That is truly terrifying to think about…
Check out April Simmonds and Impressively Done from that same show, viney.
I don’t think any fence judge in real time would have thought that was anything but a horse fall! I have seen them changed later, but to me the photographic evidence doesn’t show conclusively that his hip and shoulder weren’t on the ground at the same time.
I was judging a corner at the Plantation CIC one year where there were several falls, at least 2 of which were horse falls. One of the falls was a bit tricky to call–but it didn’t look anything like CRs fall!
I think it’s safe to say if all four of the horse’s legs are pointing more or less straight up in the air, it’s a horse fall and mandatory retirement!
7 Likes
Had there been a frangible pin, it would’ve saved them from the fall being that nasty 
All Open oxers should have pins.
Its very clear that was an MR, Any horse that is flipping should be an MR… doesn’t matter if its shoulder and hind end at the same time, rotationals don’t happen like that.
Amen!
And the same should be said if all four legs crumple and the belly touches the ground.
I’m curious if anyone has any insight between 2 and 3:
Is there a cover-up going on, or are JJs misjudging or misrecording the falls?
To that end–has anyone had a first-hand experience where they recorded an MR as a JJ and it was later scored as a RF?
I don’t know about these two incidents, but I know I’ve been following live scoring and have seen MR’s that later showed up as RF’s so that tells me that it’s not the jump judges getting it wrong.
2 Likes
I’m disturbed by the analysis of CR and E6. Those photos are horrifying.
Properly noting this would have prevented the fall at Rolex. Imagine the horse or CR died? I mean DO WE ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT SAFETY AND OUR HORSES OR NO??
I know I’m a broken record of bitching on the internet about this but come on. There is NO WAY that horse should have gone to Rolex.
and to think people like Callie Evans get eliminated for a scratch from a jump, yet ML runs around with bloody mouths, and these horrifying falls are noted as RF to save BNRs from being bumped down.
disgusted. So happy this has come to light.
5 Likes
Agreed 100%. I must be getting more and more cynical (I mean, look at the political scene) but I am more apt to believe there are cover ups going on than jump judges getting things wrong. Who makes the call? I’m betting it goes pretty high up the food change, all the way to the team officials. Why do the calls get made? Are there significant financial donors/sponsors that have put their support behind certain riders and want to see that pan out, so pressure the officials?
I can speak firsthand that certain BNR’s are absolutely treated like royalty and yellow cards, altercations, etc are avoided at all costs unless they put themselves in a position where there are either enough witnesses or it’s a blatant offense (such as DR). That goes back to the WHY though. Why is it so damn important for certain people to make a team when it can cost the sport so much?
3 Likes
Beautifully put.
Hold on there pardna, this has nothing to do with the little guy. We are talking UL, because that is where a drop down will cost real money to people who don’t like losing it. The little guy can romp in unsanctioned events all he or she wants and if they have two MRs in a 12 month period, it should be their trainer yanking them back.
I remembered, then found, an EN article from 2012 that tried to explain the new FEI rule on unsanctioned events.
http://eventingnation.com/fei-vs-usef-a-battle-of-legal-clarifications/
The FEI General Assembly has introduced a new rule that athletes and officials will no longer be permitted to participate in both sanctioned and unsanctioned events. If an athlete, horse or an FEI official participates in a non-sanctioned event, such person or horse will be prohibited from participating in any sanctioned events, both international and national, for a period of six months thereafter. An unsanctioned event is an event that is not on the FEI calendar and is not authorised by a National Federation.
Did that rule get rescinded, because now there is confusion about what Welly World is in regards to this rule. If it is unsanctioned, then even if they had MR, Miss Little shrugs and says ‘na na na, can’t stop me’, but if it is unsanctioned, how are these guys allowed to entered in it since the NO had also not put its blessing on its dark soul.
Then if it was okayed by the FEI, the score does matter and that fall was changed specifically to not set Demi back.
Is this perhaps why Canada didn’t get an invite. One more foreign country and the FEI would have had to crack down on the riders?
According to the FEI’s statement, an international-level show that runs outside the jurisdiction of a National Federation and has more than 15 international riders from more than four nations falls under this rule.
This really smells worse than hot horse manure.
1 Like
One would think that these types of rules are there specifically to be a check on BNRs since in the day to day, they may not be the best person to self regulate. I have great respect for CR, but as others pointed out, that horse was not ready. In the first two frames you see it was not prepared or ready for that jump.
Maybe CR asked for a review, maybe the TD or Judge swapped it, because they didn’t want to get in the way of CR’s chance to ride in Rolex, but to not call that a MR (or HF), one would need to be blind. The rules are there to stop humans from being stupid with a creature that does not get to vote. I think E6 may have said to CR, ‘Maam, maybe we slow this train down for a moment, I’m struggling here’.
For the record, your broken record continues to play beautiful music. Keep it playing
“In the first two frames you see it was not prepared or ready for that jump.”
I find it really hard to tell – the first two frames show the beginning of the jump, not the strides preceding it, so who is to know how the approach to the fence was?
1 Like
I did notice that the first photo Dragoo photo of Escot 6 on the beginning of the landing showed that one of his front legs had already hit the top of the jump. That’s one of the things that frequently (usually? always?) leads to a horse fall, usually a Rotational Fall.
Not to belabor…when you look at that first picture which is before his head is even between the flags his head is very down, almost like he was looking down. Certainly he is more on the forehand. By the next the head is across the flags yet low and by the third it’s clear he is way balanced forward and down.
Also, look how close to the fence his fronts are when the land and click to the next and we see the momentum of the back end now shoving him over. Either he spooked at the base, was way behind the leg, felt over faced and CR corrected too late and tried anyway, but he was not ready to jump that fence.
Whether it was Rider or horse induced, the smart step is to take a step back and evaluate, given this was a second HF.
If a horse has to get up off the ground and the rider is unseated, yeah, it’s a MR.
1 Like
Thank you JP60 
I feel like a horse that has three MRs should be limited to the level below which it fell for the rest of its career.
Any horse that falls three times on cross country should not be eventing.
4 Likes
THIS!!!
For sure the first pictures already show signs of trouble, but, until I looked at the pictures, the other comment made me think that the series showed the approach, but it does not.
Also this brings to mind a UK rider . . . male rider, grey gelding, that fell multiple times and I believe the fall I saw was towards the end of Badminton or Burghley, and then was retired / diagosed with neuro issues afterwards I believe. A good example, if anyone can remember the details, of the falls being a red flag.
As I said earlier, this thread made me reflect on the number of times I’ve been on a horse that has fallen . . . which is two out of many many rides, although, ya know, I’m not a steeplechase jockey or anything, but still, I can’t imagine not worrying about riding a horse that’s fallen multiple times, I don’t know how they do it.
You’d think, and yet since Rolex last year it’s done three CIC3* events and a CCI3* (and it ran the Ocala CIC only a month after the Fair Hill CCI, which seems nuts in and of itself) so I bet she’s aiming it for Rolex again.
I think a mandatory two or three week vacation from competition for the horse following an MR would be an ok rule too.
2 Likes
