Harness Racing Question : Dan Patch's dam Zelica "Regulation cart"?

Hi everyone,
I am watching the 1949 movie “The Great Dan Patch” on Amazon Prime. I know absolutely nothing about harness racing. Except that it 's incredible how they can go so fast and not break into a canter (at least most of the time).

During the movie and I am sure many of you may know this already. They put Dan Patch’s dam Zelica into her first race (heat). One of the barns grooms freaks out when he notices that he hooked her up to the wrong cart. He screams she is hooked to a regulation cart it will cut her!!! He runs towards the track and meets up with the owner. Tells him that she is hooked to a regulation cart, and it will hit her in the turns. Well, she won the heat and after the race was pouring blood on her right hind leg. The driver said, “she must of put it right through the spokes, but kept on going without taking a lame step. I never knew she had done it or was hurt.” It ended her career with a torn tendon. (so they say in the movie).

I am truly confused by this. What exactly is a regulation cart? What is the difference and what would the need for it be if it would injure the horse? I have searched Google for thirty minutes and couldn’t find anything about it.

Can anyone shed any light on this?

Made me start thinking if the groom hadn’t hooked her up to the wrong cart, Dan Patch probably wouldn’t have been born. At least not until moms racing career was over. Both dam and sire passed in 1917.

I did learn that the horse that played Dan Patch in the movie is VISALIA ABBE who had some of the same breeding and looked like him.

Not sure what the standards were for race bikes back then but they were narrower than they were by the 30s and additionally, they were higher and you hooked much closer but a horse would have to go damnedably wide to put a hind foot though a wheel. More commonly, they would hit the frame with a hock. I am not finding much info on the mare so far. not even anything to indicate she raced; remember, back then was the beginning of the bicycle tires and many raced to a wagon rather than a sulky.
Zelica did live to a fairly ripe old age - she was foaled in 1891 and had at least 3 other foals and Joe Patchen was a few years older than she was.

If I can find more info, will add it

.

There is something here about Zelica and a torn tendon–
http://horsehints.org/DanPatch.htm

I don’t know how reliable the info is – the author writes both “Joe Patchen” and “Joe Patches” so how careful is she about the rest of what she writes? She says Dan Patch “ran” against running horses – whereas in fact he would have paced.

This refers to Zelica’s injury, says she was bred for trotting but preferred the pace (could that have contributed to her injury if the cart was a trotting cart and she was pacing?) –
https://books.google.com/books?id=Iq8odoc_AHMC&pg=PA40&lpg=PA40&dq=zelica+mare&source=bl&ots=pCVghSor_A&sig=mDlInJUxtz5QlGz7WBj4vZsBcRs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiFq6zImfTOAhXB4CYKHQYbBBsQ6AEILTAD#v=onepage&q=zelica%20mare&f=false

More really cool info here:
https://books.google.com/books?id=bkZfBgAAQBAJ&pg=PT51&lpg=PT51&dq=zelica+mare&source=bl&ots=2wLSzemTuB&sig=16iPEiT0xvp63p2FQyPFZEw6fC8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPhrG7lvTOAhVCwiYKHalRD30Q6AEIQjAH#v=onepage&q=zelica%20mare&f=false

https://www.amazon.com/Crazy-Good-Story-Famous-America/dp/0743291786

While I know nothing about harness racing, I just read this book about Dan Patch this summer and it was very good! I actually don’t remember Zelica racing at all, I think she was pretty sickly when bought? I’ll have to check.

[QUOTE=Anonymoose;8828731]
There is something here about Zelica and a torn tendon–
http://horsehints.org/DanPatch.htm

I don’t know how reliable the info is – the author writes both “Joe Patchen” and “Joe Patches” so how careful is she about the rest of what she writes? She says Dan Patch “ran” against running horses – whereas in fact he would have paced.

