Growing Hay, the struggle with 1st cut

[NaturalSelection]

We have 25 ac of hay crop on our hobby farm. I usually work a deal with a neighbor farmer in one of three ways:

1. We split the cut, he does all the labor and we split each cut
2. Farmer does all the labor and keeps the first cut in exchange for labor on the second cut which I keep
3. I pay farmer to custom bale at a $/bale rate and I keep the cut.

Here is the problem. I don’t want 1st cut hay, the cut is always so late that the hay is stemmy and my horses don’t like it. In that case you would think I would choose #2. However, I want to get first cut off the field as early possible to maximize growing time and rain for 2nd and 3rd cuts, but the Farmer is incentivized to wait on 1st cut to maximize yield and ensure dry weather-this usually results in our field being one of the last to be cut.

I had a crazy idea…what if I mowed the hay field in early-mid May when the Hay is 6-8" tall and just mulched it on the field? My perceived benefits are: nutrients are preserved on the field; actual 1st cut is more like 2nd cut in maturity by the time the weather finally lines up (past late May/early June rainy season); increases the probability of three good horse cuts per year. Has anyone tried this?

[Guilherme]

I dunno. I’d talk to your Extension Agent and get a real professional opinion.

G.

[OTTBs]

I asked someone this question a while ago and was told you’d still have to get the cut grass off the field.

[clanter]

but the Farmer is incentivized to wait on 1st cut to maximize yield and ensure dry weather-this usually results in our field being one of the last to be cut.

my parents bought a hobby farm and relied upon neighbor real farmers to cut/bale the hay thinking these farmers would be happy to have the cash… their hay was always the last to cut, took repeated calls … then my parents ended up buying their own equipment. There was an unspoken level of resentment, the neighbors were not really accepting of this dude who was just there enjoying the lifestyle while they had to work their butts off to earn a living/pay real estate taxes…parents were viewed as pretend farmers

[Hulk]

I would be very careful of upsetting the apple cart. The neighbor is doing you a great service in keeping your land for you. Tillable acreage is far more valuable than non tillable. Hay equipment is very expensive to buy, run, and maintain. Hay making is more of an art than a science, and also is always a huge gamble on mother nature. It is also back breaking labor. Sure looks easy to sit on a tractor all day, but see how well you walk after 12 or more hours of that.

If your field is the last to cut it may not be a high priority for the farmer to cut. If that is the case, if it becomes too much of a PIA to him, he may just drop it off his things to do list. Good first cutting hay is nothing to turn a nose up at. Also the 3 deals you describe sound pretty dang sweet to me. Plus a farmer that has done hay his whole life usually has a pretty darn good handle on how to manage the hay crops. So I guess what I am saying is I would approach the situation with much thought, research, and carefully to make sure all factors involved are considered before acting.

[Guilherme]

@OTTBs

I asked someone this question a while ago and was told you’d still have to get the cut grass off the field.

Not necessarily. It depends very much on local conditions and how finely the grass is cut.

One misconception is that there is an incentive to allow the first cutting to get long and stemmy because there is more volume. It’s true that there might be more volume, but more volume of what? If it’s stems that’s not so good for quality. If you’re feeding cattle it might be OK…unless you’re feeding dairy cattle where it’s NOT OK. For these, and other reasons, the OP needs to talk with their Extension Agent and get real advice optimized for their circumstances.

G.

[BellaLuna]

I understand your dilemma. I love my local farmers and try to support them as much as possible.

When we first moved to our farm, we contracted with a local farmer to hay our non-pastured fields. (Although your deal is much better than mine - I still paid!)

We started becoming such an after-thought to him that the cutting was getting later and later. And the product was becoming less palatable to the horses. And I was going nuts with looking at the fields getting older and older.

We ended up scrapping the idea of making our own hay and I buy mine from another local farmer. With the first deal, I even provided the labor to load into the wagons and stack the barn. (my kids always talk about what a horrible childhood I put them through) Now that I buy from another farmer, he shows up with the wagons and it’s done!

