I’m pretty much expecting that I could never afford it. But I do have a cleared slight gradual grade ‘ravine’ area. I thought perhaps, I might get the retaining area at the Lower end put in, and just ‘over time’ get fill dirt to build up to the base level needed and put the arena in in stages. It may be much more of a larger ‘round pen’ do to useable space, but it is an area unused otherwise…
When I lived in IN, I had a retaining wall built at one corner of my outdoor arena to deal with the change in slope. It’s quite a project to do one properly. The best thing for you to do is call a local excavator and ask for a quote. It doesn’t obligate you in any way, and then you’ll know if it’s something worth continuing to think about.
th
Be careful of your local building ordinances. Above a certain height, the retaining walls might be required to be designed and approved by a registered engineer or such. Any retaining wall failure is pretty messy and could be dangerous.
clanter, that is amazing! If you know of any ‘particulars’ in that approach, I’d love to learn more! One thing would be: as it would involve a ‘drop off’, not sure how I’d fence that… Hoss…good idea for me to be aware of…thank you. Melissa, thanks! I know the ‘estimates’ will be all over the map, but yeah, I have to start somewhere. 
Yes, my arena is built into a small hill. We put in a retaining wall almost 100 feet long. It took a while, but it turned out really well and the top of the wall is covered in plantings and small trees. We used railroad ties that we placed on top of a concrete foundation; drainage, filter cloth, and gravel was used behind the wall and then backfilled with dirt.
The ring is about 100x200.
Drainage is critical.
For some reason I’m thinking anything over 4’ here has to be engineered. But I could be wrong. Agree with checking codes.
Cement bag walls are not cheaper than forming and pouring last I checked. There is a pattern and you stab rebar in there too–I don’t know the exact specifics. Generally, it is favored for remote areas the cement truck can’t reach. Usually bulk (trucked) cement is going to be cheaper than bagged.
How tall are you talking?
We did a retaining wall for our arena, as we live on a hill and the only way to get a large enough level area for the ring was to cut into the hill somewhat. Ours is poured concrete, 4’ tall on the top side (so holding the hill above the arena) and then another 4’ wall on the bottom side (so holding the arena up). At the time, we explored several options, including RR ties and concrete blocks, etc. but the poured wall was the “cheapest” option once you threw in the labor component, since we were not doing the work ourselves.
It isn’t the most attractive thing in the world, this expanse of gray, but it works. It also significantly increased the cost of the arena. I always say smart people don’t buy land like ours and try to make horse property out of it.
We did not have to bring in any dirt to fill with, but used what was here. That was part of what determined the shape and size of my arena, trying to use what we had and only do 4’ high walls (taller gets into a more extensive permitting and engineering requirement and adds $$$). Then lots of gravel, for access road, drains, and base.
this would mostly? involve retaining wall at the low end…as its a gradual slope off. So, yes, height could be an issue. I am awaiting the ‘siting’ the initial contractor ran to at least give me an idea of wall height and back fill amt. needed.
I do expect it to be much more ridiculous than beneficial. and, yes, I think some underneath pipe/culverts would be needed for the ‘natural’ erosion dip/ditch areas anyway…but it was an area it could ‘work’ in IF affordable.
[QUOTE=ayrabz;8025249]
clanter, that is amazing! If you know of any ‘particulars’ in that approach, I’d love to learn more!
I will dig up the Corps of Engineers specs and procedures for you
Do you need a wall?
Assuming you can get the required amount of fill dirt there and assuming you can make a stable arena base from that fill, and assuming you can set up drainage so your arena does not wash away what does a retaining wall get you?
Unless there is some reason it has to end in a vertical(ish) wall having a more gradual drop off made of just graded dirt is only going to cost you 2 or 3 more truck loads of fill, which is bound to be cheaper than a wall. It will still likely need some drainage effort put in to preserve it if nature cut a ravine previously, but so would a wall.
tangled…I believe just the nature of the slope would indeed require a wall.
I had a sloped ravine also. I rented a skid loader, dug out the high side and moved that dirt to the low side. Luckily they were redoing culverts in my area so I got at least 100 loads of fill free. A load surprisingly doesn’t fill much.
I built the wall on the high corner it is about 5’ high and slopes down the length of the arena at about 165’
Then it slopes to the gate maybe 30’ down the short side.
I used railroad ties, drilled holes and pounded rebar into two ties at a time. Each row was staggered back an inch approx. used drainage pipe and clean rock behind.
Also had long rods going back into the ground to hold the wall up. Cement was at the back of each rod to hold in place.
It cost me about 5k for just the material.
If I had to pay for fill that would have been another 7500.00 at a minimum.
[QUOTE=China Doll;8027474]
I had a sloped ravine also. I rented a skid loader, dug out the high side and moved that dirt to the low side. Luckily they were redoing culverts in my area so I got at least 100 loads of fill free. A load surprisingly doesn’t fill much.
I built the wall on the high corner it is about 5’ high and slopes down the length of the arena at about 165’
Then it slopes to the gate maybe 30’ down the short side.
I used railroad ties, drilled holes and pounded rebar into two ties at a time. Each row was staggered back an inch approx. used drainage pipe and clean rock behind.
Also had long rods going back into the ground to hold the wall up. Cement was at the back of each rod to hold in place.
It cost me about 5k for just the material.
If I had to pay for fill that would have been another 7500.00 at a minimum.[/QUOTE]
Do you have previous earth-moving skills? How many days did you have to rent the skid for and how did you know how big of a skid to get? Just curious.