This refers to Zelica’s injury, says she was bred for trotting but preferred the pace (could that have contributed to her injury if the cart was a trotting cart and she was pacing?) –
https://books.google.com/books?id=Iq8odoc_AHMC&pg=PA40&lpg=PA40&dq=zelica+mare&source=bl&ots=pCVghSor_A&sig=mDlInJUxtz5QlGz7WBj4vZsBcRs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiFq6zImfTOAhXB4CYKHQYbBBsQ6AEILTAD#v=onepage&q=zelica%20mare&f=false

More really cool info here:
https://books.google.com/books?id=bkZfBgAAQBAJ&pg=PT51&lpg=PT51&dq=zelica+mare&source=bl&ots=2wLSzemTuB&sig=16iPEiT0xvp63p2FQyPFZEw6fC8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPhrG7lvTOAhVCwiYKHalRD30Q6AEIQjAH#v=onepage&q=zelica%20mare&f=false[/QUOTE]

Dan Patch and Zelica were both pacers. Dan did speed races against running horses because no other trotter or pacer could keep up with him. They did speak about that quite a bit in the movie.

Zelica raced one time at the track at Oxford. She raced one heat and won. That was when she tore her tendon. They said in the movie it was a pretty bad injury and she would never race again.
Regarding heats, from what I understand they run two heats. Whoever are the top horses of those heats gets to race in the actual race. Zelica only won one heat, since she couldn’t continue.

This explains a bit more about that: http://www.standardbredcanada.ca/blog/deanhoffman/is-there-still-a-role-heat-racing-sport.html

Apparently, it is no longer done. Thank goodness!

I just found an article where they show a still from the movie just after Zelica raced in the first heat and won. It is the third photo on the page. You can see she has her right hind leg lifted and blood is pouring from it. They called it a regulation bike.
https://www.horsenation.com/2014/09/05/friday-flicks-the-great-dan-patch/

If you have Amazon Prime you can watch the movie here: https://www.amazon.com/Great-Dan-Patch-Dennis-OKeefe/dp/B01EZ9DOYU/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1472972054&sr=8-5&keywords=dan+patch

The part showing the bikes/carts begins at 23:12.

I appreciate everyone looking into this. I cannot believe their isn’t much about Zelica and her first race. She was super fast and was going to make a great race horse, until the accident.

There was and still is no difference between bikes used for trotters and pacers, all the same. As to the article on the one link, full of spelling errors and mostly plagerised from assorted sources; the sire is Joe Patchen and he was also a pacer. The use of running horses is for time trials and they were disallowed in that era - the horse doing the time trial is hooked as if for a race, and warmed up the same way, then the running horses are prompters, not competitors; youtube has many time trials listed, the most famous being Niatross.

There are still a few heat races but they are far and few between now. The first two races were generally eliminations and the third, and sometimes fourth were the finals. The Hambletonian was done in heats until just a few years ago and even certain overnight events were done in heats, depending on entries into that particular class.

Finally got that picture from the movie to load…and that is a 1940s bike not something from the turn of the century; those were very high, seat up enough that the driver’s shoulders were well above the horse’s back end. Even so, she must have hit something more solid, like part of the frame than a bicycle wheel to do a whack of damage and the bike would be ‘lame’ as well if a horse put a foot through the wheel.

[QUOTE=sk_pacer;8829428]
There was and still is no difference between bikes used for trotters and pacers, all the same. As to the article on the one link, full of spelling errors and mostly plagerised from assorted sources; the sire is Joe Patchen and he was also a pacer. The use of running horses is for time trials and they were disallowed in that era - the horse doing the time trial is hooked as if for a race, and warmed up the same way, then the running horses are prompters, not competitors; youtube has many time trials listed, the most famous being Niatross.

There are still a few heat races but they are far and few between now. The first two races were generally eliminations and the third, and sometimes fourth were the finals. The Hambletonian was done in heats until just a few years ago and even certain overnight events were done in heats, depending on entries into that particular class.

