a guy working for me who I had given permission to fish – but had NO intention of making that offer transferable to 7 guys I had never seen before! Egads! :eek:

I haven’t received quotes for insurance yet, and coverage needed is still very murky for me. Weluvhaha – thanks for mentioning not needing CCC coverage. I’ll find out why ins. agent thought it would be good to have – maybe we should review my situation again.

HPony & PPony – I do want to have an attorney review the contracts, and I want to make them 6-month renewable, both to act as an exit as well as to tweak as needed when new situations arise. I’ll also review with tax preparer. She has been telling me ever since I got out of breeding that I need to make this a working farm again. I hope that boarding a couple horses and renting out the apt. will suffice, but I will go over that with her soon.

Again – thanks for all the responses and feedback! I really appreciate it. It really has helped me focus and detail out what otherwise are just different thoughts swirling around.

I sincerely hope this all works out!

[Wonders12]

[QUOTE=Tornado Run Farm;8579042]
Also in hopes of keeping things from getting too messy, I want to treat this as contract labor – if you don’t work you don’t get paid. Betsyk – I plan to issue a 1099. [/QUOTE]

You might want to double check this. Nothing about this set-up reads “Independent Contractor” to me.

She can still be an hourly employee and only get paid when she works.

[Tornado_Run_Farm]

[QUOTE=Wonders12;8579302]
You might want to double check this. Nothing about this set-up reads “Independent Contractor” to me. [/QUOTE]

Google says you’re right; you probably already knew that. :concern: Obviously I didn’t do my basic homework nor did it dawn on me to do so – made ASSumption.