I’m afraid to use the whip because I feel like the horse will buck.
It’s flat out fear. So that might be your rider’s issue too.
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To ad “emphasis” to one’s aids, the French clinician who has helped me a lot suggested
(a) Using spurs if the rider’s leg is steady enough
(b) Using the whip on the shoulder
The use of the whip behind the leg is used as the aid for the croupade…maybe change where the whip is used but get the point across to the horse
Thank you! I actually started doing that last lesson. Using it on the shoulder actually helps keep my hands steadier and it seemed to make the point that I was asking for an immediate reaction of forward.
In his defense this is all brand new to this particular horse and he’d never seen a whip before. As he is adjusting my fear is lessening, but it still creeps in and obviously has the exact opposite effect. I stiffen, he stiffens, forward is lost.
I can’t believe how much I’m gaining from this thread, lol.
Yes, you are correct. Although his “buck” is not much at all. But yes, there is a certain amount of fear there. And to be expected. She is a mom with 2 young kids at home. So I do get it.
Pluvinel, I was trained by old cavalry types too. So I struggle with being the psychologist. I also struggled with fear after being dumped by my horse twice breaking bones both times. So, I understand where it comes from as well.
I winced when you suggested using spurs as “spurs are not meant for forward” has been drilled into my brain. I winced (a bit less) when you suggested using the whip on the shoulder beause it is meant to reinforce the leg. But that might be a compromise I am willing to take.
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If I didn’t know better I would think you were my coach :D. Haha. I hear her voice when reading your words.
I also have two younger kids, my horses buck also isn’t much… I wish your student luck! And thank you for asking this question.
I would agree that “spurs are not meant for forward”…but they ARE meant to reinforce a leg aid. I recently had a lesson with another French trainer (Cadre Noir also) who said I should use the spur to get my horse more reactive to the leg…and said I was capable of using them as my leg was quiet.
I am just passing on suggestions made to me by 2 credentialed instructors I think very highly of.
I actually think this is good. Why?
(1) You can actually feel the changes in your body and how your stiffness impacts his way of going. I know 3 people who are totally non self-aware of how what they are doing is reflected by their horse…and are always blaming the horse.
(2). The second “good thing” is you have a horse that once he understands what you want, is right there willing to give it to you.
I think you have a great professor in this horse. He seems kind (but opinionated). He is holding a mirror up to you and letting you know that perhaps you need to chill…relax…and let him know what you want.
When I was typing #1 above, I started by thinking of 1 person…then I remembered another…then remembered another…so we are up to 3 people who are clueless. You are not in that category which is a very, very good thing.
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Transitions and half steps!
Canter walk canter with a change of direction on two circles and some big canters on a larger circle in between.
I’ll go a bit of a different way. I agree with hundreds of transitions, but they have to be good ones. So you need to be able to back up a polite request with a sharp escalation.
What has worked with my work-averse guy for years has been my warmup pattern. Pick a rein, have a nice contact, and walk. Turn down CL, and do quite a steep walk LY to the wall, aiming to get to the wall before B/E. At the exact moment you get to the wall, kick up sharply into trot. Trot the long side, walk in the corner, repeat on the same rein 3 or 4 times. Then repeat on the other side a few times.
If you’ve done this for a few days, your horse starts to anticipate the upwards transition. Let him anticipate, and give huge praise when he takes the initiative to jump into trot. Anticipation is your friend here. It really shifted my gelding’s mindset, and sets a great tone for the rest of the ride. Sometimes I switch it up and after a few walk ones, I will do the LY in trot and expect a BIG surge into canter on the wall. I think something about them learning the pattern, and getting a big praise for making the decision to go forward themselves clicks with the lazier ones.
But this is not a one-ride thing. It might take a few days of practice to really get them into the mindset of trying hard to get praised.
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Hello, sort of late to this conversation. Great advice.
I’d add that maybe the horse isn’t forward because the horse is lazy and isn’t picking up his legs because the rider isn’t asking. I find that at the walk head to the wall/fence leg yields at about a 45 degree angle reminds the horse to use those hind legs but the rider will need to reinforce that ask. Even at the walk, leg yielding right and left with a meaningful leg yield in the walk gets the horse more active and forward. Is she following the horse’s mouth in the walk and canter forward-and-back? That can make a huge difference in how forward they are.
Transitions CAN be good if they know how to do them. Transitions don’t help some horse and rider combos if they aren’t well executed. I like exercises within gaits that loosen the jaw and encourage use of the topline and free and forwardness. But yes, the rider has to be comfortable with riding a forward horse.
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Transitions won’t work if the rider is afraid and pinching with their legs or leaning forward. Perhaps the horse moves nicely forward on the trail because the rider is breathing and relaxed.
Here’s a snippet of a JJ Tate video which describes a bit what I’m saying.
