George Morris on the SS list

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

@Robbie

Without reading subsequent posts to determine the general consensus about the athlete’s for equity proposal, I’ll express my thoughts. My immediate reply is why people would advocate creating yet another level to the already bloated bureaucracy of committees. And how long would it be for this new association to make a ruling that other folks would not like and start their own alphabet soup committee.

Furthermore, this seems to be an equestrian initiative and does not involve input from other athletes in Olympic sports.

In general, when folks agree to go to binding arbitration, they are agreeing to abide by the findings of the “judge,” whether the issue I involves a divorce, a labor contract or anything else. I can only conclude that Mr. Morris was pretty confident of the outcome, which pretty much coincides with what appears to be his personality.
If we have concerns about the current situation, which I do not because the only showing I do is limited to schooling shows, we need to work within the framework to improve the situation.

The Athletes For Equity group is applying for 501 c 6 not for profit status. It’s not going to become another layer of bureaucracy or a committee or part of Safe Sport itself.

Its apparently focused on lobbying efforts and raising money for legal expenses… and pr… and “education”

Here is a basic definition of what a 501 c 6 org is…

“A 501 C (6) organization is tax speak for a business association such as a chamber of commerce. Although they’re organized to promote business, they don’t generate a profit and don’t pay shares or dividends. That qualifies them as non-profit organizations, exempt from paying income tax.”

[FlaxenChestnut]

@oneequestrienne

This just showed up in my Facebook feed:
https://athletesforequity.org/
FAQs.are very interesting includes names, goals and financial disclaimer.
https://athletesforequity.org/faq/

Oh boy. They have a lot of nerve calling themselves “Athletes for Equity”. The people jumping on this bandwagon should really take a hard look at the image they are portraying all over social media. From an outsider looking in, they appear very ignorant, and quite frankly, pretty awful.

[Sswor]

@Living In The Sticks

I’m glad USHJA sent out an email. I feel like they needed to do something with how out of hand people are acting online.

Not surprised about Diane Carney being the president of the board for that nonsense. I remember when this first came out her stating that she has never seen GM act unprofessional. Because children only get molested in broad daylight with plenty of witnesses around 🤦*♀️

She has little choice. She’s hitched her wagon to GM’s star so tight and for so many years, without his clinics to host, she has little method in which to keep up her manner of living. You can only be asked to judge so many horse shows.

Ps. GM’s Thanksgiving weekend clinic, which ran for decades, is quietly NOT being held.

[poltroon]

@Virginia Horse Mom

According to their disclosure statement they are APPLYING for 501 c 6 non profit status… but haven’t gotten it yet. But they have already started collecting money via a Go Fund Me account.

This is NOT how legitimate not for profit organizations typically go about fundraising

That is how you build a nonprofit, you incorporate first and then get your nonprofit status around a year later plus or minus some months.

In case anyone is confused, donations to a 501©(6) are not tax deductible. FWIW these organizations can be a little tricky to run because you don’t get to fundraise any way you like and then take all income as tax free. “Unrelated Business Income” is a surprisingly tricky bit of tax law.

That said, the separate entity does allow them to take money without any individual having to be liable for it or the taxes on it, and that’s important.

Note most of the budget is going for lawyers.

[Belowthesalt]

@mvp

The crest release was disseminated by George. I believe he has written about that and a horse-saving measure for beginning riders that got taken up too-widely by riders and/or instructors who never got the fitness and finesse to learn that lovely following hand over a fence. IIRC, he lamented it all, including his part in popularizing it such that the automatic release faded. The Georgeness of it (and the really exaggerated form that the crest release has taken) is the connection to this thread.

That said, (and I think he would agree), y’all need to not lose your minds over riders using the crest release. I’ll be that most riders today can’t reliably execute an automatic release. I was only taught the automatic release as an older junior “for a minute,” as in “this is sophisticate and extra; cool if you can do it, but not what you will do as a matter of course when you are jumping.” Rather, a balanced, non-extreme position and crest release was what I was taught as all I’d need to get the job done in the ring or outside.

I’ll bet that the majority of riders today have not been sent reinless or eyes closed through a gymnastic. And everyone would agree that the modern, busy, unfit rider who learns on school horses jumping just 2’6" in a ring at a lesson barn, or who can go to a multi-day horse show jumping just 2’ or so probably needs the crest release. Or rather, today’s horses need to have this generation of low-level riders do that. Again, I can imagine his lament.

I rode at two places that had a Hitchcock pen, and you’d better believe we had to do the reinless exercise; also, stirrupless and taking off a jacket while going down the pen. Nothing wrong with crest release per se, and yes, GM did lament that people weren’t moving on from it. BUT. Why is/are the winner(s) of the top equitation competitions WINNING with it. You see automatic releases in pictures of days past with MacClay winners, e.g. Mary Mairs (Chapot). And if the response is that the judge(s) can only judge what is presented, I am sure that if they insisted that the big winner needed to be able to ride with an automatic release, these kids would do it. I don’t thin there’s any lack of talent there, just a lack of will on the part of judges and trainers to enforce the standard when someone is supposed to be “the best.”

[ynl063w]

@Belowthesalt

BUT. Why is/are the winner(s) of the top equitation competitions WINNING with it. You see automatic releases in pictures of days past with MacClay winners, e.g. Mary Mairs (Chapot). And if the response is that the judge(s) can only judge what is presented, I am sure that if they insisted that the big winner needed to be able to ride with an automatic release, these kids would do it. I don’t thin there’s any lack of talent there, just a lack of will on the part of judges and trainers to enforce the standard when someone is supposed to be “the best.”

