Could those bites be mosquito bites? We have had to go twice a year vaccinations for West Nile after having one contract West Nile even though he had been vaccinated annually since the early 2000s
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Based on the link, PyGanic is a mix of pyrethrins. And thereby extracted from plants, as opposed to synthesized in a lab. At least that’s how I read it.
Pyrethrins are a group of compounds that can be extracted from chrysanthemums. I imagine that you get a mixture of them when you do the extraction from plants. Their chemical structures are similar with an ester, a cyclopentenone ring, and a cyclopropyl group. Wikipedia has a nice table that shows several of them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrethrin
Permethrin is a synthetic compound that shares some of the chemical structure of the pyrethrins. Again, Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permethrin
The thing that apparently makes pyrethrins relatively safe is that they degrade fairly rapidly in the environment. But that also shortens their useful life. I assume that the “perm” in permethrin says something about the fact that they are more permanent. In any event, that’s how I remember the difference between permethrin and pyrethrins.
Finally, not all substances isolated from natural sources are safe or non-toxic. And not all substances synthesized in the lab are necessarily hazardous or toxic. The two most toxic substances for humans are the neurotoxins botulinum and tetanospasmin (source - https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/natural-vs-synthetic-chemicals-is-a-gray-matter/). In some cases the choice between isolating a chemical for a commercial product from natural sources versus preparing it in the lab is an economic one. A pure compound derived from natural sources is identical to a pure compound prepared in the lab. Notice that I said pure. There may be an advantage to having a mixture as opposed to a pure compound (maybe the case with the pyrethrins?). Or, impurities present in an isolated or synthesized compounds could present problems.
And chemicals are everywhere. Water is a chemical. Pyrethrins are chemicals. Permethrin is a chemical. Acetylsalicylic acid is a chemical. Cocaine is a chemical.
This completes my Ted talk.
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Equisect MSDS; https://chemmanagement.ehs.com/9/D207B511-5BAE-4037-9F37-723B4D71C364/pdf/VGS335
Kills fish.
It certainly could be. It did not occur I needed to vaccinate against West Nile. I need to check to see what vaccinations he got.
We actually don’t spray much for mosquitos and flies, but I can tell you that the Black Ultrashield is very effective with ticks. We have A LOT of ticks where we ride. I spray a small soft brush and then brush it on my horse’s legs from the knees and hocks down. It really cuts down on the ticks I find post ride, on the order of 15-20 to 1 compared with my barn mates who don’t use any repellent at all.
I really like Farrier’s Wife Stop the Stomp for full strength use. For daily turn out I still use the yellow Pyranna diluted 2/3 pyrannha and 1/3 apple cider vinegar. I have found diluted works just as well as straight…
I also like the green bottle Farnham natural spray for trail rides bc it seems to help keep the damn gnats away from my horse and I.
Equisect is somewhat effective and not as awful as Pyrhana or as reactive as some other natural ones despite having some of the same ingredients, so I use that on my red horse. The one with hives above doesn’t react to it wiped on, but he acts like the spray is going to kill him, whereas he is not so dramatic about things like spray coat conditioner, so he just gets all the fly apparel. EcoVet is as bad as pepper spray to me. I’m bothered by sharing an outdoor arena with a horse coated in it.
I’ve found the same! When I stopped using it the first fall when the flys settled down, I immediately started finding ticks and continued to reapply until it snowed.
Probably a lot of sprays would do that in that kind of concentration 
I tried OutSmart either last Summer or the one before, and it did very little, for not very long. But I tried it on the recommendation of a friend on the coast who said it was great there. It just proves that it’s all about finding what works in your location, that year
I’ve had luck with that in years past, but last year it seemed to have lost its effectiveness 
I think I’ve found a system that is working somewhat…
For daytime turnout, I spray them outside, wearing a mask with Pyrhana and put them out in their fly boots and masks. It seems to keep them happy until 3 or 4 and then they come in and rest under their fans.
For overnight it’s cool enough that they can go out in their fly sheets with neck covers, and fly boots.
They also get bi-monthly applications of ultra boss topical which doesn’t seem to do much for the flies, but is super effective for ticks!
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I really like Equiderma’s fly spray too. I’m curious- do you use it in the bottle/sprayer it comes in? I usually transfer mine to an empty bottle of another brand bc I don’t love the way the sprayer it comes with sprays. Lately though, the Equiderma has been clogging all the sprayers because it separates as it sits, and though I ask the staff to shake the bottle before spraying, I usually end up with several half-full bottles because the sprayers have stopped working. Just curious what method works for you!
I bought a bottle of the Equisect to tide us over til I can solve the sprayer issue. I just brought it to the barn this morning, so we’ll see how it does.
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Really @Grey_Dove032016? I haven’t had any issues with their bottle/sprayer. I actually save them and reuse them because they usually hold up a lot better than others. Just curious - what don’t you like about the spray? I haven’t noticed anything odd or different, that’s why I ask!
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In my experience, the spray is either too wide or too narrow for my liking. I know the nozzle is adjustable, but I haven’t been able to find the right diameter- maybe I’m just too impatient! I like the spray to be narrow enough to feel like more than a light misting and wide enough that it covers well. I feel like I’m either spitting on a bonfire, so to speak, or soaking small areas all over him and leaving the rest unprotected.
Sounds like I may have to give the original bottle another go!
I think that sometimes what works one year does not work the next but will two years later. It seems like it goes in cycles. Location seems to have a lot to do with it too.
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For sure! Right now I have 4 different sprays I’m rotating around, and yesterday got a bottle of Repel-X to start mixing up as the others start winding down. That is an $$$ bottle, but as a concentrate it’s WAY cheaper than the other stuff, and I haven’t used it here in a really long time.
I am finding that the (new to me) Absorbine in the purple bottle works pretty well, and isn’t terribly expensive
That is one of the reasons I spray onto a mitt, and use that to spread it on the horse.
Another is that there is less waste.
A third is that I can get the fly spray where I need it (on the face without getting it in the eye, backs/insides of legs, etc.).
Something else that can change things up and make “meh” spray more effective is to up the level of pyrethrin/permethrin (or add it to a non pyerthrin/permethrin spray.)
Just a couple ccs of this in a quart, for example, bumps up the effectiveness nicely. I usually start doing this when the flies start getting worse in late summer.
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I saw this chart and went with Smartpak’s OutSmart fly spray. I can’t do Ecovet. It’s borderline painful for my lungs and eyes and I didn’t find it to work very well. However, the natural ingredients in Outsmart work so well! It’s safe for me and my horse, and it is not painful to apply.
Chart rankings:https://eco-vet.com/blogs/ecovet/study-ecovet-outperforms-other-repellents-in-both-efficacy-and-duration
