German Riding Ponies-Stallions, market, etc.

[Rainbow_Farm_Unltd]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> As I recall ASPR does require a performance test of some sort, but I thought it could be done at the inspection itself. If you do find out the specific requirements and levels for dressage, jumping, driving, etc, could you post them here? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes it does require a performance test in either jumpers, dressage or driving. Dressage is at least First Level, driving is a prescribed level of CDE dressage, and jumping is a prescribed course of 5 specific fences with height dependent on pony size. With 2 stallions doing performance tests this coming Fall (yes, at the inspection with prior arrangement, provided the inspection site has appropriate facilities), this is what I’ve learned. The pony at our inspection last year did a lovely First level test, although he is showing second level. I don’t know about any performance requirements per se, because I simply haven’t got that far yet.

[Tiki]

What a beautiful pony and what beautiful proportions between rider and pony. I would think you’d need a rider with a very long torso before they might look out of proportion. I’m 5’8" myself and feel very comfortable on a pony of this type, but not most Welsh, even at 14.2, as they are much finer boned, finer bodied types that really feel like ponies. These guys don’t. The New Forest and the GRP’s are a very different type. The Welsh and a lot of the BRP’s I’ve seen, although beautiful animals, would take a smaller rider than I.

[benno]

I also wanted to say that there are indeed FEI Pony Tests in dressage offered and ridden in this country as in Europe and there are dressage, showjumping and eventing criteria for performance criteria - I posted the requirements in my January 10 post to Ilona on this thread.

Lendon Gray has done so much to promote children riding these tests and there are very talented girls doing so. The competition is getting fierce. Several of the top competitors have now aged out and will be going to the Junior Team competitions with their new horses. FEI Pony Tests in dressage are equivalent to a combination of second and third level, requiring collection, not just doing the movements. The Junior Tests in dressage are equivalent to third, fourth level. There are several super 10 year old girls readying themselves for these tests when they turn 12. Two that I know of are with Lendon Gray, one is in Florida.

If the ISR keeps to the information I have from them, it is very hard to have a pony stallion receive his Lifetime Breeding License, just as it is hard for horse stallions. Right now, there are 3 choices: the 30 Day Stallion Performance Test, successfully compete second/third level dressage, compete in 3 day events, or showjump 4’6" and up. Or, as I did with Benno’s Dream, import already with the 30 day test completed in Europe. If the ISR is changing its requirements, I sure would like to know because I am in decision-making mode with Chico, my 3 year old GRP stallion.

ASPR has no requirements for stallion licensing other than the initial inspection which can occur as early as 2 years old. The judges’ evaluation at that inspection is what determines “yea” or “nay”.

[_K1]

I am a member on PoniesL list - but I was just getting bogged down by emails - and myself pref a Bulletin Board as it seems to be a better way to have ‘conversations’.

I’d ask my welshy questions on PoniesL but I know MOST of the folks there also on here.

Hope you all don’t mind that I went slightly off topic on this thread also.

CHEERS!

WOWWELSH----

AHHH! Well that explains WHY you never see an ‘out of size range’ welsh for sale that has been priced down! LOL

I was thinking “Hmmm maybe I could find an over sized B mare for breeding for a little less than a true to size”. LOL silly me!

[hluing]

OHHH…anyone know more about Hemmingway?
Sounds like another nice option for mare owners.

[ise]

OOps I made a mistake on MacPherson’s size - he will probably finish around 15.3H. Sorry for got the .3!

[Oakstable]

I have two 15.1 Trakehner mares too and am considering this market though not for 2005-06. I did breed one of them to a small Arabian and got a gorgeous sportpony colt, but the mare is now in foal to Pablo for an autumn 2005 foal.

I’m 5’1" and when I first started taking lessons, the instructor put me on the smaller of the available lesson horses and I hated it at that time.

I originally wanted to breed Connemaras but decided that the return on investment could better for Wbs. The feed may be more, the vet bills are the same.

I think a dead broke sport pony could go for a lot of money. I’ll keep my eye on this niche.

Sally

[hluing]

Linda,
I would love to here about you foal, and see pics after it is born. I LOVE Donnerweiss, and am so tempted to breed a mare to him. I love those bloodlines, and he has cleaned up at the breed shows. Have you worked with Rhein.before? How active is their pony division? I was not aware he is eleigible in that registry, and know little about them. There website does not seem to address ponies.

[Lesley_Feakins]

Mary Lou,

Again, thank you

[pwynnnorman]

Welcome, “K”! Hope you stay a while. Right now, this particular BB has tremendous depth in threads and participants. However, your questions made me want to ask one, too: Does WPCSA (or someone) have a BB or listserve where Welsh-specific questions can be asked? (Sorry to get a little OT with that!)

