Hacking through suburbia

[clanter]

@Sister7

so the records show the road ending half way through the development even though the full road has been built.

There was a street proposed that went along our northern property line, we have the center property of this proposed street. I never fought it but did tell the city that I was considering to donate that specific track to the Audubon Society for an urban bird sanctuary, they could fight with them over the land. Street proposal was dropped.

The city I live in has a continued history of horses in the city, goes back to its foundation. Some residents do ride their horses on the streets hacking to the green spaces and connecting trails . It is expected for the riders to clean up behind their horses Just As Dog Owners are expected to pickup their dog’s poop.

The biggest issue we have is developers or prospect buyers stopping by wanting to buy a piece of the country in the city, usually I can not cut the front yard without some one stopping to ask if we were interested in selling.

[punchy]

If you are banking on this 800-acre park as your riding place, I would contact some of the local horse people who ride there to make sure that the park plans to stay an 800-acre park with horse trails after the 400 houses are built.

[JanM]

I bet the first complaints will start over the smell from manure, every fly near that subdivision will be blamed on you. I’m guessing the half of the access road owned by the HOA and developer will get blocked immediately. You will have to double fence your entire property, with no trespassing signs at the local legally required distance. People will not respect it either. Your insurance agent will not be happy, and may not cover you any longer.

[red_mares]

My mother used to ride through the streets of Philly. I’d worry less about the horses and more about the neighbors. Have a field next to the road and your horses won’t care about cars. I don’t think Saddlebreds or Hackneys are any less flighty than TBs and they can deal with cars.

[Sister7]

The park is owned by the county and has been designated as a “heritage” park for nature conservation and passive recreational activities. It has the best chance of any land in the county to remain open space 100 years from now, but obviously nothing is ever guaranteed.

[OverandOnward]

@red_mares

Have a field next to the road and your horses won’t care about cars.

Have a field next to the road and have locals feeding your horses treats through the fence. Climbing through to feed, pet, even try to ride the horses. And other locals calling animal control claiming they see ‘neglect’.

And maybe every few years a local teenage psychopath will try out their new gun on the horses, from the road, after midnight.

The insurance company may even call them an “attractive nuisance” (an official insurance term), like a swimming pool, that encourages randoms from over the fence to want to invade and make use, then get hurt, then sue. Or their heirs sue.

See the thread “Can you take me riding?” re random people insisting on wanting to ride their friend’s horses. Something about horses makes people want to claim them for their own purposes. It’s seriously better not to have horses visible from the road.

[beowulf]

I think my experience may be germane to you OP. I enjoyed a huge network (500+ acres of mixed public and private) of trails for about 20 years. About 5 years in, part of the network was sold and developed and added about two hundred houses in a boutique subdivision. I made do by riding through the subdivision’s “bottom” cul de sac. People understood why I was doing it, as the cul de sac was set adjacent to conservation land. For the most part people were very neighborly but I always picked up manure on any pavement. Some people weren’t happy with me riding through the neighborhood “they paid taxes on” even though I literally lived up the road. There were many loose dogs over the years. Some risky encounters with bikes, quads, and once a whole track team. The kids loved the horses and I got a lot of lovely exposure for all my OTTBs.

About five years ago this changed. All it takes is one person, as said above. Unfortunately in my situation, the first “leg” of the trail network is privately owned - and I’ve totally lost all access to some gorgeous state / public trails. It has completely changed my joy in riding. More than half the trails I used to ride are gone. Half of it is now a massive parking lot for a strip mall, and the other half is still privately owned but no longer available to me due to a falling out with the land owner and another neighbor.

It might seem these trails are permanent now, but I would not buy a place contingent on trail access. I’ve seen too much development and change moves fast when housing is on the line.

[SharonA1]

If it’s otherwise the perfect property, and you’re trying to find some balance between a spouse’s needs and your own, I might still buy the property. If it turns out to not work for you in a few years, at least it will likely go up in value even if it loses trails access (though would probably be developed. Sigh.)

I am curious about an 800-acre park that does not have any parking areas. No wide shoulders on the access roads or dirt parking lots tucked in there somewhere? Another potential option, IF you have access to a friend’s or a hired trailer, is to have someone drop you off at the park, and then come back for you at an agreed time. It’s not ideal and will probably have you buying your own trailer pretty soon, but it’s one short-term solution.

You mentioned a Eurotrailer; as the former owner of a much, much, much-beloved Brenderup Solo, I think a good Eurotrailer is fantastic. But a simple stock trailer might be equally easy to pull, and more cost-effective. And good for hauling other stuff, too, which can be helpful for spouses, and spouse’s friends.

[fivestrideline]

I would not count on maintaining access to those trails - having ridden through neighborhoods and on dirt roads with decent traffic, it’s the neighbors complaining to the cops and the HOA “owning” some of the road that is going to get you.