If you Google image the top Grand Prix riders of today, greater than 90% of the jumping photos show them using the crest release. Maybe the automatic release isn’t the “all that” that some here on this forum think it is.

Additionally, what some people here think is an automatic release is really no such thing. It’s not just a straight line from bit to elbow (shown only from one side - lots of times if you look you can see the other hand right there on the crest) captured in one millisecond of time in a photo posted to the internet with a ton of comments from the masses oohing and ahhing about the wonderful days of automatic release yore.

[dannyboy]

There’s a big difference between jumping a 3’6" Eq round where you’re supposed to be demonstrating excellence in style and jumping a 1,5m round where you’re supposed to do basically anything you can to get over the jumps in the time allowed. You can see all kinds of position weirdness (not all of it helpful to the horse, either) in the GP classes. The Eq classes are supposed to be showing that you have the foundation to go on to big fences.

I can tell you that there was no opposite “hand right there on the crest” when I was taught to do an auto release. You jumped without reins until your position was strong enough that you could have both hands independent of the neck.

[TheMoo]

The crest release is a tool like anything else. Is it a stepping stone to learn the auto release? Yes. That doesn’t preclude its use depending on the circumstances.

Those who think this is remotely relevant to GHM being banned please take it to another thread. You’re missing his point as much as the people who ONLY use the crest release.

[BLBGP]

That Athletes for Equity site says they are citizens across all sports, but is anyone on their, uh, board (?) anything other than an equestrian?

[mvp]

@TheMoo

Those who think this is remotely relevant to GHM being banned please take it to another thread. You’re missing his point as much as the people who ONLY use the crest release.

Not entirely irrelevant as I think you can find Morris having written about lamenting his role in popularizing it.

[Living_In_The_Sticks]

“She has little choice. She’s hitched her wagon to GM’s star so tight and for so many years, without his clinics to host, she has little method in which to keep up her manner of living. You can only be asked to judge so many horse shows.

Ps. GM’s Thanksgiving weekend clinic, which ran for decades, is quietly NOT being held.”

I’m sure GM has made her a ton of money. I don’t remember that being a cheap clinic even to audit. I usually was working & never made it to one. That & it was probably a 2 hour drive at least.

The man is 81 & wouldn’t be teaching forever. You can’t let that be your main source of income. I really think the ISWG crowd thought he was going to win his appeal. I’m glad the clinic was canceled. I would have expected her to lose her judges card for hosting it. For as many people that say they would continue to ride with him, I think it would be a hard sell right now.

[TheMoo]

@mvp

Not entirely irrelevant as I think you can find Morris having written about lamenting his role in popularizing it.

What does a crest release on a horse have to do with sexual assault of a minor?

[mroades]

@Jealoushe

The one and only argument they keep trying to pull, that vindictive people will file false reports. Has this even happend once with USEF?

Surprised they didn’t include a disclaimer that anything that happened more than 10 years ago doesn’t count because “the times”.

Ont he FAQ page does it not say the people are brave enough to put their name with the testimonial, then on the testimonial page theres no name LOL

YES, it did happen once. And it was found out and the person was exonerated. Still worth the risk in my opinion.

[ynl063w]

@mvp

Not entirely irrelevant as I think you can find Morris having written about lamenting his role in popularizing it.

I often wonder if some of the people who frequent internet forums don’t have real life groups of friends with whom they socialize, so they don’t realize that normal conversations frequently go off on tangents with some or all members of the group, then come back to the original topic, and veer off on tangents again, and no one ever seems to get lost, confused, or annoyed. At least that’s how it has always worked in my experience, in real life AND in forum discussions.

[ladyj79]

@mroades

YES, it did happen once. And it was found out and the person was exonerated. Still worth the risk in my opinion.

I mean obvs, cause there’s that one anonymous testimonial on the new antis page.

[TheMoo]

@ladyj79

I mean obvs, cause there’s that one anonymous testimonial on the new antis page.

Honestly when I read that I thought it was an incoherent rambling of Serio’s case with changes to convince the public at large it is referring to a different case.

People suck and the complainers are screwing everyone because they are why we need these rules.

[mvp]

@TheMoo

What does a crest release on a horse have to do with sexual assault of a minor?

George Morris is the common denominator.

[mvp]

@Belowthesalt

I rode at two places that had a Hitchcock pen, and you’d better believe we had to do the reinless exercise; also, stirrupless and taking off a jacket while going down the pen. Nothing wrong with crest release per se, and yes, GM did lament that people weren’t moving on from it. BUT. Why is/are the winner(s) of the top equitation competitions WINNING with it. You see automatic releases in pictures of days past with MacClay winners, e.g. Mary Mairs (Chapot). And if the response is that the judge(s) can only judge what is presented, I am sure that if they insisted that the big winner needed to be able to ride with an automatic release, these kids would do it. I don’t thin there’s any lack of talent there, just a lack of will on the part of judges and trainers to enforce the standard when someone is supposed to be “the best.”

What’s a Hitchcock pen, please?

Sorry for the tangent, y’all.

[Ghazzu]

@mvp

What’s a Hitchcock pen, please?

Sorry for the tangent, y’all.

Damn, I feel old.
It’s a circular or oval jump chute.
Highish outside wall, loer inside, with about a 10’ track and adjustable jumps.
You can send a horse through with or without a rider.

[mvp]

@Ghazzu

Damn, I feel old.
It’s a circular or oval jump chute.
Highish outside wall, loer inside, with about a 10’ track and adjustable jumps.
You can send a horse through with or without a rider.

Nice. I think I have seen one of those, but never been on a farm that had one. That would be cool!