Horse is a 5 year old mare. Green. First owner post track is selling does not have time for her
she looks good from pictures. My current horse is also an OTTB whom I have had since she was four and was also a green bean. So I am going to see if I like her. If she checks out with me will do pre purchase exam.
So OTTB buyers what are the questions that you ask of seller when you are buying?
Not sure this is a horse I would keep or try to “flip.”
Pedigree of full sib.
What I know so far (per seller)
At track but never raced.
Never had a foal
Nice disposition
What to ask/observe
how long have you had her
why selling
Hx of surgeries
up to date on vaccinations
any behavioral issues
temperament/disposition.
Any health issues
conformation
movement
what job current owner thinks she is best suited for.
trail potential/experience
ground manners
Where’s the horse (so I can see and judge for myself). If I don’t know, or at least know of, the seller I’m not going to put much stock in what they say anyways.
I’d keep it vague, what can you tell me about the horse/what have you done with her. I don’t care why they’re selling- if the horse has behavioral problems if the seller hasn’t disclosed in the ad or when I set an appointment they probably won’t tell me now.
With a green horse, either you are looking for a higher level prospect in which case you are looking at conformation and movement. Or if like me you’re looking for a riding horse to have fun with and do occasional showing, I look for disposition and a horse I like to be around.
I’d agree. The current owner likely has not much real sense of the horses potential and is very likely selling because over horsed. No insult to the horse it happens alot with OTTB.
You are going to have to decide based on your own knowledge of conformation if the horse can do the job you want. And going to have to start from scratch to teach her that job. Many OTTB end up hacking out just fine once they are retrained. About zero per cent of fresh OTTB can be said to have “trail horse potential” at the start like a QH might.
Even ground manners doesn’t matter. She may not have them to riding horse standard… You need to teach these.
I would want to know:
Why didn’t she race?
Any injuries or serious disease?
What are her feet like? Distorted or cracked or founder?
Does she crib or weave or other stereotype?
Do you like how she moves at liberty? Does she have nice form over a free jump?
Is she batshit crazy in any way or just your normal young hot horse?
Some of this you observe some you might ask, but they aren’t going to tell you much.
Seems to me that this owner isn’t going to know a lot about the horse, despite owning it for a while, since they have not done much with her, if they “do not have time for her”. They would only know about what has happened to her while in their care, anyway- and may or may not disclose this. I’d start by assessing the owner- how much knowledge and skill do they have? If “not a lot”, asking many questions isn’t going to be very fruitful. You never know the validity or value of any response you get.
I’d look up the trainer or owner (or even the breeder) of the horse when it was at the track, and see if they are approachable. Or contact your friends who work at the track where this horse trained, see if anyone knew her there. If she went into training at the track, there is a reason why she did not start in a race. It may be something important to you and her future as a sport horse, or it may not be. But it would be nice to know- from a source who has nothing to gain from the sale.
You didn’t ask about pedigree, but this horse has Halo, Danzig, and Alydar way back. Those horses could be difficult which may be the reason the owner hasn’t done much w her.
Well… After looking her up are you sure she was at the track?
There’s not much there. And that makes me wonder a bit more…why not?
That said her lineage is cool, love complete outbreds. I just worry what she’s done ( or not) in her 5 years.
Also… new standard for me is to take cervical spine rads in all ppe’s. Mandatory.
Em
Especially w Halo. Great recommendation!!!
Yep. Vetted a 2-yo last year, nothing much done with her, no problem, right? Seller (sales barn, didn’t know filly’s history) and even vet thought cervical radiographs were overkill. Well, until they showed significant arthritis between 2 vertebrae + a piece missing from the top of another vertebra, indicating that she flipped over at some point. Getting the radiographs turned out to be cheap insurance against buying a problem that wasn’t readily apparent any other way. You are also screening for ECVM if they can get good views of at least C6.
I really don’t ask much except a general, “so what’s this horse’s story?” and let the seller’s response steer the conversation.
I would be curious why she didn’t race, but quite frankly, I tend not to believe whatever excuse they give you. Usually they very truthfully say “too slow/didn’t want to,” but that can mean a thousand different things.
I do think it’s interesting to ask the seller what job they think the horse would be best at. That can give you a lot of insight into temperament and soundness, especially if what they are saying doesn’t match what you are seeing.
I also think it’s interesting to ask what kind of maintenance the horse requires. Most people will be pretty honest but it’s interesting when they add statements like, “she’s an easy keeper but she just needs this one thing that’s no big deal…” Sometimes that NBD is a cheap supplement or extra flake of hay, other times it’s $$$ corrective shoeing. 
Thanks for all of your replies. Seller admitted that she weaves in a stall but I think she would have access to turn out most of the time which might reduce or solve the problem. I have a large stall with smaller attached paddock and then a larger turn out area. If I like her, I hope that she and my current horse get along. I hope to look at her today and if she seems like a good one, follow up with pre-purchase exam and trainers assessment. I also might ask to see if I can take her to my place for a trial to see how she works out- I live in a small community and seller is just a few miles away. Needless to say horse would need to be insured before she goes on trial if that is an option.
