huh. So, like a double-width longe whip or something? Do you put a carrot in the loop?
When i’m teaching (r+) ground driving i actually use a longe whip with a carrot tied on the end…But i do let the horse win the carrot fairly often, and when they grab it sometimes falls out. I would like to have a better delivery system. Would this work for that?
Not sure. The biggest difference between this and a normal lunge whip is that the shaft is much stiffer.
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Its very similar, if not the same, as a “pig stick”, which is exactly what it sounds like, used in handling swine. Good ones are not cheap.
Something that really irritates me is blaming every horse misbehavior on “ abuse”, like it behaves that way because it was abused. Well, maybe in some cases but maybe it was a victim of ignorance and never learned what it was supposed to do? Maybe its headshy because somebody whacked it upside the head, maybe its never been taught to accept movement around the face and sick of getting poked in the eye and banged in the teeth? Real NH would deal with that, not blame abuse and preach BS theory while waving a stick.
The horses that would not stand? Never been taught “whoa” means turn into a tree. Thats a real basic concept that needs to be mastered before doing anything else. Taught with simple, consistent repetition, not theoretical BS. No sticks or flags or getting excited when they move, just quiet repetition.
Years ago, was showing at a venue that was hosting a PP sideshow in another arena. Our stalls were right next to the PP demo horses. Show horses were not the only ones being LTD late at night or being taken “ behind the barn” for an “attitude adjustment”. And the middle aged groupies…OMG. Cult of personality for sure.
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We have a boarder like this.
Example: Her horse is extremely stall aggressive because she was abused.
No, lady. It’s more likely that no one ever disciplined the horse for acting like a possessive twat in the stall, and instead they retreated which rewarded the behavior.
But she continues to tell everyone this, despite the fact that she knows nothing of the mare’s history.
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Thank you for the link endlessclimb 
Don’t think this will work for me, it’s too short. Was so funny reading the blurb on it…so many catch-phrases. When people do insider-talk it is so strange… “savvy string”? long body… i call it long arms when i free longe, i think he copied me.
That alone is a HUGE turn-off!
yeah, that’s what it looks like.
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Tik Maynard (whom I have quarts of respect for) uses NH techniques, but he’s also very much still involved with competition/riding horses, and may simply be one of those people IMHO who is very in tune with horse language. I rode in one of of his clinics years ago, and also audited one.
Mainly because I was so impressed by Tik, I went to a NH clinic at a local/therapeutic barn and I thought I was on Mars. First of all, it was about a billion degrees and the horses were (understandably) rather listless and easily fatigued, but the trainer kept attributing all sorts of behaviors from being overheated to psychological phenomenon. It literally took a half hour for the trainer to explain how to tighten a girth properly.
Most of the people at the clinic were timid middle-aged women who, like you all have said, were people who were over-horsed/ under-fit (themselves) and who had long explanations for why they didn’t ride at much more than a walk in a round pen just yet. I’m a timid middle-aged woman myself, but the whole thing was just people getting very excited about their horses nudging balls and taking a step or two forward, without any real clear explanation I could get about why this was so exciting.
There was also one child whose parents had been persuaded to purchase a rescue horse from a NH trainer and had only had NH lessons. I am not a riding instructor, but I couldn’t help notice that the poor child rode with her toes nearly pointed down, was in a Western saddle, English bridle, and while she seemed pretty athletic, hadn’t really been taught the basics of just normal w/t steering. Again, all the horse’s behaviors were attributed to NH theory rather than just telling the kid in a straightforward way the basics you’d get at a first “normal” riding lesson.
I know this sounds like a weird analogy, but it reminded me of a number of acting and writing classes I’d taken where people did more talking about the process than actually doing it, and I think it’s very easy for people who are apt to over-think things to be taken in by this sort of stuff.
I don’t think all NH is like this, but with Tik, it was very obvious that everything he was doing had a goal (not necessarily a competitive goal, but a goal to improve behavior).
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I compare it to the “thousand yard stare,” which the dictionary defines as " vacant or unfocused gaze into the distance, seen as characteristic of a war-weary or traumatized soldier."
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And the Queen had Monty Roberts over for a command performance! Lol.
It goes beyond that though. It’s not a lifeless stare. It’s anger, frustration, pissy, unhappy.
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I spoke about this with liberty work too. This horse looks PISSED, to me. Maybe I’m an ignorant no-body though, as I’m not well versed in “liberty work” or traditional “natural horsemanship”.
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What does that have to do with anything ? I’m guessing you don’t actually know who the person I named was and just wanted to spout off
Yes, sometimes that, too, depending on the horse. 
