Helgstrand, Parra, blue tongues - the list just keeps growing

[Lunabear1988]

Yes, exactly. You said it so much better than I did!

[Lunabear1988]

Yeah I get that! I do think she meant it in more of an encouraging way. And I would not hesitate to show under her again or anything.

But there is something discouraging about it. I get pretty nervous about showing. And my horse can be a bit spooky. So when we rode in there(after me telling him what a rockstar he would be in the warm up) and he poofed up and we put down a very professional and accurate test in our dressage saddle to be told we should switch disciplines was unexpected to me. I don’t know.

I guess there’s part of me that wishes we could be judged the same way Western dressage is judged but in traditional tack. I just don’t understand why not?

Or I also don’t really have a problem just going on our merry way getting scores in the 60’s for accuracy. But I don’t love showing much either way.

It’s also possible that I don’t fully understand Western Dressage and maybe learning more about it would answer my questions. I will do so more digging into it for knowledge sake but either way I’m not converting! I’m hanging onto my dressage saddle I converted from Western too long ago and don’t wish to go back anymore.

Edited to correct some pretty silly errors that talk to text did!

[barnesthenoble]

@Lunabear1988

we put down a very professional and accurate test in our dressage saddle to be told we should switch disciplines was unexpected to me. I don’t know.

I would also have been discouraged. I understand the sentiment behind it, but I personally wouldn’t find it encouraging. “Well if you invest in wholly new tack and equipment, learn completely different tests, and possibly need to find a new trainer, you’ll do awesome!”

Like…okay? Maybe if that’s what I wanted to do, I’d already be doing it. Perhaps it’s just a sore spot for me as I’ve felt pretty well alienated by dressage for awhile now.

[jvanrens]

@Knights_Mom

@endlessclimb

also… A grazing bit is a curb, but with the shanks angled back so the horse can get his mouth to the ground.

This is not a curb

Late to this party, but it is definitely a curb bit. Any bit with shanks is a curb.

[Lunabear1988]

Yeah I guess that’s it. I know she was just like wow what a good young horse and a rider putting in their all! I got that she just meant that we would really be rewarded for that in Western Dressage. But yeah, I don’t really want to switch all that… And I don’t think my horse was unhappy during regular dressage or anything. It makes him BETTER.

[atl_hunter]

Actually, that is not the “standard” nor is it required. I ride my horse in a loose ring snaffle. We’ve won multiple world championship titles in WD.

Also, the primary reason for the growth is the affordable simplicity and accessibility. You can earn awards from online shows and can even compete in the International show via online submission. And the scores are softer (as in 10 points softer). For example, I received an 81.75 on my first ever live dressage test, and it was at the world show. In comparison, with a pro my horse was scoring 71-73 at USDF shows. She was also scoring in the same ballpark as me in the WDAA open.

[pluvinel]

@atr

In this case, its pretty obvious that this judge thinks it is about competition and winning things, and that she assumes that what everyone else is about is winning things and that they will tailor their activities to that end. So the advice she was giving you was based on the fact that she thought that you must be all about winning things too.

I see no problem with wanting to compete win. I do see a problem with a judge who tells a competitor that everything she did was correct “training-wise”…but she was not competitive because her horse did not have some sort of preferred leg action. Dressage is about training…so judge the training.

And THAT is the problem…the focus on a horse’s way of trotting and cantering vs its training. And the goal to artificially produce that movement gets us to where we are today.

[Annie_Burton]

@Kyrabee

I don’t get the two handed riding with a shanked bit…mostly curbs…either. I was always taught (40 years ago?) that a curb was the next step in a trained horse and was strictly for one handed riding.

^^ THIS ^^

The curb was invented for one-handed riding. Holding the reins in a 3:1 pattern with the snaffle bit is an option to allow bending correctly. Otherwise, the curb should not be used to bend a horse.

[Lunabear1988]

Totally agree! That’s how I felt. And to be fair she gave me a 70 percent so it’s not that I have sour grapes or anything. It was I was told we were doing everything correct but should still go play somewhere else if we wanted it to be appreciated.

And your last point is exactly how I feel. That it being so much about the gaits doesn’t lead Dressage to a great place… Hence the whole thread. Thank you, great point.

[alicen]

@Knights_Mom

Horse people can no longer fix this. The general public has to fix it via their outrage in overwhelming numbers.

What does the general public know about dressage?

[Knights_Mom]

@jvanrens

@Knights_Mom

@endlessclimb

also… A grazing bit is a curb, but with the shanks angled back so the horse can get his mouth to the ground.

This is not a curb

Late to this party, but it is definitely a curb bit. Any bit with shanks is a curb.

Long shanked snaffle. Not a curb.

[Ghazzu]

Still a legerage bit, and therefore a curb by definition.
The joint in the mouthpiece doesn’t change that.

[Knights_Mom]

@alicen

@Knights_Mom

Horse people can no longer fix this. The general public has to fix it via their outrage in overwhelming numbers.

What does the general public know about dressage?

Nothing. They know nothing about dressage.Thats not the point. When the public gets angry about something dealing with perceived animal cruelty they go militant and pressure from sponsors, bad press etc makes things change. As in no more circus animals.

[Cowgirl]

Congratulations on the 70%!!!

[Lunabear1988]

These were just schooling shows ha ha but thank you! Not bad for a nervous ammy on a 4 year old though. I was just happy we kept all feet on the ground and stayed in the ring. But we tried our hearts out.

[MsM]

My information was that any shanked bit that used a strap or chain under the chin is some kind of curb bit

[endlessclimb]

Anything with a fixed mouthpiece and leverage is some kind of curb. I think the only bit that it’s kind of weird for is a kimberwick, but that’s just because the cheek looks like a D. It would be the exact same bit if it was a super short shank though, and it clearly has leverage.

A sliding mouthpiece with leverage is a gag.

Mouthpiece designations are something totally different.

[DawnJL]

@endlessclimb

Anything with a fixed mouthpiece and leverage is some kind of curb. I think the only bit that it’s kind of weird for is a kimberwick, but that’s just because the cheek looks like a D. It would be the exact same bit if it was a super short shank though, and it clearly has leverage.

A sliding mouthpiece with leverage is a gag.

Mouthpiece designations are something totally different.

Exactly.

Here’s one blog post which describes the incorrect terminology of curb bits with broken mouthpieces as “snaffles”.

Bits 101: 10 Common Bit Myths Busted | Equestrian Writer

Some people have encountered the incorrect “shanked snaffle” terminology within certain discipline cultures, but those bits are still functionally curb bits with leverage.

[jvanrens]

In the western discipline, they are called shanked snaffles to distinguish them from a ported curb, but that doesn’t mean they are not a curb bit.

[blue_heron]

Oh my God. And yet here you are arguing with professionals about training the upper level dressage horse.