[Lesley_Feakins]

Mary Lou - Thank you!
Yes…I am thrilled that he is turning out to be every bit as good as we anticipated. Its killing me that he is away from home but Jill is a wonderful person and I hear they make quite the team

[Lesley_Feakins]

Meghan…I just checked your site and LOVE the photo of your weaning sporting the champion sash. The photo and caption underneath …just priceless

[Sportpony]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nwalk:
Here is a question for those of you who have already produced sport ponies for a few years. How is the market for weanlings and yearlings? Do crossbred (pony X WB or TB) young horses sell or do you need to keep them until they are going under saddle to get them sold at the price you want? Do purebred sport ponies (New Forrest X New Forrest) (GRP X GRP) (Welsh X Welsh) sell better as weanlings and yearlings than the crossbreds? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I’ve been breeding for sportponies now for a number of years. When I started out and up to maybe 4 years ago, it seemed like I didn’t get them sold as weanlings. Everything I sold was 3 years old or up and going under saddle.

Now, the last three years, I’ve sold everything I put on the ground as weanlings, though I haven’t had a big number … and the 4 year old and up ponies that I kept from previous years are going well also.

But at this point, I have exactly one “older” sportpony for sale … a 6 year old quarter-Holsteiner pinto mare that I’d kept as a broodmare for myself that has never been started under saddle … and I’ve got inquiries on her. Even five years ago I’d not have had much, if any, interest in her … and I’ve sold four other 4 to 6 year old “previous broodmares” as well.

Since I do use warmblood cross mares as the dams there is some concern at times about the foals going over 14.2 but I’m finding that is getting to be less of a concern as well, with more small (and older) adults looking at ponies or smaller horses for competition.

[Rainbow_Farm_Unltd]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ~K:
I was thinking “Hmmm maybe I could find an over sized B mare for breeding for a little less than a true to size”. LOL silly me! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are we sure there is any such thing as a Section B over 14.2h? I have a customer who has a Section B who’s 1/4 inch or so below 14.2h, but I thought these large Section B’s are fairly rare still. I know there are folks breeding for the bigger B’s though. And I could always be wrong… The large Section B photos I’ve seen and the one that I know personally are “cobbier” to me than some of the more refined, smaller Section B’s. I guess the increase in girth and bone would go along with height, though.

And ~K, purebred Welsh youngsters have always seemed very reasonable to me, but I’ve come to ponies from wb’s, so that might skew my perspective.

[maple_brook]

Lesley…is that the filly at the end of Forest’s video? She is lovely!

[Del]

Here is one of him moving.
He is by the Sport Pony sire - Ascot Classic Silk(A.I). The dam is by Keston Royal Ocassion*(dec) who is known world wide as one of the greats in pony sires.

[Rainbow_Farm_Unltd]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I would also love to hear about people who crossed small warmblood mares woth ponies. I have a 15.1hh Trak mare I am stallion shopping for. Thanks <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I bought my 2 very small Welsh stallions, so I could use my bigger, proven mares with them. I already had the mares, and wanted to get into sport ponies, as I keep getting older and am not very tall. So far this has worked very well for me. My TB mare produced a colt by Telynau Braveheart that scored Premier (8.1) with the American Sportpony Registry, was National Foal Futurity Reserve Champion (U.S.) and Grand Champion Half Welsh at the Welsh Central Nationals in Tulsa. My other produced a First Premium foal out of a Second Premium mare, so I have great hopes for both these guys in the future. This year my 153.h Dutch mare (Vosmaer/Saluut) and my 15.2h TB mare (Dr. Blum/Stop The Music) are both expecting ponies by my boys.

[ise]

Would be nice to have a complete list for each discipline as to the rules just for ponies. Seems it varies between the competitions under the USDF, Hunters, jumpers and eventing.

[Del]

Lesley: Gee, I like your mare Jennifer, I would love to see the result a RP over her!!

Benno: Yes, I thought it was a great site, which is why I posted it! and on your query and as “pwynn” points out, there are some lovely Welsh ponies there with the downland blood.
Having said this there are few RP’s there to cross with this, which has been why things have been successful in other countries dating back over many years.
This is the bit missing there - I think
If you look on the French site - the horse Valentino (and what a fine type he was!)- carries the marvellous old RP blood of Bwlch Valentino - there are pics of both. This can be also found in many Riding Pony breeding programs - German or otherwise.
Personally, I also breed on the dam line more so than on a sire line. I think the mares are so important for their strength in producing a “type” in the long term.

Tiki: Yes, I would agree - New Forrest & GRPs are very different to look at, as you would expect from their breeding.
The Riding Pony goes up to 14.2 and there are 2 types within this umbrella - the show hunter has more substance than the “show pony”.

Our Section B’s go only to 13.2 here as in the UK. Although, maybe a welsh cob cross would be nice for you to consider as a personal mount- both height and lots of substance in one.

[CentrelineFarm]

I had heard as well that there are different size designations in Europe.
A pony can be up to 15.2 or something, can’t it? And there are classes for ponies 14.2 - 15.2 or something?

Wouldn’t it be great if we had small horse divisions??? 14.3-15.2 hand classes for kids. I know that we grow them big nowadays And most 15 year olds cannot fit a 14.2 hand pony anymore.