[QUOTE=Sonesta;3565710]
I, for one, cannot imagine just standing by and watching while something like this ocurred right in front of me! That guy in the video should be ashamed.[/QUOTE]
When the individual at my barn does such things to her horse, I don’t say anything because I fear (with good reason) that I will only make her more angry, and she’ll be even MORE abusive to the horse.
She is just the “shell” of a human being and obviously has no soul.
[quote=Equibrit;3563980
I’d love to know what is accomplished by posting this type of video.
I agree. What’s the point.[/QUOTE]
Mardi and Equibrit
Birds like you produce very big eggs.:lol:
Abuse
Equibrit - What it accomplishes is EXPOSURE for the horrific actions of a person that is calling themselves a horse trainer and FEI level rider.
If we only had more people to step forward here in this country and take footage like that. As I have said in a previous post I have witnessed major horse abuse from a “Dressage Team Rider” that liked to beat her horse with a 2 x 4 board to make him Piaffe. We need to EXPOSE this type of behavior from horrible trainers so that they loose their businesses and clients. Until people are strong enough and have a backbone to step forward in these situations we will continue to support people like this in business. I for one will NOT stand by and ever watch it from ANYONE no matter who they think they are.
AND Yes, for those of you wondering I reported this person to Animal Control and did several other things to let everyone know what was going on.
All of you out there should be ashamed of yourselves if you witness this type of “training” and do nothing about it.
slc - by that reasoning we should not have newspapers.
such unique logic.
actually, even the shittiest person is entitled under the law to a fair trial. i would rather put my energy into making sure the trial ends with a conviction. waiting til after the court case can help that.
Wow, that is so sad, that poor horse. There was a guy in the video, watching her beat the horse, why didnt he say something to her?
The guy doing nothing might have been involved in the taping. Sort of like the undercover HSUS, PETA, whatever organization people who document the abuses of various animals in various situations around the world (most recent being the downed dairy cows and pigs). I don’t know, but that’s what I’d have to assume…unless otherwise told.
That said, how is it that this woman, who obviously had a public trial and sentencing (as in it makes the newswire in the EU) was able to continue with horses?? Good grief!
It makes me quite angry, just as it does all you others. Honestly, the older I get, the less patience I have. There are moments I need to think of the safety of my child (duh), but otherwise I am known to spin off at a moment’s notice to let someone know they’re out of line. In this case, I’d have been screaming, and I would’ve attempted taking the lunge line out of her hands to at least give the horse a moment’s breath.
I hope she’s fully prosecuted this time, but, sadly, won’t be surprised to hear of her doing this again in the future. Granted, the news might be that she was killed by the horse BECAUSE of this behavior, but it still won’t surprise me.
[QUOTE=Kenike;3566926]
Honestly, the older I get, the less patience I have.
In this case, I’d have been screaming, and I would’ve attempted taking the lunge line out of her hands to at least give the horse a moment’s breath.
I hope she’s fully prosecuted this time, but, sadly, won’t be surprised to hear of her doing this again in the future. Granted, the news might be that she was killed by the horse BECAUSE of this behavior, but it still won’t surprise me.[/QUOTE]
I am with you on all accounts sista! I think I might have been tempted to be HER with the whip… I can’t believe someone would do that to a horse.
I still can’t believe the horse put up with it.
Several people have mentioned that they are afraid to report abuse due to fear of harm to their horses. Actually I can sympathize with that. Most barns don’t allow one to move immediately, many people don’t even have a trailer, or even a place to take ttheir horse to. Some can’t even afford to move. Many may realize that the abuser will easily guess who reported them, even if it is done anonymously. A person can’t conceal his or her disgust in these situations, and it’s bound to be obvious who can’t stand it.
The charge is made here very often, ‘then it’s your fault it goes on’. So one is supposed to ‘tell the authorities’.
The trouble is, especially in America, most states and counties would not prosecute a horse pwner/rider for doing what is shown on the video. Yes, even that bad.
A person can call the police for things like this and there will be absolutely no results. The barn manager and even most of the people in the barn may be against the person.