Back to the first farmer - for a couple of years, I allowed him to make round bales for cattle. This went well for a few seasons - it was a win-win. I got my fields cut and he carted the product off. But the last year of this arrangement, he “forgot” about the round bales and I looked at them for at least a year. (I’m sure I was simply storing them for him). Now I just cut the fields myself and use them for riding.

[fordtraktor]

Getting horse quality first cut really depends on the weather. And of course the farmer is going to prioritize his own fields first…any May window is going to go to his stuff, and June is usually late/stemmy. I don’t think anyone who knows anything about hay wants older stemmy hay, but weather is a huge factor.

another idea is to trade the first cut to someone with a haylage wrapper for cattle. It can be put up in much wetter weather which will get it off the field earlier or when he horse hay fields can’t be cut due to weather forecast.

But really, I would probably choose option 2. You do want to get the grass off the fields if you do an early cut if there is any thickness to it at all. Otherwise it will sit there and rot and that will get in your later bales, ruining them. There have been some years when it rains all spring when I have seen people bale the first cut and just burn it to get rid of it or give it to a landscaping place for mulch.

[McGurk]

Another factor to consider is how you’re maintaining your hay fields. If the farmer has other fields that have been limed, fertilized and seeded, he’s going to cut those first, to maximize the quality hay. Also, if he cuts other, larger acreages, he’s going to tend to those first. Your 25 acres might not be a big deal to him in terms of his total output. He may just be cutting your hay as a hedge against a bad year. 25 acres might not make a full day for the farmer and equipment if he’s roundbaling it - that’s another reason it might be at the bottom of the farmer’s list.

Here in my part of VA, the first cutting is definitely going to be stemmy. Hay was ready to be cut well before Memorial Day, but we had to wait 2 1/2 weeks after the hay was at peak to cut and bale because of unseasonable wet and cool weather. It was incredibly frustrating to watch it get older and taller and not be able to get it cut and baled. But I still put up first cutting hay for the horses because I’m really uncertain of what the second cutting will be like at all.

I know of two landowners with 15 and 20 acres of hay, respectively. They give the hay away in order to get the farmer to sign their agricultural use certificate - they don’t keep the hay, they don’t get any money, they just want the fields cut. Because the fields are not well maintained and the hay is poor quality, sometimes someone is willing to cut it for cattle hay, sometimes not.

[2DogsFarm]

I have a similar deal to your #2 option.
My L-shaped micro-field < less than 5ac - gets cut & baled by a neighbor who leases fields all over the area.
Weather determines what the 1st cut turns out like - right now it is looking pretty stemmy since rain & dry alternating haven’t let him cut too many places.
I feed 1st cut to my horses (everyone is in great condition) but not always from my field - he provides hay gratis in exchange for keeping what my field provides. IIRC: 150 small squares (Avg 40#+) last year.
I get a civilized looking acreage, he gets hay to sell.
At least 2 cuttings, sometimes 3.
Win/Win.

Now I have a Hijack Question:
I also allow neighbor to store loaded wagons in my 60X120 indoor.
As long as I have 2/3 of the arena to ride in I’m fine with the arrangement.
Right now I have 2 ginormous, empty cage wagons that have sat all Winter & 1 smaller wagon loaded with 1st cutting from his home field (they live across the road).
In haying season I have had as many as 7 smaller fully-loaded wagons in there.
If I have my trainer coming I ask them to pull out wagons so I can ride a lesson,
If I’m riding myself we work around the wagons & I will turn horses out in the indoor, advising neighbors wagons will be plundered.
Arrangement has worked for us for 5yrs.

My Question:
What does storage space for baled hay generally cost?
IOW: how much am I actually giving them in exchange for free hay?
I go through 400 small squares annually.

[gumtree]

I suppose the way this works can be area specific. The following is how it works in my neck of the hay making woods.

The important fact that you did not give is what kind of “hay” are you offering,Timothy, Orchard? Or is it just 25 acres of generic field grasses? 25 acres is plenty big enough for just about any hay producer to be interested. But the level of interest will totally depend on the quality of the hay stand. Timothy and Orchard grasses where it can be grown well are pretty much the gold standard for most horse people. But if the stand is and or has been poorly managed, weedy, mixed with junk grasses, like “barn grass” etc. If the stand by and large is “thin” with the good stuff this reduces the yield and the desirability. Be it for one’s own use even more so to sell at a decent price.