Heres a question for you…
Hypothetical here
Say have a 10 year old QH gelding in a stall or pen 23 hours a day, I take it out to do NH games and groom him for about hour 3 times a week, dont ride much as Im scared of him and proudly feed him the same diet as a 3 year old stud colt training for the Derby. He’s getting very stall aggressive and will not stand for grooming or let me out the saddle and bridle on. Last week he be was spooking at the flag and refusing to walk beside me when led…and he bit me.
There is an NH clinic nearby but its $300 plus requiring purchasing clinicians latest, autographed book. Would it be worth it to solve his deteriorating manners? Please help me solve this.
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My point is that the multi-level pyramid marketing scheme on steroids known as “Natural Horsemanship” is a global phenomenon. The fact that some in Europe have used or dabbled in it does not validate the method or prove that it is necessary, better, or more effective. I don’t really care who the person is that you are talking about. The exception always proves the rule.
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That’s exactly what I consider NH. Not the marketing gimmick, not the chasing the horse around.
Using psychology of horse behavior, understanding, patience, and kindness along with science to train and handle your horse and bring them happiness and comfort in the work you are doing.
Tik is a fabulous example of this. Another person who I admire for this type of work is Featherlight Horsemanship on Instagram.
I spend a lot of time doing ground work and work at liberty with my mares and they love it. It’s a fun time spent together. Nothing is forced and it’s grown my relationship with each and every one of them.
My main event horse who I have struggled to create a relationship with over the years used to run away when I go to the field. Completely barrel me over on the ground. Never looked to me. Never cared about my existence at all.
Now she runs to me when I call her. Canters across the field. Is quiet for me to handle, looks to me for direction. Chooses to be with me when free. Waits for me at the fence every morning. Our relationship has completed changed and with that so has her happiness. She is quieter, easier to manage and looks better than ever. Thanks to “NH” and learning to understand horses better and how to train them.
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hahahahahahaha hope your mouth is enjoying the taste of your foot!
Wut
I loved Tik Maynard’s book, his refreshing candor and his honesty about his journey as a horseman. I would love to audit or attend a clinic of his.
One of the things I like best about Tik’s approach is that it wasn’t a slavish adherence to one guru or one method; he took what he thought was valuable and worked for him from a great number of horsemen. He didn’t disengage his own critical thinking and go all in with one practitioner. He also actually has working horses and competition horses, not just horses that do NH exercises or play NH games.
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There is a version of behavior “extinction“, where the human or animal performs the current version of reaction of choice to the greatest degree possible before determining that it is, in fact, not going to work. Behaviorist see those frequently, and it falls under the category of sometimes things getting worse before they get better. It is not the only way to extinguish the behavior however.
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Something that really irritates me is blaming every horse misbehavior on “ abuse”, like it behaves that way because it was abused. Well, maybe in some cases but maybe it was a victim of ignorance and never learned what it was supposed to do? Maybe its headshy because somebody whacked it upside the head, maybe its never been taught to accept movement around the face and sick of getting poked in the eye and banged in the teeth? Real NH would deal with that, not blame abuse and preach BS theory while waving a stick.
This was consistent with my experience and a major grievance I had with the program. No, I don’t know every detail of my horse’s history, but I know more than most. I was dismayed to hear this whole narrative about him being an abuse case. I mean, yes, he was definitely soured by someone/something along the way in his training, so I was willing to go along with it, if you give “abuse” a very loose interpretation. But at some point, it started to feel more like a ploy to lower any and all expectations for his training? And also a way to manipulate clients through their egos, too, like, “Aren’t you so great for rescuing this poor horse? He is so lucky he landed with you.”
It was just weird. I could never bring myself to drink the kool aid, even when it put me in a flattering light as some kind of abused horse savior. I mean, even true abuse/neglect cases can be transformed into solid citizens with skillful training, and my horse was neither! I was definitely not looking to congratulate myself over my horse’s deteriorating behavior based on the somewhat dubious claim that he was a rescue, because even if he were a rescue, I would want and expect better from/for him.
Anyway, like a few commenters mention, I have followed/watched/read/purchased or used free trials of programs from Tik Maynard, Featherlight Horsemanship, Tristan Tucker, and Warwick Schiller. It’s why I gravitated to this trainer in the first place, because she certainly sounded like she was practicing the same techniques and ideas. But whatever she was doing, and whatever her intentions, I think the problem is she just wasn’t getting through to my horse. I remember telling myself if she had even one horse, or could point me to a former client’s horse, that I could look at and say, “that’s where I want to be in 6 months,” I would stay. But I couldn’t find one, not in the barn, not on social media. Nothing but horses pushing around yoga balls and walking in a round pen if they were being ridden at all. 
I guess there is a niche for that type of trainer, who not only doesn’t shame you for not riding or competing, but who actually makes you feel like a superior horseman for doing neither. But I was not looking for that, and it didn’t do me or my horse any favors. I unfortunately can’t get my money or time back, but such is life. At least I can kvetch about it on the internet!
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