funny (sort of) issue with new (used) Wintec ap

[beaujolais]

I just bought a Wintec 2000 ap, 307299. I had asked here awhile ago and you all said you liked them for hunting. Seems it would be a good thing for the bad weather days, also.

(Used to have a Wintec dressage - loved it.) I also have a bad shoulder and it’s great to have a lightweight saddle for the times when you are carrying it).

I got it on e-bay. It’s brown, barely used, pretty, very good price, so all good there. Was listed on e-bay as a 17.5 but still has an 18" manufacturers sticker on the stirrup bar.

So, I called up the seller (who is a tack dealer in Florida). They said, “hang on, don’t get mad, go measure it.” Sure enough, middle of pommel button to middle of cantle is 17.5. Seller also says that people came in their shop looking for an 18" saddle and it certainly did not fit them like one. They believe it is a 17.5.

Now, it fits me “OK”. Maybe a smidge big. Maybe. It “looks” big but is that because I’m used to close contact saddles that don’t have the high round cantle this one does?

Input?

I’m thinking I’ll keep it but not totally convinced.

I guess I’ll try to e-mail Wintec on it & see what they have to say, even though I’ve heard they are not that good with helping out sometimes.

Thanks all.

[mildot]

Have you ridden in it yet?

If not, I would ask the seller if a trial period of a reasonable number of days would be OK then ride it hard and see if it suits you.

[beaujolais]

Thanks, Mildot.

Yes- I did. It fits me “OK”. Maybe a smidge big. Maybe.

Great idea on asking for the trial period - will do.

Now, is Mildot French or that green fuzzy stuff that you don’t want to find on your tack?

[wsmoak]

[QUOTE=sonomacounty;5923519]

I got it on e-bay. It’s brown, barely used, pretty, very good price, so all good there. Was listed on e-bay as a 17.5 but still has an 18" manufacturers sticker on the stirrup bar.[/QUOTE]

It’s probably a 45 cm seat, which converts to 17.7 inches, which could go either way for advertising in inches.

Depending on how you measure you can usually get a half inch difference just by placing the tape in a slightly differently, or reading it at the outside edge of the button vs, the middle, etc.

[beaujolais]

Says 46 cm, right below the 18"

Thanks Wendy/Patrick.

Oh, shipping saddles back is such a pain. Darn.

[mildot]

[QUOTE=sonomacounty;5923535]

Yes- I did. It fits me “OK”. Maybe a smidge big. Maybe.[/QUOTE]
I would think that if you balance well on it, a smidge on the big side for the seat would be OK.

[QUOTE=sonomacounty;5923535]
Now, is Mildot French or that green fuzzy stuff that you don’t want to find on your tack? [/QUOTE]
No, not really…

[beaujolais]

Thanks Mildot.

You know, I’m so annoyed at this seller. In Business Law, we learned that that is called misrepresentation and you just can’t do that.

An 18" has less resale marketability than a 17.5" (around here, at least), another reason they just cannot give their view of the size and not also say what it is marked.

[Flagstaff_Foxhunter]

Asked for a 17.5, got a 17.5

Let me get this correctly–it was advertised as a 17.5", which is what you wanted. You got it, good shape, good price, and it says 18" on the stirrup bar. You measured it as a 17.5. The seller stated that was how they measured it as well.

Now you are getting upset with the seller? Sounds like you may have needed a smaller size. But I looked up the closed auctions and I think I found the saddle you bought. Was it $350 from Sensible Saddles? If so, they did a spot on job of describing (and picturing) the saddle and you got a lovely saddle at a great price. They specified no returns quite clearly. It’s a small risk you assume and one you were aware of before you bid.

Certainly, a little bit big is far better than a little bit small. You should be able to resell this very nice saddle for at least close to what you paid. I’m guessing you are fairly new to buying on eBay. Sellers are terrified of you! It’s an auction, and getting a deal entails a little risk. If you were given bad information, you would be covered under eBay’s policies–the site is very good about buyer protection. But this seller did nothing wrong, they have a lot of very good feedback on selling saddles. I looked up the two bad feedbacks they have gotten in the last year, and I feel they were undeserved.

