Feeding plan - need help!

[fivestrideline]

Alright y’all, I feel silly posting this as I’m usually pretty on top of things but leave it to the “new” horse to throw me for a loop.

Current feed per day (over 2 meals):

• 6lb TC Senior Gold (it’s likely that barn staff scoops to 5-5.5. No I can’t ask them to weigh it). I provide this.
• 5-6lb Purina Healthy Edge (again with the scoop variation). This is the barn provided feed.
• 3000IU natural E (Ultra Cruz), salt, GUT supplement, biotin, Cu/Zn
• “unlimited” local grass hay, various sources, untested. It’s good quality, and usually orchard or fescue or a mix. Again this varies since we can’t store a year’s worth of hay. He probably eats 20lb/day, has access in his stall + 1-2x/day feeder refills outside.
• 24/7 nibbles on “pasture”

Anyway. I calculated his intake to about 30k calories a day, and 8 months since arriving off the track he’s still a bit ribby. I don’t want him FAT, and know that part of this is lack of topline, but we are headed into winter. I also don’t love feeding THIS much grain but he’s eating as much hay as he wants (for the most part).

Here is the list of options I’ve come up with:

• switch him to 100% TCS Gold, $$$$ out of pocket
• supplement with fat. I am a bit concerned about NSC with him, so I’m not sure what to provide.
• switch his stall hay to alfalfa (provided by me). $$$$ and a pain to store
• supplement with alfalfa cubes or pellets. We don’t have hot water or an insulated tack room at the barn and I can’t ask the staff to heat water in the kettle. The horses are rarely in long enough for them to eat a ton of soaked hay - especially when he’s already eating 6lb a meal.
• scope for ulcers. Or treat. This would be a budget stretch at this time but not out of the question.

Any ideas would be welcome - especially options that can be ordered from Chewy (I do not shop at Tractor Supply anymore). Or even just reminders to be patient. I just feel as if he’s eating a LOT vs the condition he’s in (underweight but shiny, good coat, could be better hooves). He’s 5 and somewhat growthy still.

[Simkie]

Five and growthy and a boy is what’s making it hard. I’d add oil. But very good chance he won’t really fill in until he’s done growing.

[Lusoluv]

I was going to suggest Cool Calories or a similar fat supplement.

[fivestrideline]

@Simkie

Five and growthy and a boy is what’s making it hard.

I’m glad I’m not alone in thinking this

[luvmyhackney]

Mine was ribby until mid 6 y/o no matter what I fed him. He was scoped, wormed, and fed straight alfalfa and Ultium gastric care.His coat was gleaming and he looked fantastic except for seeing ribs after a growth spurt. He also went from 16 hands to 16.3 and a 42” girth to a 48” girth in 12 months from 5-6.

Growing teenagers are hard to keep weight on. At 7, he turned into an easy keeper on grass hay and ration balancer, plus the occasional flake of alfalfa, being ridden 6 days a week in moderate work.

[JB]

@fivestrideline

supplement with fat. I am a bit concerned about NSC with him, so I’m not sure what to provide.

Oil is 100% fat (so no sugar/starch) and the least bulky, but not always the most convenient, and is a bit messy. There are a few 100% fat prilled products like Cool Calories and Ultimate Finish 100 (ok, they’re probably 99% fat 1% moisture ) It adds a LITTLE more bulk but not a ton, and is more $$ per calorie than oil. 2oz is around 540 calories

And then, yeah, a still-growing TB is sometimes simply not able to put on enough fat coverage to be a solid BCS 5

I’d say as long as he’s eating his food, his coat looks good, energy’s good, all the things of a healthy horse, I’d just keep him blanketed more/heavier and see what you have next year

Is the HE the ONLY feed the barn provides? Since you’re already providing 5-6lb of the TCSG, it wouldn’t be a huge increase in $ to have him eating only that, and you could give it a month on straight TCSG to see if it makes any difference. If not, then go back to the 50/50 mix.

[Scaramouch]

Since you provide the Senior Gold could you premeasure it and create serving baggies to ensure he’s getting 3 pounds per feeding? Depending on how much they’re shorting him currently that may not make much of a difference though.

Of the options you suggested, switching him to alfalfa in his stall would be the most effective IMO. If you have a trailer could you stash a bale or two on it and stuff hay bags for him?

[fivestrideline]

@Scaramouch

Of the options you suggested, switching him to alfalfa in his stall would be the most effective IMO. If you have a trailer could you stash a bale or two on it and stuff hay bags for him?