If it is just full of generic field grasses the desirability drops a lot. Takes the same about of time, effort and expense to bale and put up good/quality hay as it does to bale and put up crappy hay. The problem with “share cropping” hay is the fact haying windows can be short and far between depending on location. So the producer is always going to bale stands that are 100% theirs for the taking first. Who is on the top of the share crop list will be dictated by the size, quality and location of the stand.

Most horse people, esp those of us who “do” horses for our living generally prefer quality 1st cuttings of Timothy or Orchard. The problem with getting a quality 1st cutting of Tim or Orchard where it grows best is the weather. The “book” that everybody reads about hay, esp 1st cuttings. Says it needs/should be cut and baled before these 2 verities reach “boot stage”. The stage when the grass starts sending up the seed stalks. But the “book” never made any hay and is usually written and or recited from by extension agents who haven’t either. Around my neck of the hay woods Timothy and Orchard start going to seed by mid to late May. But in just about all areas that Timothy and Orchard grow best the weather window in May are short and the sun is not “not” enough at this time to dry down the hay quickly before the weather window closes. We also have to battle higher humidity levels. I’ve never had much luck baling in May. Esp without using a hay preservative. Most areas mid June is when we can bale hay. Yes, it can be a little “stalky” but if it is a good stand there will be plenty of good leaf in the bales. If cut in late June there will be much more stalk and a lot more “brown/dead” leaf in the bales.

The “deals” you have listed are pretty universal. But the standard deal is 60-40 stacked in the barn. 60% to the baler. But this includes stand maintenance, weeding, spraying herbicide and fertilizing when needed. Better quality hay, better yield. Win-win for both.

The rate for custom baling is area specific and based on the size and quality of the stand. Anywhere from 50 cents a bale to $2 bale for small squares. Of free just to get the field mowed and cleaned up. Most hay producers around here only want to make large squares, 600 lbs ++. Not many bother with with round bales anymore in my neck of the woods. They’ve up graded all of the equipment to the much more efficient producing and storage that large squares give.

As to mowing in May this has it’s draw backs. I know I tried it. Yes it does somewhat reduce the amount of seed stalks the grass is trying to put out. But it is pretty precedent. Kind of like dandy lions, mow them down and a few days later there are twice as many flowers. The other draw back and IMO a major one. The stuff you have cut will not turn biodegrade, turn to mulch/dirt by the time the stand is cut and baled. You will get a LOT of dead/brown junk in the bales. This will diminish the quality for resale and the desirability for anybody to bale it off for you. I would pass if I found this had been done.

Not all areas can and or will get 3 quality cuttings. Depends on the timing of the first cutting and the summer growing weather. 3rd cuttings maybe thin and if the mower has to be set low to get a decent yield you run the risk of stressing the grasses. Good chance you will get a fair bit of die-back. Timothy and Orchard are clump grasses. They do not spread over time. So when a “clump” dies your stand gets that much thinner. Over the course of a few years it will get much thinner allowing junk stuff to move in. At some point you will have to kill off the field and start over again. All hay stand have to be done over at some point. No sense in speeding things up. This falls under the rule of diminishing returns.

[Jealoushe]

This will most likely ruin the quality later on for the 2nd and 3rd cuts, or the following years cuts.

Talk to the farmer to see if you can get him to cut earlier. This is the down side to these arrangements, my parents struggle with the same.

Another option is to fertilize and overseed in the fall so your first cut is better.

[goodhors]

I am starting a hay field this year. Turned it, seeded, dragged and mowed it down as recommended when other folks were (or should have been) baling. My new growth was short, at cutting, maybe 7 inches. The cut portion fell to the ground, no longer visible. The cut portion will add nutrients to the grass plants, a bonus. The regrowth looks very nice, what I would want in my baled hay, not seedy yet. All State Extention hay growing advice recommends you cut new growth of grass hay, not bale it early in summer. This strengthens plant roots, nutrients go back into the soil/plants for almost a fertilizer effect.

