Friesians in Yorkshire in the 1930s?

[Scribbler]

North America has more pinto variation than Britain, at least historically.

A piebald is black Tobiano and a skewbald is other color Tobiano. There are no traditional terms in British horsemanship for Frame Overo (mutation evolved in USA) or sabino. There is an old word for the splash pattern common to Clydesdales I think it’s blagdon?

North America has a higher population of pinto patterns in mustangs, stock horses, and even saddlebreds that get sabino. Genetic testing to distinguish pinto genes and their expression is recent, developing, and not fully understood.

Distinguishing between Frame Overo and other pinto genes is crucial because Lethal White Syndrome.

Pinto is the Spanish word for Paint, and the two were used interchangeably until the 1960s when the Paint registry was set up to capture quarter horses refused registration because they had too much white.

I don’t see why any of this would be obvious or even of interest to a non horse person, indeed many good riders I know who came up via h/j or pony club are clueless, and not even interested in understanding pinto genetics.

We nevet talk about “a knight on a grey horse,” after all.

[MsM]

I dont know why Americans use the term pinto instead of coloured but it has been consistent in my lifetime, back to the 1950s. Given the time frame, I highly doubt it was for racial sensitivity. But since pinto (or sometimes paint which makes aficionados of the breed upset when applied to a random pinto) has been the prevailing term, it would be odd for a US born and raised person to use the term “coloured”.

[RHdobes563]

@Kimstar

Ladyhawke was the movie that started the whole Friesian “thing” in 1985. No one had seen much of them outside of Europe prior to that.

And if they seem to pop up in many. many modern productions, it’s because the same company supplies many of the horses used in them: https://thedevilshorsemen.com/about-us/
They supplied the horses for Downton Abby, Game of Thrones, etc., etc. If there’s a Friesian in it, it’s probably one of their horses.

I agree.

I really liked the two teams, 4-horse and 2-horse, in Sense and Sensibility (1995), when the Dashwood women moved to Barton Park. The four-horse team was, I think, chestnuts with white socks (PERFECTLY matched), and the two-horse team was red roans, I think. I have always thought that the movie people must have rented them from the local (competitive) driving community.

[Larksmom]

S&S is about my fa/orite mo/ie and I well remember those steppers.

[Rackonteur]

I cringe at the word “woke” in this usage. I’m not sure, but I think it is used by some who arent familiar with the word “awakened”?
I won’t label them “imbecile,” but …
I do know that “woke” is the past tense of “wake.”

[FitzE]

I heard mostly Paint and Pinto in the US. I thought they were very charming terms and I like that they are called different things in different places. Local variety makes travel enjoyable. No need for everyone to use coloured or whatever term. Vive la difference!

@Larksmom

S&S is about my fa/orite mo/ie and I well remember those steppers.

Agreed. It is one of the few movies I’ve purchased. I’m an Emma Thompson and Alan Rickman fan for life. I remember Col. Brandon had a very cute, black mount when he came to issue his invitation to the picnic.

[Rackonteur]

Remember the Gardiners’ lovely greys of “Pride and Prejudice” in the same era? Four for the long road trip and two for short drives around Lambton?

[Rackonteur]

[FitzE]

Oh, Alan Rickman! He was perfection in that movie. I heard a trivia bit that that horse was difficult to work with b/c he was rather flatulent during the filming of that scene.

[Angela_Freda]

The Friesian I worked with was a gassy, loose stool mess, in part due to his breed according to his owner.

[RaeHughes]

Just googled it - apparently there were Friesans in Yorkshire in the 1930s. With sketches and B&W photos from the time.

Amazing what you learn from Chronicle Forums …

[MsM]

The half-Friesian that boarded at my barn also had chronic loose watery stool!

[RHdobes563]

@Rackonteur

Remember the Gardiners’ lovely greys of “Pride and Prejudice” in the same era? Four for the long road trip and two for short drives around Lambton?

Will have to pull our P&P to take a look at them. LOVE my Austen movies…

[Willesdon]

@RaeHughes

Just googled it - apparently there were Friesans in Yorkshire in the 1930s. With sketches and B&W photos from the time.

Amazing what you learn from Chronicle Forums …

I’m interested. How, where what for and what search term did you use?

[Rackonteur]

Friesian horses? Or Friesian cattle? (Called Holsteins in the US; breed is Holstein-Friesian.)

[RaeHughes]

I wrote the title of the thread

[RaeHughes]

Yes - I do know the difference between a Friesian HORSE and a COW.
I can tell them apart in pictures - they do look quite different.
(This is sarcasm if you cannot guess.)

I am also aware that the Friesian cow is more correctly known as the Holstein-Friesian. Considering that I live in a rural area of New Zealand - the dairy capital of the world - where Friesian cattle were used in the creation of the New Zealand Dairy Cow (now an established breed), I see quite a number on my morning walks

[Willesdon]

I’ve looked but I can’t find references to them in Yorkshire in the 1930s. 1913 there were only three studbook stallions in Friesland so I’m inclined to think “Belgium Blacks” were not to be found in the rural counties of Britain. So I’m happy to go back to my original theory that local farmers would have used local horses - the Dales pony.

I’m willing to accept that there was common ancestry somewhere way back. Most of the heavy breeds are found in an arc across northern Europe: France, Britain, Low Countries, Germany. There has been a bit of a stir in the UK media as an academic paper recently published has identified medieval warhorses as being pony sized, not the massive beasts of myth and Hollywood. Such an interesting thing, the history of horses, as they are so intertwined with human history whilst also being largely invisible to modern historians.

[Rackonteur]

In one way this goes along with the realization that some people we think were large men actually were fairly slight in build (e.g., Henry VIII when you see his armour); so perhaps a large pony could have charged with a rider wearing armour and armed with a lance, shield, etc.

I’ve been reading an interesting history of the Friesian breed just this morning. Unfortunately it doesn’t mention Yorkshire.

[RaeHughes]

Feel free to think that, it doesnt impact on me at all.
I found some photo evidence that Friesien HORSES were in Yorkshire then. Definitely not Dales Ponies as these were larger. I’m not saying that they were common - after all, with the Cleveland Bay, Clydesdales, Shires, cobs etc, why would they be … except as status symbols I guess.