I don’t have a tractor and am planning to rent a skid to move poop piles, clean the dry lot this spring, and pull up old fence posts. I have a friend who’s husband has mad skid skills, and I’m wondering if he would be able to do some earth moving for me for my arena (which is basically flat, but drops off a bit too fast on each side, so I’m thinking cut down the middle mound).
[QUOTE=clanter;8024956]
th[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I don’t know where that was done, but the first thing I thought of was that you have to have drainage plans in it, too, because of the swamp/mosquito pool this particular walll has created. Besides something along the lines of french drains in the wall, plus the reinforcement inside the earth of the retained area, there has to be drainage at the foot of the wall leading water away from the lower area correctly.
For example, if you had wetlands at the bottom already, not installing the proper drainage could cost you thousands to correct. You really need quotes and from the proper engineers types, not just the guy next door.
[QUOTE=TrotTrotPumpkn;8027820]
Do you have previous earth-moving skills? How many days did you have to rent the skid for and how did you know how big of a skid to get? Just curious.
I don’t have a tractor and am planning to rent a skid to move poop piles, clean the dry lot this spring, and pull up old fence posts. I have a friend who’s husband has mad skid skills, and I’m wondering if he would be able to do some earth moving for me for my arena (which is basically flat, but drops off a bit too fast on each side, so I’m thinking cut down the middle mound).[/QUOTE] I did not have any previous skills. I am a female and above average in handiness. I rented a average size I would guess. Not big but not the smallest.
I rented it for a weekend.
I got a quote for 5k to move the dirt. I did it for about 300.00
I moved all the fill with my 30 hp new holland tractor.
I took this picture yesterday for you.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10999879_10205134903926644_9066534787248560334_n.jpg?oh=ce2ebb6fa751f3960b7b3ef7f6644ef6&oe=557A5A0D&gda=1435748200_d6e85d1ba27389e8e4904854bdf9889d
This is a retaining wall from railroad ties, installed about 15 - 20 years ago. The rr ties are staggered, with about 1 - 2 inches offset as they go up. There are also “deadman” ties interspersed. You can barely see the “deadman” ties, but they are ties that go perpendicular to the run of the wall, back into the dirt before it was backfilled. The ties are spiked together, done by a strong worker with a sledgehammer. The backfill is rocks at the lowest, then gravel, then base.
The ties have held up fairly well, but there has been some rotting. It is extremely difficult to fix this – I have tried cutting out the bad parts, cutting a 6x6 to fit, and sledgehammering the fix piece in, but it is a lot of work. As you can see, my better solution is to pile rocks against the retaining wall. I am constantly picking up rocks on my property, so this will be an ongoing process. But it does solve the problem of the deteriorating parts of the retaining wall.
As you can see to some extent, the arena on that side is grass, with a sand path along the perimeter. When I built the arena in the late '90’s, I spent a lot of money on base, packed it, and let it bake one summer in the Texas sun before adding sand. So it drains really well. During a hard rain, I can see water pour out from between the ties, which I suppose is a good thing. But I am sure that is what contributed to the rotting.
If I had it to do over, I would do the same thing. It was fairly cheap and drains well. But as I said, I now like that I have a convenient place to pile rocks. If I did not want to pile rocks there, I would have a big problem with the rotting ties.
I have a 5’ high retaining wall in my jump ring. The dirt taken out on the high side was added to the low side to create a 250 x 250 ring.
Any time you move dirt, you need to be aware of the slope/crowning of the new ring. The dirt cannot be flat or you will end up with mini-lakes of water when it rains. You also need to let everything settle for several months before adding in footing.
If I understood you, your plan is to put in a retaining wall and then backfill it over time? SCARY! I can just imagine a loose horse falling into and getting stuck in there.
My wall was built with railroad ties. Part of it had to be taken down and rebuilt because not enough “sleepers” were built into the wall at first.
The project ended up costing 3x the initial estimates. Half way through I realized I was in trouble, but by then I had no where to ride unless I kept going.
Thank you all! … Nines, that was very kind of you to take the pix! It looks like a great job. Kate: totally correct, I will have to be very sure this is even allowed because of the proximity of the RPA and the Chesapeake Bay Act. Drainage: Yes, IF it even can be done there is no doubt it will indeed have to have engineered drainage and most likely? even culvert under …its a natural ‘bowl’ of an area sloping from the grade to the creek …China, I would LOVE to see your pix too? And, Lord H…this is a ravine area on the property that is not in the useable /travelled horse area. the ‘idea’ was to use a ‘semi circle’ or if I go rectangular arena then at least a ‘U’ shaped half rectangle ‘retaining wall’that would have a fence on top of the area that would be ‘up in the air…’…to get that paid for first, and any drainage pipes/plans if any would ‘go under’ and work bit by bit on the backfill, but that back fill would only be to ‘come to grade’ . I am sure that is confusing, but no, don’t envision a ‘pit’ or a drop off’ unprotected during that time, because there wouldn’t be I promise. I’ll have to get a pix of the area so you can see the ‘vision’
There’s 2 ways to go about getting “dirt moved around”. One is to hire a contractor and get a quote. The other is to hire an owner/operator and pay by the hour. The cost of which depends on the size of the equipment. There is usually an additional charge for getting the equipment to the site and is based on mileage from where it is located. A skilled operator can do amazing things in short order. A “part time” operator might just make a mess and take even more time cleaning up their mistakes. I have found hiring an owner/operator and telling them what you want done is much more cost effective. I got some outrageous quotes from some “contractors” and got the job done for a fraction.
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