What, really, is a person supposed to do when the entire structure around him condones this? He calls the police, they won’t even come out, even if they do, the abuse is over and it’s your word against the rider’s. So…he calls the humane officer, they say they have much worse problems than that to deal with. Sorry, no budget for lesser problems, got down and dead horses down the road, we have to deal with that first. The barn manager tells him to shut up and not make trouble.
In one case, a gal told me even her OWN trainer told her to shut up about it, with the pronouncement, ‘You can’t fix the whole world, shut up and don’t make trouble’.
Are those blaming others for the abuse continuing, really aware of how impossible it is to get someone arrested in America for whipping a horse at their own stable, or convicted? America has a long, long history of ‘chattel’ laws that makes even a man’s children and wife ‘chattel’, it has only been a relatively short time since a man was entitled to beat his wife and kids and do pretty much whatever he wanted with them. It’s even worse when it comes to companion animals, but under the law a horse is not even a companion animal, he’s livestock.
How, really, does someone ‘do something about it’ other than simply tell their friends and advise them not to train with the person? And risk the advice being simply regarded as gossip?
There are people who are in a grey area, with corrections that seem a tad too sustained and a tad too demanding, all the way up to really vicious and leaving injuries on the animal, and where ever one draws the line, NONE of them really are treated by the laws of the land in the USA.
Several people have mentioned that they are afraid to report abuse due to fear of harm to their horses. Actually I can sympathize with that. Most barns don’t allow one to move immediately, many people don’t even have a trailer, or even a place to take ttheir horse to. Some can’t even afford to move. Many may realize that the abuser will easily guess who reported them, even if it is done anonymously. A person can’t conceal his or her disgust in these situations, and it’s bound to be obvious who can’t stand it.
The charge is made here very often, ‘then it’s your fault it goes on’. So one is supposed to ‘tell the authorities’.
The trouble is, especially in America, most states and counties would not prosecute a horse pwner/rider for doing what is shown on the video. Yes, even that bad.
A person can call the police for things like this and there will be absolutely no results. The barn manager and even most of the people in the barn may be against the person.
What, really, is a person supposed to do when the entire structure around him condones this? He calls the police, they won’t even come out, even if they do, the abuse is over and it’s your word against the rider’s. So…he calls the humane officer, they say they have much worse problems than that to deal with. Sorry, no budget for lesser problems, got down and dead horses down the road, we have to deal with that first. The barn manager tells him to shut up and not make trouble.
In one case, a gal told me even her OWN trainer told her to shut up about it, with the pronouncement, ‘You can’t fix the whole world, shut up and don’t make trouble’.
Are those blaming others for the abuse continuing, really aware of how impossible it is to get someone arrested in America for whipping a horse at their own stable, or convicted? America has a long, long history of ‘chattel’ laws that makes even a man’s children and wife ‘chattel’, it has only been a relatively short time since a man was entitled to beat his wife and kids and do pretty much whatever he wanted with them. It’s even worse when it comes to companion animals, but under the law a horse is not even a companion animal, he’s livestock.
How, really, does someone ‘do something about it’ other than simply tell their friends and advise them not to train with the person? And risk the advice being simply regarded as gossip?
There are people who are in a grey area, with corrections that seem a tad too sustained and a tad too demanding, all the way up to really vicious and leaving injuries on the animal, and where ever one draws the line, NONE of them really are treated by the laws of the land in the USA.
Again, that’s the defeatist type of thing people say over and over , although they have likely never themselves tried to report abuse, so they can rationalize why they do nothing.
Oh well, lalala, you don’t need to report it because the police will never do anything according to slc .
It wasn’t that long ago we read about the prosecution of the American who beat her horse in the face with the chain end of the lead. How did that get into the legal system? She was charged, convicted and the horse was taken from her, I believe? Someone must have reported the abuse or nothing would have happened.
It’s easy to tell yourself that almost everyone abuses horses at the upper levels and that the police will never respond to a complaint of animal cruelty but it’s not true. There are plenty of other cases where individuals have been tried and convicted of animal cruelty to cats,to dogs, to horses. Neglect is much more difficult to prove.
Will they always respond the way you might wish? No. Are there grey areas? Yes, but not all examples of abuse fall in the grey area. It’s a cop out to say so.
