https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV5nGeBcpyQ
You guys need to see what real hunt horses are like, and what real hunting is like. Then ask if the current standard for show hunters is any more real than Western Pleasure.
I’ve been riding show hunters since 1976 and it’s never been field hunting and personally I don’t want it to be. Did we ride over more solid jumps and on outside courses? Yes but it still wasn’t this and if I wanted to hunt in the field I would. I’m not supporting drugged drone hunters either. I would like to see changes in our discipline but I like the goals of even pace, pretty mover, beautiful bascule and perfect lead changes which are generally not seen in the hunt field. Everytime we have a hunt team class at indoors you can tell the horses are fried from being in the Show horse environment. I honestly don’t know what the answer is but having our show horses go around like field hunters is not it.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;8342450]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV5nGeBcpyQ
You guys need to see what real hunt horses are like, and what real hunting is like. Then ask if the current standard for show hunters is any more real than Western Pleasure.[/QUOTE]
Two totally different things.
The things I’ve jumped over in the hunt field down in Virginia look more like things on X-C at a horse trial than anything else.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;8342450]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV5nGeBcpyQ
You guys need to see what real hunt horses are like, and what real hunting is like. Then ask if the current standard for show hunters is any more real than Western Pleasure.[/QUOTE]
Was that WFP I saw? It looked like a fun day of hunting except for the oncoming car on the road at one point. :eek: Since it was 2013 was that a drag hunt or have the Brits managed to find a loophole to hunt live?
[QUOTE=vineyridge;8342450]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV5nGeBcpyQ
You guys need to see what real hunt horses are like, and what real hunting is like. Then ask if the current standard for show hunters is any more real than Western Pleasure.[/QUOTE]
Who said show hunters is supposed to be simulated indoor field hunting? 
This is taken right out of the USEF Hunter Judges Clinic workbook:
"The attributes of a good field hunter have become the foundation blocks of how we created a format to critique the show hunter today. Athleticism and style are rewarded, while poor form and potentially dangerous technique are given a lower score.
While I agree, and wish we could open up the courses more and let some of the horses get up on a good hand gallop around course, it isn’t always possible due to venues and ring size. It has been wonderful watching the Hunter Derbies we used to compete in in the 1980’s make a come back and help bring show hunters back to its roots, but the sport of show hunters is never going to be able to accurately simulate field hunting.
Yes, show hunters has become so very different from hunters who hunt that there is no comparison, even if they share the same roots. I just wish that the discipline now performed by show hunters would change its name to something that describes what the horses are actually doing, which seem to me to bear no relation to what foxhunters do. I’d propose that the new name be Jumping Dressage. Named jumping dressage, the discipline might have a better change of becoming international.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;8342921]
Yes, show hunters has become so very different from hunters who hunt that there is no comparison, even if they share the same roots. I just wish that the discipline now performed by show hunters would change its name to something that describes what the horses are actually doing, which seem to me to bear no relation to what foxhunters do. I’d propose that the new name be Jumping Dressage. Named jumping dressage, the discipline might have a better change of becoming international.[/QUOTE]
I’m sorry but changing the name? Seriously? Do show hunters offend you or something? If it’s the recent drug infractions, etc. then don’t deny there’s a dark side to every sport, every industry, but I’m an optimistic person who appreciates good horseflesh.
A good foxhunter is brave, safe, athletic, listens to their rider. A good show hunter is no different, they just do it in a different atmosphere. There are still horses out there who can and do do double duty.
Thank you, GoodTimes. I want my hunter to go in the field like she goes in the arena. Rhythmic, balanced, patient, calm, brave and quiet to her fences and jump in good form. The show barn where I take lessons has a big handful of field hunters among its clients. The schooling is the same for both types of horses. The field hunters aren’t expected to do flying changes or necessarily get the step, and the show horses don’t have to cross creeks. Otherwise, the same type of performance is expected.
The few years I had the privilege of hunting a show quality horse was a real treat.
How is it jumping dressage OP? I don’t get that at all. I think we are still meeting the guidelines for our sport… it would just be nice to get the drugs out of it as much as possible and then it could be a fair playing field. I also don’t care if it’s international although technically it already is unless people believe Canada is another state. LOL
Lots of people seem to really dislike the hunters and prefer show jumping but it was my first discipline and it will be my last. To each their own.
It’s jumping dressage because the horse is judged on the same qualities as a dressage horse is judged: gaits, accuracy, rideability, submission/temperament, the ability to perform a set test with a certain look and in a certain way without mistakes; little or no freedom for rider improvisation within the test; and the subjective nature of quality. Rhythm and impulsion are fundamental to each discipline’s subjective judging; and certain elements of the test–lead changes, number of steps/strides, etc.–must be correctly performed. Way of going is all important. The ability to return the horse as invisibly as possible to the test demands after a mistake is also fundamental. Equipment is regulated in both disciplines.
In dressage use of the aids is supposed to be close to invisible; that’s also the case in hunters. By that I mean that the horse is supposed to do its job without obvious rider control/interference.
Regardless of the ensuing discussion, thank you for posting the links, vineyridge. Even some of us staid dressage types appreciate seeing what for us are “those thrilling days from yesteryear”.