You might actually have more luck petitioning for a parking lot in the park to access the horse trails - it may take some creative fundraising and talking to the right people, but that would be far more likely to happen IMO.

All said and done, I wouldn’t buy this place if the trails were the biggest draw - does the property have everything else you want and space to ride on your own land? If not, no go.

[trubandloki]

How/where do others access this park?

How did a developer buy the road access to the park if that was part of the park?

It might be worth checking with the town who approved the subdivision if there was anything written into their approval about them maintaining access to the park.

I personally would not find it weird to ride thru a subdivision to get to an access point. The down side has already been listed, it only takes on suburban grumpy person to make your access go away or become miserable.

[Angela_Freda]

I’d try to attend the planning board meetings to get more details

[OverandOnward]

Good idea.

Every city/town/community has a planning outline. Sometimes it is fairly detailed. Very probably you can find it on the city-government website, although you may have to search.

You can call the city offices that are probably called Planning & Zoning or Development Services and they will help direct you to these documents. If you get someone on the phone who doesn’t know, keep asking and trying other departments. Someone will know what you are asking about.

They are general outlines, and things change, so they may not be exactly what will happen in the future. But they can show what the planners were thinking at the time they were made, at least.

That also covers things such as road widenings and new stoplights at intersections. That can tell a great deal about what may be coming for a particular property or part of town.

And do some internet searches for past news coverage of changes to the park and community.

Also there are likely people in the immediate community who keep up with these things and go to city planning meetings. If you can find them, they may be able to share even more about the politics concerning these things.

[Angela_Freda]

I’m nosy, so I’d also look into the developer and their primaries and any connections they have.

[2DogsFarm]

Agree if trails & the park are the biggest draw, I’d pass as it’s possible, even likely, that could change.
My area is still semi-rural, but every year sees a little more encroachment on small & even sizeable acreages.
15+yrs ago Zoning was passed so anything under 10ac could not be subdivided.
I’m surrounded by neighbors who don’t meet the criteria to interest a developer, but I bet if I checked now that zoning may have changed.
Less than 2mi North of me there are 2 developments new as of late last year.
First one is by a company that puts up rental single family & townhomes - 176 units planned for this location.
It’s a national company called Canvas.
About 10 houses have been framed already & they’re squeezed pretty close together.
Abutting this is a 2nd development that doesn’t say how many units, but signage indicates Single Family houses.
There are 4 existing homes that are now surrounded in back by a PVC perimeter fence where their backyards/acres were.
None have horses, but if they did the Citiots would undoubtedly be way too close for my liking.
My farm sits at the intersection of two 2-lane roads that are seeing an increase in traffic.
A 300±bed hospital has just opened about a mile tfrom the intersection of the N/S one & a busy State Rd that leads to the interstate.
Add that traffic, including the blue “H” sign now posted on the road so ambulances are becoming more frequent on it.
There are no shoulders on the smaller roads, just 4’ ditches either side.
When I first moved here I rode my horse on the E/W road & even drove my mini briefly on that & the N/S one.
Now? I wouldn’t dare.

[Equibrit]

400 houses would be a dealbreaker for me.

[pony_grandma]

Not so long ago a property was subdivided across the road from a local dairy farm that has been farmed for the past century or 2.First thing they did was start the objections to it’s existence. Even the mooing sounds. Maybe the farmer should have objected to their constant mowing and lawn chemicals.

[beowulf]

On the plus side – a 400-house development would seriously offset one’s taxes if all built within a few year time period. That’s not a small development to hit the budget. Generally speaking when this happens, the tax rate goes down as the corresponding tax value significantly increases. Meaning your[g] slice of the pie gets a little smaller. I’d want to know if there was a split tax rate (residential v commercial/industrial) in your community.

[OverandOnward]

Stand firm on those rural properties. Being surrounded by suburbia may not be all bad. Lots of people and kids who want to ride and learn about horses, and there this property will be, so accessible. Maybe the day of the lesson stable has finally returned !!!

[clanter]

@OverandOnward

Every city/town/community has a planning outline

Used be referred to as a Master Plan, today that has been change to a Comprehensive Plan

In my state an incorporated community must have a Comprehensive Plan that outlines its intended future, and actually must follow that intent, they can not pass an ordinance that is contrary to the intent of the Comprehensive Plan.

When I was on the Planning & Zoning board for my city we revised the city’s Comprehensive Plan to include the aspects of equine ownership within the community as a foundation of the city’s intent. These rights remain today.

[clanter]

@beowulf

Generally speaking when this happens, the tax rate goes down as the corresponding tax value significantly increases.

I have not seen that here as the city manager can spend every dime and more then cry for more. They just more more people that increases their kingdom.

I had to point out in a city counsel meeting that with an annual city budget of just under $9M which they were including a property tax rate increase of a few mills that the city has just a few thousand dollars less than $30 Million dollars in the bank.