I was actually involved in the prosecution of a trainers who beat a young horse for HOURS over the course of two days. It was a horse we had sold them. My mother got our horses out of there the next day, called the police, called the vet, charges were pressed.
Although the people (clients and boarders) who had witnessed it gave us their details and told us at first it was very disturbing to watch, it was amazing to see those same people turn tail and even DEFEND the trainer in court. 
Sickening all the way around. But, even when the legal system fails, there is always word of mouth, and within a year the offenders were finally out of business.
If you don’t report it/speak up, then you condone it by your silence. In a boarding situation there are circumstances where it becomes dangerous because proving it is difficult unless there is something like a video or there are sufficient witnesses willing to speak up.
In this case, the proof is in the video. This woman deserves to hang by her toe nails. Hopefully the court will throw the book at her and deliver the harshest punishment it can.
Her name needs to be out there, everyone in the world wide horse community should always be informed as to who abuses horses in their care. It’s up to us to police our own even though that can be very very difficult to do.
[QUOTE=slc2;3567042]
How, really, does someone ‘do something about it’ other than simply tell their friends and advise them not to train with the person? And risk the advice being simply regarded as gossip?
.[/QUOTE]
Because they film it, report it, get others on board to back up the claims.
It is all well and good to advise someone not to train with such a person but what about the horses that are owned by this trainer?..who speaks for them?!
[QUOTE=Bethe Mounce;3567167]
If you don’t report it/speak up, then you condone it by your silence. In a boarding situation there are circumstances where it becomes dangerous because proving it is difficult unless there is something like a video or there are sufficient witnesses willing to speak up.
In this case, the proof is in the video. [/QUOTE]
Very much agree…
So slc, do you believe that people were wrong to record the video and report the incident? Should they have done nothing other than whisper about it with their friends?
This whole thing makes me ill!!! That woman needs to go to jail, seriously. Who the hell does she think she is?? Thank GOD someone video taped her!! That poor horse is going to be messed up for a very long time because of her… :mad:
Well, I am glad it is being publicized…the only way to stop this kind of thing is to take away their air (their money, their clients, their livelihood, their ability to move to other countries, their means to get another horse). The only way to do that is to inform the public. As sad as this is, I am glad it happened there…cause here in the US, I don’t think anything would be done… :no: So, I sincerely hope she doesn’t come here…cause the abuse will continue…and here, it won’t stop. I have seen such horrific cases here…not specifically of horse training…but horse care (or rather, left to starve and die)… all the animal welfare authorities were called (3 seperate agencies)… and they did NOTHING to stop the woman… didn’t take the horses cause their body score was still a 3 and they say they can’t take them until they are at a 1!!! So, beating a horse here wouldn’t even raise an eyebrow…
You need a license to drive a car… yet you only need money to buy an animal… what’s wrong with that picture?
You guys do recognize, don’t you, that without catching ALL of this on tape, including the “after” footage of the injured horse, there would have been nothing to prove what she did… if the cameraman, or the guy watching, had stopped her, she would have just done the same thing later when nobody was watching.
This is the best thing they could have done to protect this horse and others from a worse fate at her hands.
I keep reading that the horse involved in the first trial had to be euthanized… why? what were his injuries? Those I saw looked like spur marks, but he was bleeding from the mouth in the video they showed.
Abuse
slc2 -
If you continue along your path of thinking, where you hide and say nothing, do nothing, then you are accepting this type of behavior. If everyone were like you and did not have a backbone to stand up to a situation like this, we would be living in a horrible world. Fortunately, I think many of the people here on the board would not put up with witnessing such abuse and would do something about it.
I was once told many, many years ago that this “Dressage Team Rider” I reported would ruin my career for life in the horse business if I were to report her for the abuse I witnessed on her horses. Quite the opposite happened, and many of the clients left with me.
You just have to do what is right, no matter what the outcome might be. I would not have been able to sleep at night knowing what I knew and seeing all the people/horses that were training with this woman, that had no idea of what was really going on. She was exposed and now that is the reputation she lives with. You may get some clients (the stupid ones!) that would train with someone like this but you certainly are going to have a hard time being successful after you have been CAUGHT!
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