I have found two full siblings to my own gelding, and certainly there are some big similarities, but what’s curious are the differences from one to the next. I was so intrigued when my Google search came up with the videos, I thought it would be a very interesting topic. Anyone have a similar experience?
( I mean “full” as in by the same sire and out of the exact same mare, not just identical bloodlines)
Well, my filly’s full brother is a licensed stallion so he is easy to keep track of. Her older full sister is in California. She is the female version of him - same color, build, personality. The full sister is the milkman’s, solid bay with no white (mine and her brother are bucskin with chrome) and she is more sensitive/temperamental.
my gelding is a much stranger breeding, and I actually found a 3/4 sibling on Facebook for sale just today and it is uncanny how similar they are. Same walk, same canter, same head, same temperament. He is straight up dressage bred (Sempatico M x Dauphin - Feiner Stern) the sibling is Sempatico M x Cor de la Breyere but has Donnerhall on bottom so has jumper breeding further back. That said if you met them and the two were together you would absolutely know they were siblings. The resemblance in movement and personality is very strong. If I could afford the mare I would buy her because my gelding is unicorn status and I’d love to have two unicorns :lol:
My mare’s brother is Becky Holder’s Courageous Comet and the first time I watched him do a dressage test I was blown away, it was like watching Sophie with a grey suit on. They are very similar in the way they move and act and I have heard the same from other Comet Shine offspring. I hope when I start looking for her replacement down the road that I can find another with similar breeding because I love the rideability, competitiveness, and catlike movement she and her siblings bring to the table.
I had the opposite experience with my pony. He is the product of a Welsh mare and a Paint stallion and while it turned into an extremely athletic, cute pony once, his brother looked like three different horses slapped together. We passed on buying his brother as well. It is interesting to see how genetics play out in real life.
Would be awesome to see the photos/video links to the horses you guys mentioned - I find this topic fascinating!!
(I suppose I can start?!)
Mine: https://youtu.be/tnPt4zjKa3Y https://youtu.be/c3TzYH6d2iw
Full Sister: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBnM_D6NfZA
Full Brother #1: https://youtu.be/ftPKR21jVeo
Full Brother #2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftPKR21jVeo
They’re all Black with very little white, but size difference for sure and move differently behind.
Oh yeah. My horse has a full sibling, also a dressage horse, but I don’t think he’s competing any more (nor is mine, for that matter). Both are Arabian/Appaloosa, sired by the Arabian Aul Magic out of a Foundation bred Appaloosa mare. My horse is a chestnut with a snowflake blanket, hind socks, full blaze, some body roaning. His older brother is 17 hands and a chestnut leopard. Both good movers.
My mare is only 3, so I don’t have a lot of good quality video of her under saddle to show you. I would have to upload some of my gelding to compare him to his partial sibling, might get to it this weekend.
I do not have any pictures.
Straight Davenport Arabians, Oberon x Waddarlah. My colt was a sabino golden chestnut with flaxen mane and tail, high white, REALLY narrow up front, he looked sort of stretched out (really low knees and hocks, thin neck.)
His FULL BROTHERS, a few years older, were a dark bay, built like a tank, with almost no white on them.
His 1/2 sister by a straight Egyptian stallion, was at least a full hand taller, with more substance than my colt, but with the same long lines. She was a grey.
The Davenports are an EXTREMELY inbred/linebred breeding group, I do not think that there is a modern Davenport Arabian with an inbreeding co-efficient of less than 25%. I did inbreeding co-efficients for around 200 Davenports in the mid 1970s. One interesting thing I found was that the stallion *Hamrah was 25% of the ancestry of ALL the modern Davenport Arabians, and that was all through his daughters since none of his sons bred on into modern Arabians.
So you can get very different looking horses from the same sire and dam, from equally inbred horses.
I own two full Hanoverian siblings - Wild Dance x Donna Novella.
I bought the mare as a weanling and the gelding as a yearling. They are both lovely horses (in my completely biased opinion) but have clear differences in personality.
The gelding isn’t under saddle yet, so my comments are from handling him on the ground.
They are very similar movers and are both generally calm about new things. My mare is more sensitive and a bit spicier than my gelding, and this has been consistent since I first met both.
My mare is a total worker bee and is happiest when she is doing something. Based on current behavior, I’m expecting the gelding to be a bit lazier under saddle.
He’s very snuggly and loves scratches and treats. My mare likes her space and will frequently turn down treats if they don’t meet her standards.
If you saw them together you would likely guess they are closely related. I would say there are more similarities in their conformation and movement than their personalities.
squeeee, babies! I have nothing to contribute to this thread but they are CUTE! :love-struck:
Each of my mares has two older full siblings. I bought Ellie at 2 1/2, and got to ride her older sister. She and her sister are both very dressagey, while her brother is more huntery. I think Ellie is the spiciest personality and also most leggy, but all have great hind legs from their sire and great centers from their mom as well as great jumping form. Their gaits are also super rideable, which I appreciate!
Big sis:
https://goo.gl/images/HTq577
My connection is too slow to watch, but this should be big brother:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9OQVE_yX_H8
and Ellie:
https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net…ee&oe=5C69EA4C
I know JJ’s two full siblings and half sibling, and have ridden both full siblings. All are as sweet and people oriented as their dam was. The oldest (sister) tends to a tighter back and huge suspension. Middle (brother) has a much looser back but not as flashy movement. JJ is just the right mixture in the middle. She’s mellowest and bravest of the bunch, but they are all sensitive people pleasers who will easily come uphill, with really good hind end / legs. She actually has the best natural lengthening of all four of her dam’s offspring, I think. She also just has the nest brain I’ve ever known, including her siblings. She was born interested in all of us but totally zen about life.