It would be mean spirited of you to force the seller to take it back by threatening bad feedback. If you don’t want to assume any risk at all, buy local and at retail. If I found the incorrect saddle transaction on eBay, please forgive my assumptions. I have bought and sold many saddles on eBay for 11 years, it’s a bit scary but usually rewarding. I truly believe the buyer needs to have different expectations when shopping online auctions. I hope you can work this out to your satisfaction, but please be fair about it!

[mildot]

[QUOTE=sonomacounty;5923535]
It fits me “OK”. Maybe a smidge big. Maybe.[/QUOTE]
I’ll be brutally honest. I find 1/2" of seat size difference, particularly when some subjectivity comes into play when deciding exactly where to measure, to not be misrepresentation.

I’d be a lot more concerned with how it fits the horse and whether it places me in a balanced seat.

[beaujolais]

Hmmm . . .

OK, well, a little different way to look at it. Thanks guys. That’s why I asked for opinions.

I do think there was misrepresentation as they should have said it was stamped “18” both on a sewn in tag and a tag on the stirrup bar, even though it measures 17.5. I think both sets of info should have been there.

But, it basically works so I guess that is what matters.

Appreciated !

[beaujolais]

Oh, new thought.

If anyone has a Wintec ap, would you want to measure it (middle of pommel button to middle of cantle) and see if that matches the size it was sold it?

I’m wondering if they all measure like this or not.

Thanks.

[Hounds]

Well, now, that’s interesting. Because over the summer we bought a new one that was supposed to be 17.5", had an 18" sticker on it (if I remember correctly), and turned out to be 17" when we measured it.

[beaujolais]

Wow, that is crazy, Hounds.

Wonder what is going on with the sizing and the labeling.

[Hinderella]

Generally speaking, a deep seated “all purpose” type saddle fits differently than the close contact you may be accustomed to. I generally ride in a larger size in an AP saddle than I do in a flatter seat.

Are you feeling as if you’re floating around in the saddle, or are you just doing the old hand behind your seat test? i would say if you ride well in it, don’t worry about the number of the seat size.

if it’s truly too big, and you can return it in exactly the same condition as you got it, you could ask the seller if they’ll take it back.

Saddles are a bit like jeans…if they fit you well, it doesn’t really matter what size is on tthe tag

[beaujolais]

Actually, just a touch floating & like my seat wants to migrate a bit more back then it should to find the bottom part of the saddle seat. Not huge, but it’s there.

I didn’t judge by the hand behind the seat rule, as I figured with a cantle this high it wouldn’t apply. (Do I have that right? Does the hand behind the seat apply to APs, too?)

My close contact saddle is a 17" but I hear you go up a bit for an AP, so I did.

Thanks, Hind.

[Hinderella]

It is frustrating to have that floating feeling. I bought a Stubben Siegfried CS in a 17, which I was sure would fit me. And by all the usual measurements and appearances, it did. But somehow, it just never FELT right. Just the opposite of what you’re feeling, I kept feeling as though I’d slid too far back. I ended up with a different saddle , same size, and a totally different feel.

I would say it’s always worth contacting the seller if the saddle’s just wrong. There are ususally no returns on eBay, but it doesn’t hurt to ask.

Good luck, whether you keep or sell it.

[beaujolais]

Thanks again, Hind. You’re a doll. It helped to talk it out with you all, process the thoughts.

Thanks guys.

[Hinderella]

Happy to help. And besides, I’m in CT, where 80% of the state is without power after a heavy wet snow, so just looking at the words “sonoma county” takes me to a nicer place

[foxhuntingkiddo]

Most people when shopping for saddles look for the seat size that it is marketed as ie the marking on the serial number or flap, not the actual measurement. If I rode in an 17.5in Wintec a friend had and knew that I wanted the 17.5in Wintec and bought it only to find out that it is an 18 by Wintec standards, I would be frustrate. Does this make sense? Ultimately in the grand scheme, its not the end of the world, just frustrating.