Is this pending legislation one of 1,000 cuts to get rid of hunting with hounds?
That’s one way to look at it.
I certainly hope not. In my mind there are NO similarties between mounted fox hunting and “fox penning” which is in no way a sport.
Using the numbers in the posted article, these "penners’ have gone through 3969 foxes, spread over apprx. 38 pens in three years. That’s just under 3 foxes each month, each pen. How many hunts out there account for three foxes each month? How many hunts have been lacking in foxes because they’re trapped and moved to these “pens”
There is never any sport when the quarry is confined.
Wanted to add this link too…when you put out dog food for your prey, it’s not “hunting”
http://www.colvinkennels.blogspot.com/
And even the largest of these “pens” certainly doesn’t provide enough land to be a true territory for that many foxes
Territory size, page 2-3
http://www.epa.gov/region1/ge/thesite/restofriver/reports/final_era/B%20-%20Focus%20Species%20Profiles/EcoRiskProfile_red_fox.pdf
The above stat sheet is for red fox only, but is sufficient for this discussion.
My father and grandfather…
raised both hunting bred Beagles and Labs. We did not have a rabbit pen or a phesant pen, always had good sport and wonderful Sunday dinners. It probably took much longer to train a good dog that way, however, no one would have considered it cruel.
Fox penning should not be tolerated.
I read twice the “rules” for the FHTPs
My take is this. If it isn’t listed on the fixture card, and no one except staff are to know about it… well in my experience, anything kept that “secret” can’t be a terribly good thing.
It would be interesting to know how many hunts have one.
I’m with 2ndyrgal. The same thought occurred to me. Keeping it secret means they know it is wrong on several levels. I don’t think I’m going to shed any tears if they are dissallowed in VA.
[QUOTE=2ndyrgal;6097607]
raised both hunting bred Beagles and Labs. We did not have a rabbit pen or a phesant pen, always had good sport and wonderful Sunday dinners. It probably took much longer to train a good dog that way, however, no one would have considered it cruel.
Fox penning should not be tolerated.[/QUOTE]
I used to field trial my dachshunds. The dachshund field trials used beagle field trial grounds which are fenced and stocked with rabbits. The rabbits were provided with food plots, cover, watering spots, and food such as alfalfa pellets, alfalfa hay, carrots, turnips and sweet potatoes were provided. One trial grounds even provided dust bathing areas of sand mixed with Sevin dust to kill external parasites on the rabbits. It was a rabbit heaven. Occasionally, a rabbit would be killed by a dog during the dachshund trials, but I doubt seriously if any rabbits were ever killed during the beagle trials. Some of the beagle grounds did have smaller rabbit pens to train pups. I also know that many retreiver and pointer trainers do use pen raised pheasant and quail to train their dogs.
As the Covert article states, fox pens are mostly used by the night hunters. I think there are a few pens around locally that use coyotes rather than foxes. My neighbor used to live trap coyotes and sell them to the fox pens for, iirc, $100/ coyote. Coyotes are considered a nuisance predator around here so nobody really cares about fox penning.
I was under the impression that “pens” were used for training the young dogs, not as a “sport”?
I suspect if you do any kind of hunting with dogs you might want to fight this bill even if you don’t think much of penning.
Well- in reading the article, I’m very concerned since it quotes the usual HSUS spokesperson and talks about ‘poor foxes being torn apart.’ One of those perpetual myths about the cruelty of a fox being accounted for by a pack of hounds.
With respect to mounted foxhunting- I am NOT a fan of using fox pens to introduce young hounds to the sport for a number of reasons. I’m aware that hunts do it, but to me it is absolutely not the right way to do it, does way more harm than good. I guess I’ve just seen too many good huntsmen do it right, the traditional way. Using fox pens to ‘train’ hounds to be entered in a pack is the Cliff’s notes version and I don’t have a lot of respect for the huntsman that would do that.
HOWEVER- I will defend a properly managed fox pen. They do have the right rules in place to protect the quarry and are not inhumane. Sure, a badly managed fox pen should be put out of business. But to say all fox pens are cruel and should be banned is just like saying pet ownership is cruel and should be banned because there are cruel dog and cat owners out there. Bogus.
