So… if I were to hire someone to do farm work on my farm and allow them to use my equipment, what happens if that person breaks the equipment? I’m having a bit of a debate with my family on this one… they think that the person using the equipment should pay if they damage it…but my thought is how are they going to know where a rock is that might bust the blades? Or in one case, I had my help doing something that I asked them to do and the bucket had issues no fault of their own. I paid for it… but i’ve been asked to have them sign something they are responsible for the equipment… I could understand maybe if they were completely negligent, but wanted to ask your thoughts… thanks.
I’ve seen it go both ways. However, you need to talk to your insurance agent as well. There is a liability issue too.
I will say, that the property I am hired to take care of has this arrangement: if the equipment I am using is the owner’s, they are responsible for damage and wear. If I bring my own equipment I am responsible for damage/wear And I charge more accordingly.
Personally, I might not work for someone who had me sign that I was responsible for their equipment as I have no idea how they have been maintaining it. If a hydraulic hose goes because the owner has let it rub for 400 hours of operation, how is that my fault when I have only run the machine for an hour? Yes, that has happened.
Now, if the equipment is loaned to me, for my projects, then I am responsible for it.
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They are thinking that if you, for example, hire a stall cleaner and while they are spreading manure something on either the tractor breaks or the manure spreader breaks that the laborer is responsible to pay to fix the tractor or the manure spreader?
That sounds kind of crazy to me.
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My 2cents:
If the person running your equipment is knowledgeable, then unavoidable damage - like the rock you mention - is owner’s responsibility, but user might be asked (IMO: should offer) to share repair cost.
If damage is due to blatant misuse, User should pay. If failure to maintain, then owner shoulders the full expense.
I’ve seen a BO friend allow her “Help” < read: boarders who act like they have part ownership (which BO allows) use her equipemnt - spreader, hay elevator, down to small things like hoses - and damage said equipment.
Same “Help” has also purchased a compact tractor “for the barn” - which they then fail to maintain and use incorrectly until it needs repair. Same for an ATV.
BO generally has to pay to repair the item, or friend-of-Help does a halfassed repair to save $$.
I tell BO she has waaaaay too many Chiefs & not enough Indians, but it’s her circus, they are her monkeys, so…
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Part of the question here is whether this person is an employee or an independent contractor. It also depends on what state you live in. For example, in California, the standard is
An employer may not deduct for cash shortage, breakage, or equipment loss unless caused by the employee’s gross negligence, or dishonest or willful act
Note you may want to have insurance for your equipment; an independent contractor may have insurance (and you may want them to).
If you are randomly hiring people for cash to come and do jobs on your equipment, you may be taking on other liability that you don’t fully appreciate, particularly workman’s comp type issues, should they be hurt working for you. When you are supplying equipment, that is shifting the balance towards yourself as an employer rather than work done by an independent contractor, and if you have misclassified your worker and it comes to the attention of various authorities, you can be on the hook for some unpleasantness.
I’m not a lawyer, this is just random Stuff To Ask Yours About.
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Even though about one of every 300 adults in the US has a law degree, not all of us have a lawyer available to ask questions like these, so “ask your lawyer” responses are pretty lame for us.
Personally, when I hire someone as an individual and offer them the use of my equipment, it is on me if there is a break or a problem.
Your equipment, you chose to allow someone else to use it, your problem if it breaks.
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Maybe true, but the issue mentioned went past broken stuff, to broken people. I think it is a valid point to get professional input on that. We are all guilty of doing those quick ‘I got somebody to help for the day’ deals going without considering the bigger picture and legal ramifications if something does hit the fan. Most never need to consider it. Until they do.
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I would absolutely pay to consult a lawyer before asking a potential employee (either independent contractor or otherwise) to sign a contract like that. Even if you can get then to sign it-- and I’ve never seen a barn require something like this-- that doesn’t mean it’s legally enforceable. If the employee is in fact an independent contractor-- which is often not the case if they use your equipment-- you can require them to carry their own insurance which may cover at least some of the costs in case of equipment breakage although I would guess you would still have to be able to prove it was due to negligence and not misfortune or wear and tear. If they’re a regular employee your insurance may cover some of the costs but depending on your policy it may not help you unless there’s a major catastrophe.
And of course, hopefully all of your employees will be legally able to work and paid by the book and you will purchase workmen’s comp coverage.
Personally, I think the advice from the person that wants me to get something in writing is kinda crazy. I’d never sign myself if I was the worker… I just wanted some more input into it in case I was the crazy one. As usual, I’ve got lots of added things to think about. I think I will stick with my hiring my landscaper guys who use most of their own equipment unless its for a specific job like picking up logs from trees or rock that just makes more sense for them to use the equipment and get it done faster. I did let them borrow it at one time, and the hydraulic hose broke… i paid for it. Thanks all!!
One doesn’t always have to have a lawyer on this sort of thing, it is part of the fine print in most insurance contracts for farms, but it isn’t always clear. Your insurance agent can be a huge, huge help with this sort of thing.
Negligence causing breakage is a different thing from wear/expected damage, but even there it gets complicated. Did you as the owner ensure that the person did in fact understand how to run the equipment safely? If not…then the negligence may spin back onto the owner.
And then the whole employee or contractor thing. Cans, cans of worms!