There has been some local baling, but spotty. Most grass stands are beyond the best stage now, seeds are drying on the stems. This will be first cutting, probably cattle hay. I sure don’t want it for my horses, no nutrition, just dried grass. We have gotten a lot of rain, would have been hard to dry any recently cut hay.

I will be cutting my new fields again soon, pretending it is pasture until later in summer. I hope we can get a crop off this year, but the land will have to dry a lot to take hay equipment in there. This is heavy clay soil, just turned to glue once it was tilled. I have never gotten stuck so often as this year, trying to work these fields!! Thank God for the second tractor for pulling the stuck one out.

I have a name to call about baling, will talk terms. We can use the hay if he will do small squares. I still need to fertilize, just got soil test results back. Waiting for fields to dry because I surely would get stuck again doing the heavy fertilizer wagon now! And rain is predicted for the next few days. With luck, my “first cutting” hay will be ready in August, done between other folks cutting dates. It won’t be seedy or tough, because the plants never got to that stage before being mowed.

I sure don’t want to get haying equipmemt, but we might need to if no hay guys will do it up on time. I have seen mini balers, might be an option as we get older. Easier to throw than 60+ pound bales! Just no room for more equipment to be stored inside.

As mentioned, we can just enjoy riding or driving the horses on the mowed fields, even if we don’t get a crop off it.

[NancyM]

With 25 acres of hay fields, I would be considering getting your own low cost equipment. You probably already have a tractor for farm use? You would only need a mower, rake and baler. These can be purchased second hand, if you look around, and don’t need to be super expensive. Then you can do what you like, when you like, with your fields.

Our first cut hay is brilliant, horses eat it greedily! Second cut is lighter, softer. We only get two cuts, and since we live at elevation, we are not yet ready to do our first cut, it will be a couple weeks yet. First cut hay should be nice for horses, if made correctly.

We have two old small square balers, both bought locally, second hand. Paid $1500 for one (bought it when we first moved here 10 years ago and NEEDED a baler right away, sellers had not cared for it well, but we have fixed it and it works well now)), and $500 for the other (got lucky with this one- just bought it two years ago from an old guy who had a 6 acre hay field- very old but hardly any use- new condition). These old balers are around, and able to be fixed to make them work just fine for a small private hay farm.

Again, older mowers that are NOT discbines may be suitable for you, if your crop is light. We bought one for $3000 and used it for a few years before replacing it with a discbine, because our crop got heavier with taking care of the fields. Sold the old mower for $2500 trade in value on the new one after using it for 5 years. But we have alfalfa, which makes it heavier. We love our discbine, and it was necessary for us, but an older mower can work for you too, just slower. Cheap to buy now because bigger farms all use discbines now. Older ride on swathers are nice, if you can find one.

Older rakes or tedders are also available, not expensive. Hey, we have one we can sell you! (no guarantee on how much longer it will work though). We have to buy a new one this year.

The great thing about buying older farming equipment is that it doesn’t really lose it’s value. It is already fully depreciated. You can sell it to someone much like yourself if you want to, probably for about the same $ that you bought it for. The big, commercial hay farms require the new, state of the art equipment. Small, private farms get the cast offs, which is OK. You do need to understand mechanical repair to be able to use this sort of equipment, but some people are quite good at this job, and get better with experience.

I love making our own hay. The hubby loves selling our excess. We have about 45 acres of hay fields We bought hay from dealers for the first 50 years of my life, and it was always a problem, a worry, expensive and often crap. It’s great knowing exactly what is in your hay, what went into each bale. Growing the grass, taking care of the fields. I love seeing it in the barn. It is the best hay I’ve seen, because we make it like that. I love sitting on the tractor, I turn and bale. Hubby cuts and bales. I pick up some of the smaller grass fields by hand. The main crop of alfalfa/grass gets partially round baled, and some small squares which we sell. We have a bale wagon (which came over on the ark) for these sale small square bales which go into our hay barn. The small square grass bales go for my own use for my grass only horses (hard to get grass hay here unless we make it ourselves). Our hay is so outstanding that I no longer feed grain, only supply a mineral/salt block with the hay. So much better for horses to be fed naturally. I shudder at the thought of manufactured feeds, and what may or may not go into them.