I’m a breeder so I’ve produced full siblings. I’ve also owned full siblings (Clyde x tb crosses).s It truly is the Russian roulette. I’ve produced full siblings who in essence were very similar to each other but there were definite differences. Usually each successive offspring was an improvement of the one before. I’ve also owned full siblings that were very different which for me was a good thing. I guess in the end it’s like would I want the worst of the worst from each individual of the cross in it;s offspring, ie, could I handle it. If the answer was yes then I would breed and continue to breed that cross unless I ended up with a genetic mutation that was unacceptable or an individual that justified never repeating that cross. So far I would have to say that if I had an unlimited bank account I have one cross that I would repeat over and over and over… alas that will not be possible. Full siblings are never identical but if their best traits continue to repeat true well then you’ve just discovered the pot at the end of the rainbow if those traits are what you’re striving for.
I am FB friends with the owner of my boy’s full brother - I’m in New Zealand, and she’s in Australia. Different colours (I swear I have the only grey in the Weltmeyer line), but both have the same great work ethic, movement and temperament.
On the other hand, I bred two mares (Andalusian stallion, Thoroughbred mare) and they couldn’t have been more different. Layla was 15.1hh on a good day, weak bay colour. Amazing work ethic. Splash was a solid 16hh who everyone claimed was 16.3 (she had a height cert), beautiful dark bay with dapples and the shittiest work ethic ever.
Clearly that worked out to be a nice combination!
I am not aware of any full siblings to my gelding. I’m almost afraid to look. One is enough!
Full siblings, no. As far as I know, there are no full siblings to any of my three. I will say though, that I decided to purchase my three yo off of a half sibling out of the same dam. The sires were very different, but the dam tended to throw a very laid back, trainable, personable temperament. I was able to meet two of her offspring and she stamped them with her attitude. Since I bought him as a weanling it was very nice to see a half sibling that was under saddle and doing the job I wanted mine to do. It was definitely the deciding factor for me. Now that he’s three, I really see his dam in him. He’s practically a clone of her.
I have a mare as well, that I have met a couple of half siblings too, out of the same dam. My mare is very much a clone of her dams temperament and conformation. Honestly, her half siblings have traits that come from their sires that I don’t see in my mare. To put it nicely, I think the other stallions were better crosses than my mares sire. She’s lovely, but she has room for improvement and her dam nicked better with the other crosses.
I had full siblings.
Dam was a lovely QH and stallion is Connemara Maplehurst Michael MacDaire from Elphin Mountain Connemaras in Elphin Ontario.
I got Elphin Andromeda as a yearling in 2000. She was chestnut turning grey. Sadly she fractured her ulna in a pasture accident as a rising 3 yr old and had a long recovery. She finished at a solid 15hh.
I did back her when she was 4, but she did not stay sound enough for a lot of ring work. She was good to hack. She had a lot of laminitis flare-ups, leftover from her broken leg/stall rest. We managed it quite well for 10 years, but euthed her 3 years ago.
Her full brother Elphin Callisto came to me as a 4 yr old in 2004. He is chestnut and quite a lot finer than his sister and finished at 14.2.
I got him as she had the perfect temperament for me but he does not have her calm quiet personality. He has a big horse-sized stride.
He did well at 1st level but was spooky and dumped me so many times that I never really did much else with him except hack. I still have him…he is 18.
A friend of mine bought a sibling of her Morgan mare because the first mare was so great. She ended up selling the sister as it was not at all suitable for her.
Fascinating to me. I would LOVE another Wanderbursch II - my big chestnut guy was da bomb. Half sibling would be fine. I’ve heard they are all pretty consistent in temperment and movement providing they are out of a mare of the same breed (Hann). Hard to find though.
I’ve ridden four generations of one of my geldings, and three generations (different line) of another, along with various other relatives (uncles, cousins, for instance). For the four generations one (I’ve ridden members of both the maternal and paternal sides of the family), they’ve all had great-grand daddy’s kind, friendly temperament, with very similar builds – although plus or minus a couple inches on the height, and varying colors dues to his dilute color genetics – and his same head, eye, and expression, plus similarly wonderful canters. No one would doubt that they were relatives.
But they differed slightly in how much they tended to anticipate, the degree of work ethic (no duds, but some were more of a volunteer type while others waited to be asked, then cheerfully cooperated), and in other gaits.
For the other gelding, his maternal great-grandfather had been the result of a brother/sister mating (not by me), with the next two generations greatly resembling the GGF (who produced a large number of offspring). But my mare, who followed the family tradition of being an obvious descendant of her dad and grand-dad, produced offspring that resembled their respective sires, not her nor their maternal grandmother, in their appearance and in gaits.
Temperament-wise, they were (are) kind, sweet horses, but without what I consider her paternal lines no-nonsense, workmanlike tendencies (she couldn’t be drilled, for instance, if she did something correctly once or twice, it was time to move on to something else, then come back to it later).
The gelding from this mare that I still own is the spitting image of the paternal side of his family, to the point that, when I took him to a clinic when he had only been under saddle a few weeks, the clinician – a BNR familiar with bloodlines – knew his breeding when he stepped off the trailer and called him a clone. The photos and videos of paternal relatives that I saw bore this out.
I’ve enjoyed seeing the similarities and noticing the differences in the relatives I’ve ridden (several of which I’ve owned), and I think my personal knowledge of, and experience with, their families has helped me understand my horses better.
My sister with the exact same parents looks nothing like me…LOL so I am thinking it happens with horses too.
There are 5 full siblings to my mare but I can’t find any videos to compare to my girl. It’s too bad, I’d love to see similarities.
I have learned from posts both here and FB that the mares from her sire tend to be spicy and it seems that the geldings are more chill. That, I entirely agree with as my mare keeps me on my toes and often dreaming of seatbelt designs for my saddle.
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