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I agree that it sounds like fear is an issue. I would be addressing how the rider asks for forward (is it by nagging, is the rider afraid to reinforce the request, how are requests reinforced, how sharp are the rider’s aid, etc) and I’d also be looking at building confidence on the lunge. Remove stirrups and reins, practice adjustability within the gaits on the lunge and get the rider very comfortable with a good seat in very forward gaits. Utilize cavaletti and the horse may even appreciate some small jumps. Build confidence so the rider can confidently ask for the aid and reinforce correctly if the horse doesn’t respond. Transitions have been mentioned but adjustability within the gaits have not and I think that’s also very important.
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I consider transitions within the gait as transitions…like slow walk-working walk-extended walk and back to slow/collected walk. Ditto for trot and canter. All should be done from the seat with minimal rein aids.
If fear is an issue…you can see what happens when you take away the stirrups…you can ask the rider to ride the walk without stirrups. You could then lunge the rider without stirrups asking them to hold the saddle…one hand on the pommel…one hand on the cantle…so that rider faces inside of the circle. Then take away one hand then another until rider is comfortable without stirrups. Ditto for canter.
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My horse was a bit of a SLUG for awhile there. The biggest thing was treating some discomfort that was a bit hidden.
He still occasionally likes to get behind the leg at the walk. I like what another poster said about putting the horse right to work even at the walk. That helps my horse. He’s very smart so getting his brain going instead of just ambling around at the walk on a loose rein seems to help. He’s very sensitive to the seat and aids so like was mentioned before, I have to make sure that my seat is nice and supple too.
Pole work also seems to help get my horse more forward thinking as well.
Another thing that seems to help my horse is giving stretch breaks pretty often in between hard work. For him, it’s quality over quantity. Keeps him more fresh minded. Some horses don’t do as well with lots of breaks but my horse really does well with that approach.
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Also something that was interesting was when my horse was in partial professional training and I would come and he was just SO behind the leg. It used to feel like nothing could get forward, like the hardee you tried the worst he sucked back.
Now that I’m his main rider as an ammy, he’s very sensitive and light most the time. Like whispers of aids are usually all that’s needed. I have two theories about that.
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The discomfort was addressed. I know you said the horse is not in pain but I just want to put it out there that my horse was cleared by many vets, bodyworkers and I had two professional trainers telling me that my horse was a slug because of ME and nothing was bothering him. Well we found plenty of reasons for him to be uncomfortable when we looked harder.
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To my point above in a previous comment, I think the professional trainer I had riding him was a very electric person. She had high energy. She was a very beautiful rider but more demanding and less forgiving in nature. And then I would come and ride him and I’m a very low energy person. Like I’m just a bit too quiet sometimes. I also think that she didn’t really give him the breaks in between the work like I do. And I think he just is very sensitive and gets frustrated.
I’m not a very great rider. But I am a great listener and I think that’s what’s making a difference for my guy. Not to get too woowoo ha ha. But I just had to think of my horse a little bit differently to make it work. Instead of seeing him as lazy, I see a very sensitive horse.
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This is a great point. I’m a fairly quiet person and tend towards making horses calmer an quieter, so I need to get my energy up a bit. Several years ago I started and sold a little appy mare that was the quietest little horse. All my focus with her was getting her forward - like we would go out on the trails weekly and long trot and gallop, and I’d jump her just to get her moving. Sold her to an experienced rider, who sent her to a trainer. A few months later she said they could not get the horse to do a flat-footed walk, she was rather hyper and reactive. I have no idea what went on, but I had to wonder if we were even talking about the same horse.
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I totally believe it. And I find I’m very much the same way. I’m great at getting a horse to be quieter and more supple not creating energy as much.
I do think with my horse comfort was the number one thing to be addressed but I think he is more attuned to my quieter style now that the former trainer isn’t riding him. I think I would get on and he just had a harder time adjusting between us. Like he couldn’t “hear me.” And if I tried to get “louder” I think I would probably block him on accident too.
Now I brush him with my calf and he will trot off. It’s still a work in progress and he still gets sticky sometimes but it’s so much better. When he was in training there was one point where I would have to have a whip. We even tried spurs (which fundamentally I’m against for forward.) Now I usually carry a whip but hardly ever use it and if I do it’s usually like one light tap to get a little more out of the lateral work. And there are days I’ve forgotten the whip and it was no issue. I definitely have to make sure that I’m on top of my position and not blocking too.
He’s the hardest horse I’ve owned and my trainer laughs that I thought my OTTBs were easy but this QH is pushing me more as a rider lol.
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You are definitely right, adjustability could be considered a transition. However, you can still have adjustability within the collected canter, for example, with varying degrees of collection. That was more so what I was speaking to. To have to horse fine tuned and responsive enough to have that adaptability.
ETA: and thinking along these lines with the OP, a good exercise for this rider might be putting down ground poles and having the rider change the number of strides between poles. Increasing collection to increase number of strides, extension to decrease the number of strides. I would still address the fear aspect and how the rider is reinforcing aids first, however.
I wanted to thank you all for your ideas. The last three lessons have been great with some of these ideas! Thank you!
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