I could certainly store some hay in my trailer. It’s the sourcing of the hay that’s the hardest part! If I can only store a couple bales, it gets hard to find anything good as winter goes by. I fed chopped hay at one point, expensive but doable, I just couldn’t nail down an easy dispensing method since this horse likes to play with anything not nailed down

[SusanO]

The Grab and Go bales from Standlee are easy to transport and store but you just about have to sell a kidney to afford a bunch of them. I am not a huge fan of the double compressed bales like the Hall’s brand sold around here because there is so much shatter and dust but they are not awful. You can always fit a contractor cleanup bag around a bale and it will help contain the loose hay. If he is getting sufficient long stem fiber with the other hay you can add alfalfa pellets or cubes which are more cost effective if the regular bales don’t work.

[Bonnie2]

Agree with JB, try 100% TCSG and keep him blanketed so he doesn’t spend calories keeping warm. I would worry if you add anything to his menu you may hit the limit of what he’s willing to eat in a day. Subbing alfalfa in his stall would be the next thing I’d try. But sometimes when they get “good stuff” they loose interest in the plain hay. I have a 16yo ottb who I’ve been feeding for 12 years and never gotten him round. He’s just not that kind of guy! He eats TCSG, alfalfa and free choice TC Safe Starch. He costs more to feed than the other three combined!

[suzyq]

Can you just supplement alfalfa hay not switch completely? My tb, although retired early, really does well with about 5 lbs/day of alfalfa hay. That’s on top of all you can eat grass hay and pasture and 6 lbs per day of tc complete.

[Amberley]

Alfalfa is the answer. I’d replace a lot of that senior feed with pellets. I just feed the pellets unsoaked, you absolutely do not need to soak them for a regular horse with all it’s teeth and no tendency to choke.

If you don’t go with the alfalfa pellets then remember that some horses don’t do well on beet pulp, he may be one of them. Consider removing it from his diet as a trial, you may be surprised how much weight he gains when he’s off it.

He’s getting enough calories, he’s getting a fair bit of fat from the Purina. He’s not utilizing the calories he is getting so imho it is time to switch to another kind of feed. I see this A LOT with people who feed every horse Senior-type feeds by default. They don’t all do well on it. It also does not typically have enough supplantation at the dates it is being fed so a min/vit or balancer + alfalfa pellets + fat would be my go to for this kind of horses. They almost always gain a lot of weight on that regimen.

[Simkie]

One other thing I’ve noticed in my horses like this is that they do better with a little more NSC. I know that’s counter intuitive, and might not be possible if he’s sensitive. But mine have looked better on less feed in the high teens NSC vs low teens.

It took me a long time to figure this out, lol.

[fivestrideline]

@Amberley

Alfalfa is the answer. I’d replace a lot of that senior feed with pellets. I just feed the pellets unsoaked, you absolutely do not need to soak them for a regular horse with all it’s teeth and no tendency to choke.

Oof yeah I would never personally do this. I’ve seen too many chokes! It only takes one time, and then they’re a “choker” and you have to feed slop. YMMV.

@Amberley

If you don’t go with the alfalfa pellets then remember that some horses don’t do well on beet pulp, he may be one of them.

This is an interesting thought, however. The Gold is beet pulp based, even though I don’t feed beet pulp on its own. That said, I had him on Ultium + Kalm N EZ and we had similar results - I switched to TCSG to get the same calories on lower NSC. The barn then dropped the KEZ for the Purina.

We have another on ProElite senior (he is a senior), and have recently had to bump him up. The others are on a balancer + 3-6lb of the Purina (including my fatty) and they look great. They’re older and retired though, which may be part of it.

I have hesitated to switch skinny minnie to that program just due to the significantly lower calories. He’s not inside long enough to eat much additional feed in the form of pellets, but he will eat a flake or two of hay per meal inside.

@Simkie

One other thing I’ve noticed in my horses like this is that they do better with a little more NSC. I know that’s counter intuitive, and might not be possible if he’s sensitive. But mine have looked better on less feed in the high teens NSC vs low teens.

I’ve experienced this as well, though the horse was older and may have just hit the “now I grow OUT instead of UP” stage. As I said above, I had this horse on 6lb Ultium + 6lb Kalm N EZ a day and saw no difference. The barn switched to Purina about the time I switched to TCSG so… not scientific I’m afraid.

[Amberley]

@fivestrideline

That said, I had him on Ultium + Kalm N EZ and we had similar results

That is also largely beet pulp.

[fivestrideline]

you may be on to something!!