Not sure if she would be a project or a keeper. If I bought her and she can do what I’d like her to do then she could be a keeper.
My current horse, Angel the Wonder horse, would be a tough act to follow. She is a good trail horse, wants to please, athletic, beautiful, and sweet as the day as long. She has done lower level eventing (due to time money restraints more than ability). She can sort cattle, be in a parade, and do pole bending. She also can do trail trials. She can do trail classes. Won her first jumping class at a schooling show. And we traveled to Antelope Island on the great salt lake years ago to participate in a Buffalo round up (we got close to buffalo but were vigilant and ran away if one of them wanted to chase us). I can’t expect potential for all in this in this new horse, but I do love a versatile horse.
Weaving is a hard No for me. Stable vices indicate a level of anxiety that may never go away and could manifest in other problems as well. The motion of weaving also stresses hooves, legs, who knows what else.
A hard No.
I agree with @Danged_Arab about the weaving. There’s an OTTB G that came to our barn as a jumper prospect. He’s an exceptionally nice mover, but he’s a stall walker. A boarder wanted to buy him and I said “no” for the same reason stated above. She bought him anyway and moved him to a stall that has an attached run. He no longer walks constantly, but will still spin occasionally in his stall and at the gate when he’s turned out. He is a very stressy horse, with lots of quirks handling on the ground. Nice part is he is usually quite businesslike undersaddle, but the owner will have a hard time selling him in the future if the need arises. He’s just too unpredictable and difficult to handle, with explosive tendancies.
Thanks all. I will need to see how significant weaving is. If the horse is confined to a stall, might do much better if not confined. She will never be confined in a stall if I end up with her as I have large stall and paddock. She would also have access to turn out most or all of the time. I also feed free choice hay 24/7 so that might also help. If I like the horse I will be sure vet looks closely at legs in PPE. I am going to see this horse tomorrow. So after that, I will know a lot more.
I had a gelding once who circled in his stall. He came from a show barn with no attached paddocks and no turnout. With me, he was never confined to his stall. There was a good-sized attached paddock, plus he was turned out in a nice grass pasture 8 hours a day. He still circled in his stall.
Looking at shod horses that weave, you can see how it wears their shoes.
Imagine what happens to their hooves and up the leg.
Weaving is very hard on knees, they are first to go after years of weaving.
You may be able to minimize weaving and that will help some, but any such obsessive/compulsive behavior that involves perpetual motion, cribbing, weaving, stall/ fence walking, will result in wear and tear damage.
That has to be considered when looking at prospects.
Thanks all for input.
Here is my list of things to assess (so far). Appreciate any comments, additions to the list
Height
Back length
withers
topline
shoulder angle
neck length shape/carrot test
front legs straight/over at knee
pastern length angle
hind end angles
head
teeth
hooves
Feeding program
maintenance (supplements/medicines/shoeing)
hx of surgeries
hx of colic
prior pregnancies/foals
Track hx (races, prior owner/trainer)
UTD on shots
worming
teeth floating
Friendly
attentive
cooperative
ground manners
moves from pressure
ties stands still
clippers
spook
trailers
Walk
trot
canter (L, R lead) cross canter
softness to bit
softness left right
responds to leg/seat
Whoa or go,
jump
trail experience
Oh is this horse already going under saddle? The scenario of 5 year olf OTTB with owner with no time suggests to me horse is likely only track broke. In other words needs to be restarted.
Before you go, ask owner how much they have ridden and what they have done with her. Not enough time is code for too much horse. If they are riding her then you make them ride first walk trot canter. And only get on if you like what you see.
Obviously a race horse is broke to saddle and can be mounted by anyone with the bravery but they just do not respond to seat or leg or bit as you are expecting here. That’s all stuff you are going to teach her.
Most TB have decent functional conformation and some are outstanding. Young TB can look gawky because they are under muscled but usually the basic angles are good. Really look at feet and hooves, and consider back and neck. issues.
Honestly the ground manners clipping etc those are all things you teach a young horse. Not things you need to buy.
Anyhow from the scenario I would expect a horse that scared the owner and has been sitting doing nothing for a year and has no significant post track schooling. I would not expect to ride at your visit.
This horse has been ridden on a limited basis by the owner apparently only in a corral. I don’t expect horse to stand and put up with clipper noise. However, I would be interested in how she to sight of clippers from a few feet away, how she reacts to clippers held by body, and then reaction when clippers are turned on from a few feet away and then moving closer to her. I think that this lady has another horse and may not have time for both. I am not expecting her to respond to leg seat aids per se but just want to see where she is with it. Just want to get a sense of her and trainability.
I won’t do the clipper test till I’ve assessed more basic things of course. And maybe not on this visit. It’s not a high priority
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