Finally got that picture from the movie to load…and that is a 1940s bike not something from the turn of the century; those were very high, seat up enough that the driver’s shoulders were well above the horse’s back end. Even so, she must have hit something more solid, like part of the frame than a bicycle wheel to do a whack of damage and the bike would be ‘lame’ as well if a horse put a foot through the wheel.[/QUOTE]

Thank you for the information. I couldn’t understand why the barn worker or groom kept saying, “I hooked her up to the wrong one. She’s using a regulation bike!”
Of course, the movie was made in the 40s so that would explain the type of cart in the photo. That picture was from the film. We also know by watching horse movies today, they are not always exactly correct.

HA! You noticed all the spelling and grammar issues too on that link! It was awful. Must have been a kid writing it. (let’s hope).

Yes, the use of the running horses was just a time trial to show the big crowds how fast Dan Patch was. They kept repeating in the movie that no horse of that time could beat him in a race. So they had to use running horses to show how fast he was. That part was being narrated like one of the very old classroom films. Although they didn’t or at least, I don’t recall them saying they were called time trials. I had never seen that done before, but understand why they did it in his case. The crowds came in droves and wanted to see Dan Patch who was getting paraded around the nation by his new owner like a roadside attraction. One funny part was people selling horseshoes that were said to have been worn by Dan Patch. They said, “Fast-talking horsemen got money for old horseshoes that supposed to have come from a hoof of the Great Dan Patch. If he had worn a 1/10th of them, he would have been a centipede!” LOL :applause:

I just read that the Hambletonian is back doing heats again since 2013. It is just awful. <shakes head>

I will take a look at Youtube; I didn’t think of doing that. I just did a search for Niatross and found this, http://www.niatross.com/single-g/
Such a shame so many great horses are forgotten.

My husband bets online on harness racing and wins all the time. I bet and lose eight times out of 10 on the thoroughbreds. He is the same with the thoroughbreds too. I am keeping my day job. :slight_smile:

Thank you for all the information. It was truly helpful.

Why is it awful that the Hambletonian, or other races, are doing heats?

My mother worked as a groom on harness tracks back in the day, aside from having to clean all the harness multiple times, she never mentioned or alluded to anything that would indicate it was “just awful” for anyone but the grooms. Those horses are fit, fit, fit and not made of porcelain.

[QUOTE=red mares;8834306]
Why is it awful that the Hambletonian, or other races, are doing heats?

My mother worked as a groom on harness tracks back in the day, aside from having to clean all the harness multiple times, she never mentioned or alluded to anything that would indicate it was “just awful” for anyone but the grooms. Those horses are fit, fit, fit and not made of porcelain.[/QUOTE]

Agree 100%. I was thrilled when they switched back to heats for the Hambletonian. This years’ winner of the Hambo (first week of August) went on to win the Yonkers Trot a week or so ago, so he is certainly just fine. The Little Brown Jug is still heats. Now, one thing I believe they have done away with is the need to win at least 2 heats to be declared the winner. This would sometimes lead to 3+ heats which would get a bit excessive, I’d imagine.

I don’t see anything wrong with going heats for major stakes and if they keep it to elimination heats and the final, no problem but sometimes, the race card would take many hours to complete under the old system…recall one race eons ago that took 6 heats to declare a winner; was just a kid so don’t ask what race it was, all i can say it was a local stake race. The Jug and many others run elimination races prior to get down to the final fields for the big day…that is generally sixteen head.

Years ago, just for single heat races we would do three warmup trips before the race, first trip was jog and a 45 shot, second trip around 25. and the last was within 10 seconds of what the race was expected to go…lots of work, but those horses were tough.

I don’t see anything wrong with going heats for major stakes and if they keep it to elimination heats and the final, no problem but sometimes, the race card would take many hours to complete under the old system…recall one race eons ago that took 6 heats to declare a winner; was just a kid so don’t ask what race it was, all i can say it was a local stake race. The Jug and many others run elimination races prior to get down to the final fields for the big day…that is generally sixteen head.

Years ago, just for single heat races we would do three warmup trips before the race, first trip was jog and a 45 shot, second trip around 25. and the last was within 10 seconds of what the race was expected to go…lots of work, but those horses were tough.